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» Trad Gang.com » Main Forums » Hunting Legislation & Policies » Crossguns in PA (Page 4)

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Author Topic: Crossguns in PA
Traditional-Archer
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Really you guys are worried about crossbows in the archery season how funny.
If you guys haven’t heard I will let you know now, we have guns in the archery season here in PA. You can hunt with an inline muzzleloader, which is nothing less than a high powered rifle that can reach out there to over 200 yards, and if you are a youth hunter or a senior you can use a rifle all together. Crossbows are not my biggest problem, if it was not for a crossbow my friend that was hurt in a car accident wouldn't be able to hunt with us guys anymore, being he is restrained to a wheelchair for the rest of his life. The crossbow probable saved his life and gave him purpose. [pray]

And any TradGang Administrator that thinks he speaks for all Tradgangers well that just wrong. I am a Tradganger and I know a few of our members as well. I don’t think just because I shoot a recurve I’m better or more traditional than someone that shoots a crossbow. Crossbows have been around as long as longbows. If it wasn’t for taking so long to load a crossbow, the longbow probably would have been look at as an inferior weapon in the medieval times. [archer2]

I do believe the state of PA should have limited the use of the crossbow to the two week period like the inline and the rifle for youth and seniors. As far as the commitment to shooting the bow, too each his own, I know a lot of Traditional shooters that I don’t think should have any business in the woods with a bow. And some of the guys out there shooting compound should not even think about hunting with a bow. I shoot two three times a week and sometimes every day because I love to shoot, does that make me a judge of some kind?
I just think if you want to have an impact on this awesome sport of hunting with a traditional bow then lead by example practice shooting the best you can and you might win some guys and girls into trying it the hard way. [banghead]

I have had compound shooters leave the archery rang because I was outshooting them on the course, I have friends that have went back to traditional gear after hunting with me for a few years and seeing that you can shoot a traditional bow accurately and harvest game year after year. [dunno]
I am not the judge of others, to stress myself over legal hunters taking to the woods carrying a crossbow is time well wasted, I would much rather take that time to pray to my God to release the stress of my fellow Tradgangers and let them feel the wind on their faces hear the crackle of the camp fire and see the whole forest and not just the trees.
T.A [campfire]

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We are what we do repeatedly. Execellence is, therefore, not an act but a habit.

Artistole (384-322 B.C.)
Philosopher

Posts: 725 | From: Columbia,PA | Registered: Jan 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Rob DiStefano
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quote:
Originally posted by Traditional-Archer:
Really you guys are worried about crossbows in the archery season how funny.

If you guys haven’t heard I will let you know now, we have guns in the archery season here in PA. You can hunt with an inline muzzleloader, which is nothing less than a high powered rifle that can reach out there to over 200 yards, and if you are a youth hunter or a senior you can use a rifle all together.

ANY firearm during archery-only season is just plain STUPID.

Crossbows are not my biggest problem, if it was not for a crossbow my friend that was hurt in a car accident wouldn't be able to hunt with us guys anymore, being he is restrained to a wheelchair for the rest of his life. The crossbow probable saved his life and gave him purpose. [pray]

THAT (disability) is always a rule exception. no argument there.

And any TradGang Administrator that thinks he speaks for all Tradgangers well that just wrong.

please don't twist words or start rumors. it's a fact that NO ONE has stated what you just typed - that would be as stupid as crossguns in archery season.

what *I* said was that "trad gang" - meaning the administration of said forum website - does not recognize crossbows as archery bows, nor crossguns during archery season. what each member thinks is their own business, not mine nor yours.


I am a Tradganger and I know a few of our members as well. I don’t think just because I shoot a recurve I’m better or more traditional than someone that shoots a crossbow. Crossbows have been around as long as longbows. If it wasn’t for taking so long to load a crossbow, the longbow probably would have been look at as an inferior weapon in the medieval times. [archer2]

sir, no one could care less about what weapon is better than any other - that, too, would be stupid to even discuss. i have an appreciation for crossbows, my dad made them, good ones.

these are the two main things under discussion ...

[1] archery bows and crossbows are TOTALLY different weapons because one is loaded and released within seconds whilst the other is preloaded and can be released hours later. this is a MAJOR difference 'tween these weapons and why a crossbow becomes a crossgun during hunting season.

[2] since a crossbow is a crossgun, it doesn't belong in an archery only season.


