Trad Gang
Topic Archives => How To - Resources => Topic started by: Charlie Lamb on June 10, 2009, 10:08:00 PM
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Recent discussions about bow weight and broadhead design made me smile and chuckle under my breath.
Wish I had a nickel for every time I've seen those discussions come up over the years.... I can always predict the outcome as well.
No consensus and no revelations.
In most of the broadhead design discussions the German made SilverFlame broadheads pop up as an option.
I find that interesting in that it's usually thrown right in with the 3 to1 ratio stuff as a top penetrator when it's design has not proven to be that efficient.
And I'm not knocking the SilverFlame either. I just think it's curious that it's super sharpness seems to put it in the same class as a 3 to 1 for penetration.
Now having said all that, let me throw a couple things out there that I've learned over the years.
Sharp is where it's at. It's what does the killing. It's what promotes penetration. It's what puts blood on the ground.
Getting your broadheads ultra sharp (regardless of design) is like adding pounds of draw to your bow. It was a pretty common saying "back in the day".
Since I see a lot of questions pop up every year about how to sharpen this broadhead and how to sharpen that one. Well, I've sure got an answer for anyone who thinks there broadhead sharpness is suspect or doubts their sharpening skills.
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:thumbsup: :notworthy:
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Interesting thoughts indeed.
There really is not substitute for a good sharp broadhead.
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Amen Charlie! Properly tuned arrow gets right there with sharpness of the broadhead when you are looking at overall penetration also...
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I like the ones that chime in once in a while about how they get their braodheads so sharp that it produces a wound channel that doesnt bleed. Sounds like a troll.
To piggyback here you always get the crowd that is all about shot placement too.
Id rather have the sharp broadhead as my means of decreasing my margin of error.
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Long ago (30 odd years) I purchased a jig that a friend suggested to me. It didn't take long to realize the value of that jig for both knives and broadheads.
Not only did the jig allow me to get my edges razor keen, but it did so with a minimum of metal removal and a complete consistency to the finished edge.
I also found that that consistency made for a very tough edge which was also easily touched up in the field.
Well that old jig finally gave up the ghost a couple of years ago and I've sure missed it... that is until the other day when I got my new KME sharpening system.
(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME1.jpg)
WOW!!! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :eek:
I've been working over every broadhead of every style I have and haven't found one I couldn't get a fine razor edge on in a jiffy.
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(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME2.jpg)
These plastic cases are perfect for keeping your sharpening stuff together and make road trips painless as well.
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:thumbsup:
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Have you tried it on three blade broadheads like the WW, Charlie?
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(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME7.jpg)
My first attempt was with my old reliable Magnus I. It sharpened up to freaky sharp too fast to satisfy my curiosity.
Even the triple thickness at the tip was a piece of cake... it usually requires a little extra work to sharpen fully. Magnus' great grind and the KME made it child's play.
(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME6.jpg)
A few passes with the coarse side of the diamond stone brought me to the edge and angle I like and a quick turn of the stone to the fine side and the wide blade was popping hairs like a barber's razor.
Since I use the Magnus I as a four blade I had to work over the bleeder blade as well.
(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME5.jpg)
The thin steel of replaceable bleeders always creates a problem for most bowhunters. Not with this system.
I went straight to work with the fine hone and in just a couple strokes had improved the factory grind DRAMATICALLY.
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Russ... KME's sharpeners are designed for the basic single blade or single blade with removeable bleeder.
Ron can fix you up with very nice stones for your three blade needs. All the stones with the knife sharpener and broadhead sharpener are first class and should last a very long time.
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Do you like the std stone kit or the diamond stone better? It looks as if you have one of each.
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My second experience was with a brand new Zwickey Eskimo. A fine broadhead (no doubt) the Zwickeys don't have the same refined grind from the factory.
The KME made short work of it anyway. On the first edge I used the broadhead sharpener and brought it to a fine polished edge in no time.
For the second edge I chose to try the Knife sharpening kit.
(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME3.jpg)
(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME4.jpg)
You couldn't tell the difference in the two edges and the knife sharpener worked just as fast and easy.
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David... I really like the Diamond stone for fast stock removal (coarse side) and the fine side does an excellent job of refining the edge.
Having said that I found the regular stones did just as well although a might slower in the initial stock removal. Minor difference.
You also have the advantage of going with much smoother stones if you chose the regular stones. The fine diamond is only so fine.
