Brian seems pretty passionate about his beliefs and I support what he says. There is no harm in disagreement unless we use it to belittle one another.
I think most inclusionist are pretty caring people. They want others to have the opportunity to enjoy the great outdoors. Yet, is the issue REALLY about inclusion or simply 'choice'. It's really not the same.
Bowhunting (without crossbows) are inclusionist seasons. They are open to all and 35 years ago states offered compound bow legalization as a way to get more inclusion. I think it worked very well...don't you?
Choice on the other hand is based on a belief that if you don't want to hunt as the state restrictions dictate...that you change the rules to your favor. That's pretty wicked because the core belief of the movement is a pretty sinister concept to the sport of bowhunting. There will always be more people who desire to hunt with something besides a bow....than those who do. It's really not about crossbows, but rather an ideology of change that not only can, but will go eventually far beyond just the crossbow efforts.
Posts: 110 | From: Union Ms | Registered: Jul 2003
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Just an update, Crossbow passed in PA today with a 4-3 vote they added a sunset provision to 2012 wich means they have to vote again in 2012 allow crossbows after this date. This will give them time to gather data to see what if any impact crossbows have on the deer heard.
Posts: 83 | From: Pennsylvania | Registered: Oct 2007
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The link discussing this was pulled from the Leatherwall for some reason. I will say it again: the NRA has trouble distinguishing an assault rifle from a hunting rifle. Now they are having trouble telling the difference between the crossbow and real bows. They are a political lobbying group which works for manufacturing interests first and foremost, under the guise of "protecting our 2nd amendment rights". Hunters'interests are a distant concern. They court us for our money & support. I will never be a member of an organization this dishonest.
-------------------- NYB Life Member Compton's Life Member TGMM Family of the Bow Posts: 1894 | From: Upstate NY | Registered: Apr 2004
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Why wouldn't the NRA support crossbow use for everyone in archery seasons? Few archers want this. The non-bowhunting gun hunters would benefit the most from allowing crossbow use in archery only seasons. The NRA would shine like gold for getting this for their members. This is a greater threat to bowhunters than PETA is.
Posts: 226 | From: NY | Registered: Mar 2005
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quote:This is a greater threat to bowhunters than PETA is.
A group whose agenda is to end ALL hunting - starting with and including bowhunting - is the lessor threat??????????????????
Posts: 1147 | From: Central NY | Registered: Mar 2003
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I will keep my NRA Membership and if Vermonster starts up "League for the Protection of Bowhunting" I'll be one of the first to join. I will also tell any organization of which I am a member when I believe they stray from the path I signed up for. The NRA is absolutely necessary (in my mind) as a voice for all of us archers and gun owner alike.
The National Rifle Association does far and away more good for us than harm. They are without doubt one of the loudest voices in Washington and in the current climate absolutely necessary
-------------------- The American system of democracy will prevail until that moment when politicians discover that they can bribe the electorate with their own money Posts: 4498 | From: San Luis Obispo, California | Registered: Mar 2009
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The National RIFLE Association, of which I have been a Life Member of for nearly 2 decades, should stay away from bowhunting issues, and leave it to the State organizations. Does Pope and Young or PBS get involved with firearms issues? State issues should be handled within the State. They shellshocked the PGC with their pro-crossbow rhetoric just 4 days before the vote. Now look at where PA is with the crossbow? When is anyone going to realize that it is all about the money, not the disabled, the youth, the female, the wounded Vet, or the elderly bowhunter. They want it in the archery season to get the firearms hunter, connect the dots!!!!
-------------------- Vice President Life Member New York Bowhunters, Inc. All the best to you and yours >>>>------------------------> Posts: 1103 | From: New York | Registered: May 2003
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You right on the mark about that AL,the NRA cost themselves a member speaking for myself.
Posts: 145 | From: Tomah Wi. 54660 | Registered: Sep 2003
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Money money money. I was a member of NRA for years, but the last time I signed up they spent all the money I sent them, sending me more letters trying to get me to send them more money. Nevermore. This is the final straw for me.