I do believe the state of PA should have limited the use of the crossbow to the two week period like the inline and the rifle for youth and seniors. As far as the commitment to shooting the bow, too each his own, I know a lot of Traditional shooters that I don’t think should have any business in the woods with a bow. And some of the guys out there shooting compound should not even think about hunting with a bow. I shoot two three times a week and sometimes every day because I love to shoot, does that make me a judge of some kind?

absolutely - going afield with any weapon doesn't mean you know what yer doing or that your intentions are ethical.

I just think if you want to have an impact on this awesome sport of hunting with a traditional bow then lead by example practice shooting the best you can and you might win some guys and girls into trying it the hard way. [banghead]

very true. i give presentations, demonstrations, and hold archery tackle seminars with scout kids. TANJ is one of the largest supporters (with both time AND money) for the education of kids and archery and bowhunting, perhaps in the nor'east.

www.tradnj.com

we lead by example.


I have had compound shooters leave the archery rang because I was outshooting them on the course, I have friends that have went back to traditional gear after hunting with me for a few years and seeing that you can shoot a traditional bow accurately and harvest game year after year. [dunno]
I am not the judge of others, to stress myself over legal hunters taking to the woods carrying a crossbow is time well wasted, I would much rather take that time to pray to my God to release the stress of my fellow Tradgangers and let them feel the wind on their faces hear the crackle of the camp fire and see the whole forest and not just the trees.
T.A [campfire]

to each their own. life is short, make the most of it for yourself and humanity. [campfire]




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Traditional-Archer
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Mr. DiStefano this is what I read. when someone says we don't that means all.

quote:
BUT, i do NOT want anyone reading through trad gang posts to think WE (trad gang) endorse crossgun hunting during archery season. we don't.
That is OK it is just a misunderstanding of that statement, If it were personal I wouldn't want any other tool or weapon being used in any season other than a recurve or a longbow. But I might be looked at as an elitists we couldn't have that now. LOL everyone needs to blow steam sometimes Rob, its good we here at the Gang have broad shoulders. I am always tolerant of other people’s positions unless it’s not how I position my beliefs. LOL
I think you helped me with getting supplies for our troop if I remember correctly, all 26 boys made their own longbow and arrows, how cool is that. Anyway thanks for your support of our Boy Scouts and your support her on the TradGang.
[thumbsup]

--------------------
We are what we do repeatedly. Execellence is, therefore, not an act but a habit.

Artistole (384-322 B.C.)
Philosopher

Posts: 725 | From: Columbia,PA | Registered: Jan 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Rob DiStefano
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quote:
Originally posted by Traditional-Archer:
Mr. DiStefano this is what I read. when someone says we don't that means all.

quote:
BUT, i do NOT want anyone reading through trad gang posts to think WE (trad gang) endorse crossgun hunting during archery season. we don't.
That is OK it is just a misunderstanding of that statement, If it were personal I wouldn't want any other tool or weapon being used in any season other than a recurve or a longbow. But I might be looked at as an elitists we couldn't have that now. LOL everyone needs to blow steam sometimes Rob, its good we here at the Gang have broad shoulders. I am always tolerant of other people’s positions unless it’s not how I position my beliefs. LOL
I think you helped me with getting supplies for our troop if I remember correctly, all 26 boys made their own longbow and arrows, how cool is that. Anyway thanks for your support of our Boy Scouts and your support her on the TradGang.
[thumbsup]

it's all good, bruce. if we had a face-to-face talk over coffee or a few beers, we'd probably come to the conclusion that we're both on the same page in terms of the promotion and use of traditional archery in all its forms. [wavey] [campfire]

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Bonebuster
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Michigan allowed "full inclusion" of Crossbows several years ago now.

To say that it has changed our archery season is an understatement.

Bowhunting is what I do, and my year revolves around it. In 2014, I travelled around and hunted throughout Michigan, spending time hunting in the S.E. Lower Penninsula, the N.W. Lower, the North Central Lower, and the North East Lower. All of my hunting was on public land. I ran across LOTS of "Bowhunters". I didn`t keep track of exact numbers, but it was in the hundreds. In all the other "bowhunters" I came across while hunting, only ONE was using a conventional compound bow. Read that again...ONE.

My observation has been this...Crossbows are used almost exclusively by everyone I encountered on public land in 2014. "Bowhunter" numbers are up despite claims by the DNR that they are down. And our deer populations are a mere shadow of the mid 2000`s. (and deer numbers in 2005 were down from years before).