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Thanks Charlie, I appreciate your opinion as you're surely one of the sharpening gurus on here. So if you were to choose one (bang for the buck so to speak) the knife sharpener with the std stone is what you'd recommend for both knives and broadheads? I'd like a system that I could sharpen both on well, if that's possible.
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I like the idea of the KME clamp for holding the broadhead.
Having used a Lansky knife sharpener to do the same thing, the KME clamp would make the process even more efficient.
Also tried to use a plane iron sharpener to do broadheads. This wasn't a successful trial, though.
Who was your original kit made by, Charlie? Just out of curiosity.
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Eventually this post will find it's way to the product review forum, but I was so impressed by this system that I wanted to share it on Pow Wow.
The broadhead system is far and away better than my old jig. First off it has a roller on the bottom that prevents wear of the jig... my old jig was eventually ground away.
The second unique feature is the revolving head. You simple make a pass on one side and spin the head around to do the other side.
The jaws of the jig are unique as well. A simple push of a button and the jaws are released from the main body.
A nut and bolt tightens the jaws securely to the broadhead and the shape of the jaws easily aligns with the ferrule of the head.... the Magnus Stinger I sharpened was the exception to that and it was only a minor issue. I improved the edge of that "fresh out of the pack" dynamo immensely.
There is a separate set of jaws for doing straight edges like removable bleeder blades.
They are very easy to switch out with the broadhead jaws.
As a side note.... in my fervor to sharpen every conceivable edge I could lay my hands on, I did the heavy blades of my utility knife in the shop and even went as far as sharpening a single edge razor in an old box cutter I had laying around.
(that's right, I'm that anal!)
:D
Fast, even and oh so sharp!!! I'd have needed a much finer stone than I had available to make the razor like new, but I was impressed none the less.
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R.W. .... the old jig was called a "Razor Edge". I think that company is still around. I was considering getting another one and then I saw Ron's system and liked it better.
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I'll probably add more tomorrow. I didn't mention what KME will do for a knife edge.
:scared:
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Good stuff Charlie! I like the look of those KME sharpeners too. Thanks for the review.
On the penetration thoughts... I would also place a sharp broad head first. Good arrow flight second. Everything else distant third, fourth, etc.
I like Dr A's work and truly believe that for heavy boned dangerous game, you need a very heavy arrow added to the list - but still only after sharp point and clean flight.
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When these first came out, I noticed them and after a couple of long phone calls, I ordered one. I didn't get the diamond stones as I have great stones from my butcherin days. With those stones I need to use oil, and I am very anal about smells on my gear, espically petroleum smells. Do you need to use oil when using diamond stones?
The KME system is deffinately the way to go, for a razor sharp edge, I just want to loose the oil smell?????
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Tim... with the diamond hones you only need a few drops of water. Clean up is with soap and water.
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That is what I need to get then, Thanks Charlie!!!
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A KME has been on my list of must buys for sometime now. Once I get back an order will be place ASAP. Been hearing nothing but praise about them for sometime now.
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OK Charlie,
I got the KMG grinder...a little too bulky for camp! Darn, it's tough gettin' old and havin' trouble rememberin' the alphabet :) I do need a travel kit for my scary edge touch up though and that KME broadhead system looks real good. Thanks for the review...Doc
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v110/tippit/Knife%20Shop/IMG_2446.jpg)
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I may be buttin in, but I have to jump in and agree with Mr Lamb.
All you got to do is try it and you'll see that Ron has covered all of the bases on this thing. The roller, swivel head, ruber jaws, etc. Not to mention the use of long lasting quality materials and stones.
I sharpen a lot of knives and other things and can do it pretty well with stones alone, but sometimes a knife or tool just needs to be put back on the exact angle. That's where the KME really shines. I personally like to get my primary angle first and then bump the angle up a degree or so and use the finer stones to put a finishing touch on the absolute edge with just a few strokes, maybe two or three on each side. The KME allows you to alternate the strokes very easily and that will work the burr down evenly.
I suspect a lot of knives and broadheads arent as sharp as they should be because of several things, but the main thing being that we are lazy. Some of us just dont want to go to that much trouble. The KME removes that excuse.
Lin Rhea
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David... Sorry I missed your post last night. If I only could have one I'd chose the knife sharpening system with the standard stones.
Like you said, most bang for your buck.
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The KME is the best Shaperner I've used & I'm not looking for another!! (grin) Nothing like a razor sharp broadhead or knife!!