-------------------- Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.- Ben Franklin Posts: 2390 | From: New Albany, MS | Registered: Jul 2008
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we must remember as stated in earlier posts....as BOW HUNTERS we are not against crossbows but we ARE against them in archery season......they should be called crossguns as they shoot a bolt, not an arrow.......not many DNR's seem to care though, and at least here in NC no matter how hard we fight to keep archery seasons only for hand held, hand drawn bows, the bottom line is.... who has the most money to influence legislators seems to be who is winning the fight.....
-------------------- NCBA Life Member Compton Member Carolina Traditinal Archers Bowhunter Education Instructor Posts: 976 | From: Vale, NC | Registered: Mar 2004
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If it weren't for the NRA we could be talking about hunting in past tense, although every hunting organization has things about it we might disagree with, they do waaaay more good for us than bad. Not supporting groups like the NRA is foolish if you are a hunter. Posts: 277 | From: New Brunswick Canada | Registered: Feb 2010
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I rarely post, but feel the need to weigh in. The NRA, warts and all, is the top voice of American Gunners and Hunters. As for Crossbows in Archery season, I can't see what difference it makes one way or another. This precious connection that some place on their weapon choice is insular and irrelevant thinking. The hunting collective has always been its own worst enemy. Division amongst the ranks regarding methods (baiting, dogs, etc.), choice of weapon, and refusal to stand as in an absolutist fashion has been hunting's Achilles' heel. That some gun-owners actually support the "assault weapons" ban is appalling. To know that hunters have actually supported baiting bans is disgusting. To buy in to any gun control advocacy rhetoric or animal-rights agenda is to advance their incremental ploy to ULTIMATELY end ALL gun ownership and animal use.
Posts: 209 | From: Illinois | Registered: Oct 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Mike Tomano: I rarely post, but feel the need to weigh in. The NRA, warts and all, is the top voice of American Gunners and Hunters. As for Crossbows in Archery season, I can't see what difference it makes one way or another. This precious connection that some place on their weapon choice is insular and irrelevant thinking. The hunting collective has always been its own worst enemy. Division amongst the ranks regarding methods (baiting, dogs, etc.), choice of weapon, and refusal to stand as in an absolutist fashion has been hunting's Achilles' heel. That some gun-owners actually support the "assault weapons" ban is appalling. To know that hunters have actually supported baiting bans is disgusting. To buy in to any gun control advocacy rhetoric or animal-rights agenda is to advance their incremental ploy to ULTIMATELY end ALL gun ownership and animal use.
Well said brother, as hunters we need to look at the big picture
Posts: 277 | From: New Brunswick Canada | Registered: Feb 2010
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So with that mentality in mind, here's a scenario that occurs across the country. Decide for yourself what to call this person. Sitting in full camo, in a box blind, overlooking a bait pile, in a 40 acre enclosure, bottle fed, hand raised deer, "guides" knowing where they are every second of the day. This is a hunter I guess. According to what you stated, we cannot be divided amongst ourselves by thinking differently. So this person is a hunter, not an opportunistic wannabe.
Maybe the NRA should contact the State organizations before pressing their will upon the masses. Like I stated in an earlier post, I have been a Life Member of the NRA for 2 decades, and I think they should stick the RIFLE part of their moniker, and the archery seasons to those who know more than they think they do!
-------------------- Vice President Life Member New York Bowhunters, Inc. All the best to you and yours >>>>------------------------> Posts: 1103 | From: New York | Registered: May 2003
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Extreme opinions on either side of this issue will always exist and rarely are those minds changed and that's OK. For me personally I believe archery must be maintained in the bow season and I also believe that the closer I can behave as a natural human predator the higher quality hunt I will achieve and somewhere in this equation the hunter must have constraints to achieve balance.
Posts: 956 | From: Cambridge, Wisconsin | Registered: Jan 2007
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I'll be one of the first to join. I will also tell any organization of which I am a member when I believe they stray from the path I signed up for. The NRA is absolutely necessary (in my mind) as a voice for all of us archers and gun owner alike.![[Confused]](confused.gif)
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