WHITETAIL DEER: These shot placement pics are based on broadside animals, so take into consideration if the animal is quartering where to aim to cross through the middle of the animals vitals with the greatest margin of error.
BEHIND the shoulder is the best place to aim, which is above the elbow. This is the CENTER of the vitals and gives you the the greatest margin of error and the quickest cleanest kills.
Contrary to what is being tauted by some as of late, the shot and vitals of a whitetail are BEHIND the shoulder area on the chest cavity....not 'under the shoulder' area.
If the perfect center of the vitals were shot with an arrow, the ENTIRE front leg/shoulder could be removed with the arrow still in the center of the vitals.
There is NO reason, I repeat NO reason to AIM at the shoulder no matter what you read or hear.
This pic shows you the vitals ...and the yellow is circle is moved slighly forward for better viewing the rear of the vitals but the black circle and red line are still in the same place....dead center of the vitals.
-------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------- Debunking the myth of the "dead zone" in the chest...
quote:Originally posted by Guru: Been saying this for years....check it out...
HOGS: These shot placement pics are based on broadside animals, so take into consideration if the animal is quartering where to aim to cross through the middle of the animals vitals with the greatest margin of error.
Hog vitals are a bit more tricky as they are angled up a bit as they go back...the same double lung shot on a deer could result in a gut shot on a hog.
Low and tight is good...low and back aint...the same shot low and back(yellow circle) would double lung if it was high and back(pink circle).....so again I aim for the middle right over the elbow for the greatest margin of error on a broadside shot (orange circle).
I quit shooting hogs 'low and tight' after I lost one due to it being 3 inches back. I now aim as I suggested above(orange circle).
Same low and back on the deer would kill it(orange circle)....
Again...Low and tight is good...low and back aint...the same shot low and back(yellow circle) would double lung if it was high and back(orange circle).....so again I aim for the middle right over the elbow for the greatest margin of error on a broadside shot.
In this pic....the PINK circle gives you the greatest margin of error.
"I like to shoot them quartering away to avoid the shield".
I've tried to explain that this is not the case on a shielded boar....So at Solana I got pics of Michael's boar to add to the shot placements thread sticked at the top, so they can do the talking.
This is a pic of a shielded boar and the location of just how far back the shield goes and that you are not going to avoid the shield by shooting quartering away unless you shoot behind the rib cage, and that is a dicey shot.
Also, if you do shoot quartering away, your are actually increasing the thickness of the shield you have to pass through because you are making the shield thicker by the quartering away angle.
I am not condemning a quartering away shot with this post, I've shot plenty that way. I'm just making folks aware that you are not going to avoid the shield.....unless of course you shoot that little soft pocked in the clip posted on the shot placement thread...and that soft spot can be shot broadside as well.
quote:Originally posted by Guru: Been meaning to do this for a while, and since the seasons will be here before we know it, now is a great time to share some pix and personal experiences.
I'm no expert turkey hunter and certainly not a turkey biologist. But I have been chasing them for a while, and I pay attention and notice the details.
That being said, I'd just like to share some of what I've learned and hopefully help some others along the way.
I have a couple hunts, the shots, and the results to share through text and pictures.
A couple basics with turkeys...
- unlike deer and other four legged critters we persue, and turkey's vitals are at the top of their body, just under and right up against the backbone.
- it's about impossible to hit a turkey "too high", as you'll see in the pix to follow, everything that keeps a turkey alive is in the upper 1/3 of their body.
- like the boys from Double Bull used to say, "high they die, low they go".
- on a broadside bird, I aim to hit a gobbler just in front of the thigh and high. A little high and you sever the backbone, a bit forward and you hit the front of the vitals just behind the wingbutt. If it's a bit back, you shoot throught the thighs, a shot some archers prefer anyway. Just remember, higher is better and in some pix to follow, you clearly see why.
-a shot from the back gives you an even bigger target. A centered hit anywhere from the back of the skull to the base of the tail will almost always anchor the bird on the spot. Slightly off the spine either side still has a chance of punching vitals.
- on quartering shots,remember to adjust where you want your arrow to enter. Further forward on quartering toward, and further back on quartering away. But again, always keep it high!
- don't worry about shooting through your turkey. Turkeys have very hard bones and tough feather quills. I perfer not to add anykind of "stopper" behind a broadhead. Let the blades do the job they were meant to do!
First off, some great anatomy pix I pulled off the web that shows ,by a series of over lays, just how a turkey is put together...
Another good diagram that shows the bone structure really well... •
quote:Originally posted by Guru: Slightly quartering away shot...
The broadhead took the gobbler high, just in front of the thigh... •
And came out right behind the wing butt... •
Skinned out...this is once again where the arrow entered.The knife point(Chris Surtees' "Cutter") is on the wing butt. I've tried to outline as best I could about where the vitals, and entrails lay in the body. The heart, lungs, liver are in the front outlined section...
quote:Originally posted by Guru: Here is where you can see how a seemingly basketball size target gets small real quick!
With the breast meat taken away, entrance... •
Also not the chunk of thigh meat missing in the entrance pix..You can also see in these pix that the near leg was further forward when the arrow hit the gobbler.