I think I'll stay outa the arrow thing!!!! (grin)
ElkNut1
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Lin... you're not buttin in at all. I'd hoped I'd get some other opinions on this thread.
I don't usually push products, but believe that the issue of sharp broadheads is so important and this product of such quality that it demands attention.
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Yeah Paul, I've been down the "arrow thing" road. Got the knots on my forehead to prove it.
:banghead: :D
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I can see it now...Lambs going to be in the kitchen working on Billie's butter knives next... By the way remember to buy your tags this morning so you can push one of those super sharp broadheads through a mule deer this fall. :D
Looks like a pretty solid outfit. Going to have to put a KME on the to buy list.
Chris
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Yes Sir, I hear ya & can relate to your words of wisdom! I've been down that road a time or two but there seemed to be a few more obstacles on this last course! (grin)
Balance is key, I certainly agree 100% on your thoughts of a sharp head! There is no substitute!
ElkNut1
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(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME8.jpg)
At first glance you might think,"oh it's just a Lansky knock off". Don't be fooled.
Just like the broadhead sharpening system, the Knife sharpening system is one well thought out piece of gear.
The sharpening angle is determined by a sliding guide hole that is infinitely adjustable. This adjustability appeals to my need to put an edge on at the angle "I" think is right.
Further more there is a nylon bushing that guides the sharpener's rod that allows for no "slop", assuring exact angle contact with the blade stroke after stroke.
The jaws that hold the blade are padded for a positive grip and are marked so that the blade can be placed in them exactly from one sharpening to the next.
(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME9.jpg)
Of course the head revolves for quick and accurate change to the other side of the blade.
I took this old Puma fixed blade and cleaned up the edge real nice. It took a little work since it was in pretty bad shape. The edge is now consistent and wicked sharp. (it'll stay that way for a while too... love those Puma's)
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How does the KME do on serated blades?
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Chris... number one rule of marriage (ok, so there's a bunch of number one rules.) Don't ever sharpen your wife's kitchen knives. She won't appreciate it and she WILL cut herself... within seconds of the time you finish.
Besides, if things ever get out of control it's better if she comes after ya with a dull knife.
:D
Got my finger on the send button just waiting for the appropriate time
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Charlie,
what about Simmons heads with the concave edge ? Does KME make a round stone or diamond stone that is round or half round to take care of the concave edge on the Simmons heads ? I am currently using a SteelMaster that uses files and ceramic crock sticks on my Simmons heads and it works okay. If KME would address this issue I would probably buy one and be done with all my other sharpeners for life !
nocams :readit:
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At this time there is no provision for doing serrate blades.
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The 1st head Ron does on the video on his site is a serrated head....it does the main surface....but you will still need a little round file to get the grooves sharp.
You guys should check out his web site videos....
I have to agree with Charlie....all this Bhead discussion is much less important than accuracy and sharp heads. Get those two down and you can pretty much pick your poison on N American Game.
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Originally posted by Terry Green:
I have to agree with Charlie....all this Bhead discussion is much less important than accuracy and sharp heads. Get those two down and you can pretty much pick your poison on N American Game.
BINGO!!!! :readit: :notworthy:
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I absolutely agree that a sharp broadhead is key. My problem is that I am one of those sharpening challenged guys. I can use a file and get an okay edge, but not the real sharpness I want. I bought a Lansky system, which looks very similar to the KME, and I have followed the directions religiously and I find I get no better edge than I do with a file. What is the difference in the KME that makes it better, or is it possible that some guys are just not trainable?
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I bought the knife sharpening kit back in April for my birthday and it's great. I have a hard time getting a real sharp edge on things but this set up makes it easy. You can use the knife kit for SOME broadheads but some aren't large enough for the stone to clear the clamps. If you look at Charlie's pic of the puma imagine a blade that's closer to the jaw and you'll see what I mean. Even small pocket knife blades are close. I plan on just ordering the broadhead clamp to use with stones I already had. I was looking at the kit on the St. Jude auction but it went out of my range fast. Charlie had something to do with that. :D
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I'd liked to mention that one of the best side benefits to purchasing Ron's kit is the over-the-phone tutorial that comes free of charge....Ron actually walks you through the process, and gives a few "insider tips"...he can teach a trained monkey to get things sharp... :readit:
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so how much is this thing and where can we get it?