Whenever I felt comfortable I asked WHY the other hunters chose a crossgun and if they are new to bowhunting.

In EVERY instance they responded that they were compound converts, and the reason they chose crossguns is because of the "extended range" and the ease of use.

EVERYONE claims crossguns are no more effective than compounds and this statement is TOTALLY false! Totally!

The DNR claims Crossguns are used by a small percentage of "bowhunters"...this is a total falsehood. By my observance, and that of most everyone else, crossguns are used by as much as 90% of the "bowhunters" here in Michigan.

If it weren`t for the fact that the Michigan DNR seems intent on the eradication of deer in Michigan, the crossgun success rate would certainly be an issue.

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pavan
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The local politicians that are bed with the crossgun lobby here defend the motion with the "they should have their place just like you." What are they a different species? The reality is from some that I have witnessed, that claim to have sore shoulders so they have to use crossguns, is that during the gun season they are the worst of the worst for trespassing flying around like they are nuts chasing deer with their pickups and taking every short cut that they can. Another crossgunner went so far as to put up illegal wood tree stands that were barely nailed in, so anyone that was invading HIS turf on public land would fall when the stand gave out. I knocked them down, took the wood home and burned it. For those that claim that we all have to get along because we are all hunters, BULL, those that I have witnessed except for one elderly gentleman are all slobs and have no business hunting anything with anything.

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Pavan

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Ron Vought
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paven -

Well said. We are seeing the same type of activity here in PA with gun hunting mentality. I think the crossgun inclusion may backfire on the PGC and bowhunters of PA. They are looking at the number of bucks being taken prior to the rut now by archery hunters and the crossgun is supposedly the main driver. Curious on how they will handle this from a deer management/biology standpoint...Will they shorten the season or exclude the crossguns. Only time will tell.

Ron

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Krex1010
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Ron.....I see that the PA game commission is going to lengthen the archery season in a few wmu's. I believe making bucks legal in the September portion of the season and adding a week to the end. Granted this will be in the wmu's that have high deer numbers and low public access. Is there genuine concern in the game commission about the archery season harvest? I'm on the record in this thread as not being against crossbows in general, I don't care if someone else takes a shortcut AS LONG as the practice doesnt significantly affect population numbers and result in shorter seasons. Where did you see the game commission is reviewing archery seasons? Id like to follow that closely. I'm not defending crossbows with this post.....I am just very interested in your comments about reviewing the archery harvest.

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Ron Vought
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When they implement something in the Special Regulations section in PA that means we are trying something to determine an outcome. Yes I did talk to someone that indicated to me that they are watching the impact the crossgun is having on the deer herd which I would expect them to do considering bowhunters are now being looked at as a deer management tool. Bowhunters of PA have never really been looked at as a deer management tool until the crossgun came along.

Ron

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Krex1010
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Well I would hope they do keep an eye on crossbow's effect on the overall deer harvest. As for bowhunters not being a management tool....maybe not across the state, but where I live, bowhunters are the only management tool, there are not many places a fellow can take a firearm legally around here and its been that way for the last 15-20 years.

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47@27 mad dog prairie predator
"You can't cheat the mountain pilgrim"

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Ron Vought
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I hope the PGC uses common sense by eliminating the crossgun from archery versus shortening the season if there becomes deer management issues.

Ron

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Krex1010
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i agree with you there Ron

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45@28 bear montana
47@27 mad dog prairie predator
"You can't cheat the mountain pilgrim"

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Greg Szalewski
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We just got the numbers on Wisconsin"s first xgun season.
vert. bows 54,810
xgun 26,891
That is 32.91% of the total bow harvest. Not a bad start. It did not make for a bigger take than last year though. Keep in mind that gun kill was down also.

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ChuckC
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Thanks Greg.
Some very important figures (to me) are not present. What percent success rate were enjoyed by both groups ? or at least, how many Xgun tags were sold vs how many bow tags were sold and we can do the math.
ChuckC

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papawoody
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Id like to know the tags sold vs. the hunter success. I for one hunt a very heavily hunted piece of Wisconsin public, and I had seen more guys with xguns, than I did deer! Having experienced the same area in the past, I thought I was in the shot gun season! Seeing the totals, are encouraging thou. If the numbers are higher next year, we have a fighting chance to let the sunset clause take affect.

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