Easy to see now why a low/forward shot, like you'd shoot a deer, will lead to nothing but frustation! Nothing there but meat, crop, and keel of the breast bone. Keep your shots high!!!
Now with the breast plate pulled away from it's normal position...you can see the the bh went in front of the liver, and into the heart/lung area further forward... • •
Here's the heart...you can see by the bloody tips on three of the four "hoses" attached to it. Those are the one's cut by the bh as it passed though.The biggest one, I cut to take the heart out for the pix, no blood on the cut.
quote:Originally posted by Guru: Thanx fellas, and I will move this into the shot placement thread.
Here's another bird from a couple years ago...
This gobbler came in right off the roost. Strutted right into the decoy and did a lap around "Floyd". As he came around the back side and quartered toward me at 8-9yds. I put the arrow right, tight behind the near wingbutt and it exited just in front of the opposite thigh(just the oppsite of the first bird I described earlier).
He only made it about 20yds., and when I got out of the blind this is what I found...
Immediate blood, it blew out the exit and hit "Floyd"... • •
How I found him, note the arrow just hanging out the off side exit hole... •
You can see, he didn't go far. He actually ran right at me in the blind after he was hit. I thought he was coming right in with me, but turned about 1 yd. from the blind. He actually left a couple spots of blood on the blind as he passed... •
No skinned pix of this one, but just imagine the same holes as the last gobbler pix. Just the arrow going through in the opposite direction.
Up next...A shot a lot of bowhunter prefer...The "through the thighs" shot...
quote:Originally posted by Guru: This is a bird that came in with a companion..shot was about 10yds, dead broadside.
Arrow hit a little further back than I wanted, but still high. At the shot he dropped with incapacitated legs, and managed to get about 20yds. away using his wings.
His partner hung around for a little while trying to figure out the decoy... •
Arrow entered high into the thigh, through the entrails and hip/spine, and out the other side same as it went in... •
Without the skin... • •
This shot worked just fine as the turkey wasn't going anywhere. But by the time his partner left five minutes later, I looked behind the blind and he was still alive. The bh had done a good job anchoring him, but since the shot was further back, through the intestines, it wasn't a shot that killed him quickly... •
You can see the liver, lungs, nor heart were touched by hitting too far back... •
This is a good shot, and I suppose if I'd broken his leg bone/s, I probably would have hit at least one femoral, and he'd have died quickly. But that didn't happen on this shot.
If I'd have hit just an inch or 2 further forward, it would have been over in seconds.
quote:Originally posted by Guru: Thanks again fellas...
This is another great pic that I've had for a while, just dug it out of an old file. Really shows the bone structure well...
The next gobbler is a good example of what happens when you break their back and get through the vitals...
This is the biggest gobbler I've killed to date with my bow. He came strutting into my dekes just before noon time(quitting time here in NY). I spotted him and a hen earlier from a hill, moved in as close as I dared and set up. Over an hour later as time was running out here he came, without uttering a peep!
Shot him quartering away, strutting, just before he reached my jake deke... •
As you can see he went nowhere, and was dead within seconds. A minute later his hen came in to see what was going on. She stayed around a minute, then just wandered off... •
I got out and snapped some pix of the set-up... • •
Just as he layed as I walked up to him... •
Entrance very high up and quartering down and in... •
BH just made it out the other side. The backbone took a lot of steam off the arrow... •
quote:Originally posted by Guru: "Hope springs eternal"...you bet buddy
Thank you guys, I'm glad I can help. It really is amazing how different turkeys are put together compared to most critters we usually hunt.
This next turkey is one I killed in Georgia with a friend. As you'll see in the video, he came in and circled around behind the decoy.
I shot as he quartered toward me. The Woodsman tipped woodie entered, up high, just in front of the wing butt. Went through heart, lungs, liver, and exited out the back of the opposite thigh... http://www.tradgang.com/videos/curtturkey.wmv
As you'll hear, my buuddy Germain was a little excited after the shot, he was flippin' out!I mean crazy!! I actually had to tell him to shut up as the bird was coming in...he was losing his mind with excitement!
Again, quartering angle doesn't really matter, front-to- back, back-to-front...the important thing is to keep your shots HIGH! In the upper 1/3 of the body and you'll be just fine.
One other thing about wing butt shots, I know it's a shot a lot of folks like. But my personal experience is that it's not reliable.
A direct hit on the butt of the wing, right on the ball and socket will lead to unpredictable results. That is, without a doubt, the hardest to penetrate spot on a turkey!
I shoot pretty substantial gear, and I have had two arrows stopped cold on direct hits. One with a WW tipped 600gr. woodie out of my 63# KS, and the other was a Snuffer tipped 580gr carbon out of my 58# KS.
It took me a while to learn for myself. When I started to bowhunt for turks it seemed thats where everyone reccommended shooting turkeys.
But now I really don't see the need to shoot for the wing butt, as the vast majority of the vitals are more rearward anyway.
Yes, you might break a wing, but I know for a fact that if your arrow stops right at the socket of the wing after breaking it, the gobbler can still easily get away!