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KME is sponsor of tradgang, you can access his website from here. Ron is a top notch guy! I have spoke with him several times, and his customer service is next to none! I have had trouble in the past with getting a fine edge on a knife or broadhead, but this KME system does all the work for you! I believe with this system, anyone and everyone can now have a razor sharp blade! My congratulations and admiration to Ron at KME for developing such a fine product!
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Russ, if you see an extended discussion of a fine product on this site you can be assured they are site sponsors and can be found under the sponsor drop down list at the top of the page. KME is right there in the list with a link to a well done website. Supporting our sponsors is supporting Tradgang and helping to make this place possible.
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Looks great Charlie. Do you get the same scary sharp on single bevels? How? Planning to grind all my heads to single bevel asap.
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The KME is the best sharpening system made. I use my knife jig/kit for both Broadheads and all my knives. I know for a fact that they will be available at Comptons. You can get a firsthand look at them and see for yourself what all the talk is about. Ron sure has a winner.
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OK....So what your saying is #1...I can drop my bow weight from 75# to say 65# if I use a KME Broad Head sharpening system :biglaugh: If I use a KME, then what will I need you here for?
#2..I won't need to be so friendlily with these Knife maker men....I'll be able to be more independent and self reliant...That I WON"T have to take Jeff; Rob or Doug with me on all my huntin trips. I can really sharpen my own Knives. :eek: :eek: OH MY.....That would just about pay for the KME....Just in Doug's eats.
KME is undoubtedly with out question the BEST; EASIEST and most FOOL PROOF sharpener I have EVER USED......PERIOD........Sage advice and wisdom again Charlie.......Why don't I listen to you sooner and more often :biglaugh: :biglaugh:
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thanks for pointing that out guys....I'm gonna check it out right now.....
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I currently have 160 gr old stock Thunderheads - 3 bladed, and I have the KME broadhead tool to resharpen those blades.
Love it so far
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Thanks for the tips gentlemen, hows the KME do on single bevel heads like a grizzly?
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Straitera.... you bet it will do a single bevel. I'd work the bevel with either the knife or broadhead system down to a nice edge and finish with a couple of strokes on the flat side with a very fine stone or diamond hone.
Stinger... there is a world of difference between the KME and the Lansky. With the right touch you could sure get the Lansky to work, but my experience leads me to believe you can get a better edge in a shorter amount of time with the KME.
Ron has built features into his system that allow each stroke to be exactly like the one before it.
You can also find just the right angle for the particular blade you are sharpening.
Both features make for a very quick, durable and deadly edge.
Anyone is "trainable" heck, give Ron a call and he'll help you make the Lansky work.... yeah, he's that kind of guy.
Like Fatman said above, one of the greatest aids in the whole system is having access to Ron himself via phone. He knows his stuff about sharpening and shares what he knows willingly... regardless of how you chose to sharpen your blades.
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Nocams... I'm going to sharpen up a Simmons later on today and let you know about that. I know it poses it's own special set of issues but I'm sure it can be overcome.
A set of half round stones for either system might bear looking at.
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Will add a Grizzly to the list of heads to sharpen tonight and post results. I know what they will be though.
;)
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I luv Charlie thread :clapper:
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Thanks Charlie. Ron gave me a personal lesson at K-Zoo. He said the best option for the Simmons is the knife sharpener kit. He actually sharpened one for me but I'm not "sharp" enough to follow along so I will stick with the other broadheads I have.
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:thumbsup:
Here's to Ron being swamped with orders! Couldn't happen to a nicer guy! Anyone that's been thinking about a knife and/or broadhead system just get it...you won't be disappointed. Give Ron a call.
Thanks Charlie
:campfire: :archer: :coffee:
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Me too Guru !!! Love to drag up a chair, cup of joe and learn from the older guys !!!
Charlie, looking forward to seeing how the Simmons head comes out, especially if it is as sharp in the concave part as the rest of the head.
Ron, if you are listening please add a solution or round stones to the kit and Walla ! The best sharpening system on the planet no ifs ands or buts !!!
nocams :help:
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OK guys! Just came in from the shop with some results from sharpening.
Here are the ones I opted to sharpen...
(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME12.jpg)
Was able to bring every one to a razor like edge without undo problems.
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The first of the lot was the Simmons... because I was really curious what I could do.
(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME11.jpg)
This head had been through the wringer. Killed a pile of Sage hens with it last fall and it spent it fair share of time skittering off through the sage and granite of western Wyoming. The edge was real rough, nicked and dull as my brain before caffeine.
The KME knife sharpening jig was used and I achieved a very sharp edge in short order... I'd shoot it at anything right now.
As suspected, the flat stones were working the grind with just the edges of the diamond hone making contact along the blade edge.
Although it worked well enough, I suspect that this process would cause excess wear on the edges of the diamond hone and would be even worse on a regular whet stone.
A rounded stone of some kind would be the ticket.
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I wanted to try the hard steel of a replaceable blade broadhead so I dug out an old Thunderhead 150 two blade.
(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME10.jpg)
It still had bits of debris from a coyote I sent it through some 25 years ago. A pass through shot, it too showed signs of getting up close and personal with the Wyoming landscape.
I clamped a blade in the broadhead jig and gave it 5 light passes on the coarse side of the diamond hone and 5 even lighter passes on the fine side. I think it is sharper than it was when new.
One thing I learned a long time ago, is when sharpening don't bear down on the head and jig. This can cause uneven pressure and slight changes of angle which actually rounds the edge... you don't want that happening.
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I jigged up the Journeyman, Grizzly and STOS and all three were a piece of cake. The curved edge of the Journeyman took the most "technique" but was really very easy to sharpen.
The Grizzly El Grande took a little technique as well due to it's extra long length. I treated it just like I mentioned I would previously and got a super sharp edge.
In fairness I must admit that it was an old head that had long ago had it's grind angle changed so I don't know how long it might take to change a factory grind if that's what a fella thinks he has to do.
The STOS went even easier than my Magnus I's. Something about the long narrow profile makes the transition between single layer and triple layer less of a problem.
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I believe it's a good idea to learn how to use a file in the field and I don't hesitate to use one if need be.... it's an old guys idea of a facet of the bowhunters craft.
There are a lot of easy and handy ways to field sharpen broadheads during the hunt.
I do believe, however, that putting on a uniform razor edge at home makes field touch up simpler and more effective whatever method you use.
This system brings a broadhead or knife to a razor like edge with minimal stock removal and that increases the longevity of those tools.
No more mishapen out of balance broadheads or knives that look like they were rubbed on a field rock.
I'm about done, so if you have questions ask away. If I don't know the answer, I'll just call Ron.
;)
(http://www.tradgang.com/upload/charlie/KME14.jpg)
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Good stuff Charlie. The only thing I will add is that when you start with a Grizzley New out of the pack it is a lot easier and faster to use a file to get a working angle on the blade. Then go to the jig to get it razor sharp. This also saves on the life of your stones. Also using a marker will help you see where the metal is coming off and how much. Thank you very much for this thread. I think I'll go sharpen something.
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Originally posted by Charlie Lamb:
... Don't ever sharpen your wife's kitchen knives. She won't appreciate it and she WILL cut herself... within seconds of the time you finish....
absolutely true. used my kme to sharpen a few serrated cutco knives for the wife, told her 3 times they were razor sharp, and she promptly drove one deep into her finger. women, go figure.
btw, for those first serrated knives that i kme sharpened, i only worked the blade itself, not the serrations. i've since acquired a dmt pointy tapered diamond rod that works great on serrated blade.
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Lamb,
Question about the Grizzly...just saying that word makes me cringe at the thought of all the time I spent last year changing the angle of those broadheads and trying to get them sharp....
If I could go back in time and try to start over again could the KME be used with a file to change that angle so that it is a precise grind? The roller option on the clamp seems like it would just glide along the table edge while your file is clamped down.
Chris
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quote:
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Originally posted by Charlie Lamb:
... Don't ever sharpen your wife's kitchen knives. She won't appreciate it and she WILL cut herself... within seconds of the time you finish....
I respectfully disagree. I've seen a lot more kitchen cuts from dull knives being forced to cut something than from sharp ones. Now I'll admit that my wife is very particular about her knives, but she's dowright appreciative when I get them really sharp.
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Thanks Charlie for the info / help on the Simmons head.
I think that you could only use the KME knife sharpening version for Simmons, the broadhead version would not work ??? You would have no way to take into account the concave edge.
How bout it Ron..... Develop a round course diamond tool for your wonderful system to set the angle and remove metal when needed and then a round ceramic or fine diamond for finishing ? I know Simmons are no longer made, but there are tons of them out there that need KME sharp edges ! Also the round tools would work on any CONVEX heads like Charlie was working on, the Journeyman for example.
nocams :readit:
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For the KME are the regular stones good or are the diamonds better?
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Can't answer for everyone. . . but I got the regular stones and just ONE coarse diamond stone. The coarse diamond really takes off the metal of the many edges I screwed up before this. Once the edge is right, the regular stones do the scarey sharp thing.
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I just told my wife about this perfect birthday present but now i'm thinking maybe aniversary would save me 2 months haha
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KME sharpeners are magic, eh!
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Originally posted by IronCreekArcher:
For the KME are the regular stones good or are the diamonds better?
my kme uses all diamond hones, and i prefer those simply because they cut really fast and only require a bit of water for lube, and clean up with water and a bit of soap.
without a doubt, after messing around with too many other knife/broadhead sharpening 'systems', the kme is absolute better than them all.
for the most part, all ya need is the kme knife sharpener - it'll do yer broadheads just as easily as it does yer knives.
what the arrow is to the bow, the kme is to the broadhead. like charlie sez, penetration is all about sharp broadheads - most any trad broadhead - just pick one out and do the proper thing: get that sucker razor shaving sharp!
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IronCreek... KSdan has a good approach to your question. Other than that, it's pretty much personal choice.
You can go to a much finer grit with the regular stones...hard Arkansas.
DragonRider... of course I was just being cute with my statement about wives and knives. I don't mean to categorize women at all. Lots of women who appreciate finely honed kitchen knives, hunting knives and broadheads.
Of course my statement DOES support my own experience.
;)
Nightowl1...Just tell her it's not an expense, but an investment. This is a lifetime tool.
Nocams... the knife sharpener does work as in my test and the broadhead sharpener wouldn't with "flat stones"... you'd end up ruining the stone.
Chris... I'll check and see if the broadhead sharpener could be used with a file. I have my doubts but it might.
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Don't know why I haven't put a link up to Ron's website...duh!!
:knothead:
Here it is... KME (http://www.kmesharp.com/)
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Charlie,
They say your brain works the best and is the most creative in the morning..... Especially after a cup or twelve of joe, haha !
I went to the link you posted like I should have two days ago and really started looking at the system for holding the stones. It would be easy for Ron to offer a extra wooden block with a hole drilled lengthwise to hold a ceramic rod or a chainsaw file. Hard to explain here without being able to draw, but drill the hole beginning in the front of the wooden block,( the end that faces away from you as you are sharpening ). Drill back toward the rear end of the block, but do not drill all the way thru, leave a blind hole. This will serve to hold the rods in place as you push the block away from you in the sharpening process. close the open, front end of the hole with a piece of tape, no force needed to simply hold the rod in the hole, all the pressure is towards the rear of the block which has the blind hole for support. You will need to cut away all the wood between the front and rear of the wooden block to expose the, "captured rod " , leaving an " ear " on each end that holds and supports the rod. If the hole is the correct size it will allow a chainsaw file to rotate and use the entire surface of the file. As the file is pushed into the blade it will naturally rotate.
If you are not a woodworker a simpler method would be to buy two spring clips, ( like the ones that hold arrows in a arrow rack ), and screw them to a wooden block. You would need a hard stop on the rear of the wooden block extending past the rod to give the rod something to push against as you push the rod across the blade. A simple piece of wood or metal extended down about 1/2" would work. Just load the file or ceramic rod of your choice into the clips making sure the rear of the file or rod was against the rear stop for support and away you go.
If Ron wanted to offer this on a production basis it would be very simple to have a plastic rod holder moulded which would make it much more cost effective I would think ? If not then I think I will be buying the diamond knife sharpening kit and make me a wooden rod holder myself for now. This should solve the problem of the big ole concave edge on them Treesharks. JMHO
nocams :coffee:
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Dull knives are much more dangerous than sharp ones, even for the women-folk.
I'm in full agreement that a truly sharp broadhead is crucial to penetration, but if the arrow is wobbling it won't penetrate well, no matter how sharp the point. At least it'll do maximum damage to what it hits. All the effort to achieve perfect tuning is wasted if the head is dull.
Good stuff, Charlie.
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Having talked some with Ron myself, I know he wants to keep stone quality top drawer and USA made. Hasn't been that easy... today's world things get sloppy at times... :(
I know he's always on the look out for some round stones to use for serrated and such.
HIs equipment and guidance took me from the 12-Step meetings saying, "Hi, I'm Doc Nock and I'm sharpening impaired" to "look at what I can cut now!" :)
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I just used mine for the 1st time last night....found it last week after someone put it up in a safe place for me after Christmas....gotta love her though.
Charlie's thread prompted me to try my hand at it.
I did a Zephyr Sasquatch last night....and the KME is all its cracked up to be.
Like Charlie said....getting them this sharp from the get go at the house will make touch up in the field after a shot a cinch.
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Will the knife system sharpen ACE broadheads or are they too small?
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After all the praise in this post and because of they're gracious support of the St.Jude's Auction I bought a knife sharpening system. I don't have trouble sharpening on my own; but I have some salvaged Cold Steel knives that need to be brought back from butter knife to the shining examples of sharpness Cold Steel knives usually are. So this seemed to be the ticket plus the other duties this can accomplished.
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oh the full list of secrets of arrow penetration
1)Broadhead sharpness, a razor should weep in envy.
2)As close as you can get to perfect asrrow flight
3)High front of center weight, with a minimum of 10 grains of arrow weight per pound of draw weight aka at least a 500 grain arrow out of a 50# bow. Even heavier will work better until about 17 grains per pound being the point of diminishing returns.
4) Low cross sectional denisity aka thin arrow with as little fletching as you can achieve secret #2 with.
5)Shot placement, knowing where the space between the ribs is and putting the arrow there.
Of coarse I know that you all probably know all that. I just couldn't help myself.
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Everything that Charlie says, on sharpness and accuracy!
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Romans3... You should have no trouble at all using the knife sharpening system on the Ace heads.
Those Ace broadheads have some super steel in them and I suspect you'll be awed by the edge you get with the KME.
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Originally posted by Charlie Lamb:
Romans3... You should have no trouble at all using the knife sharpening system on the Ace heads.
Those Ace broadheads have some super steel in them and I suspect you'll be awed by the edge you get with the KME.
i've sharpened ace standards on my kme knife sharpener - yep, hair shaving sharp.
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Charlie,
I hope I'm not misunderstanding but, it sounds like from what your saying, you could do most broadheads with the knife system. Are there any broadheads that you think would be difficult to do with the knife system?
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i do believe that the kme KNIFE sharpener will easily sharpen all TWO blade heads (or 4 blades with removal bleeder blades).
the kme, like most all other sharpening systems, won't do three bladed heads like woodsmans and snuffers.
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OK OK ya convinced me. I just got of the folks with Ron and we are now dealers for KME products.
We will have some product to show at Comptons next week.
Mike
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Joe D... How've you been bud? Like Rob said above.
I've mentioned that I think there may be trouble with heavilly concaved blades... the KME will do them, but I suspect the hone will take a beating after a while as it's mainly the edges of the stones that contact the blade.
May just give Ron a call and get his take on that.
Somewhere around here I've got a Howard Hill head that I'm gonna try as soon as I find it. The heavy aluminum ferrule can present problems with some systems, but I'll bet the knife sharpener will work on it as well.
Wow Mike! A dealer. That's pretty cool. I'm gonna have to break away and get up to Comptons one of these days. Sounds like a great time.
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Charlie...I've bean great....thanks! :D It's great to read your contributions and I hope all is going great for ya. PM me your street address, I have something I'd like to share with ya that I'm sure you'll enjoy.
It sounds like the knife setup would work for me....thanks for the feedback. :)
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Charlie,
nice thread.
I've been running hog hunts for a year now....and it appears sharp is a very subjective thing.
Your advice-for both the sharpening- impaired or those who don't think they have the time to put into sharpening their own heads couldn't be more spot on.
The KME puts a sharper edge than nearly every hand sharpened head we have checked in camp.
And Ron is one of the good ones too...he will patiently help anyone any time on the phone get up to snuff with his sharpener.
Always sage advice and timely info from The Sunbear-meister!
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Joe... I'm sending a PM with address. I'm a sucker for a mystery package.
Ray... Those findings in your camp don't surprise me. Sounds like your guys have been knocking them dead.
Found the Howad Hill head and gave it a go on the knife sharpener. No luck with that one. The dang ferrule gets in the way even at the steepest angle... OK, so that's one. LOL
Well everyone, it looks like this thread is on it's last leg so I'm gonna let it slide on down the page. When it drops off to page 2 I'll move it to the Product reviews forum.
I think the word is out on a great product. I'm sure I'll get a lifetime of service from mine.
:wavey: