Trad Gang
Main Boards => The Shooters FORM Board => Topic started by: Flints on June 26, 2007, 07:37:00 PM
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:knothead: )
At any rate, thanks for letting me ramble.
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I know where you're coming from, Flints. I had T.P. awhile back. It took me 3 months of hard work to overcome it. It sounds like you are doing some of the same stuff I did to beat it. If you haven't tried it you might want to look into blind bale shooting. I read about it in Ferguson's book "Become the Arrow". Good Luck.
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If you are thinking about not getting to anchor while you are shooting you are not thinking about shooting. Granted, target panic is in your head so you must relax and feel in control.
The following "stuff" worked for me. Maybe it will help some. :rolleyes:
1- Use a bow weight you can shoot a long time without getting the shakes.
2- Bright color feathers will help you remember flight trajectory.
3- Get out into the woods or a field to shoot. Can't worry about neighbors watching or hitting the garage door with an arrow.
4- S-L-O-W your draw down alot and imagine your arrow flyin' into the target before you anchor.
5- When you reach anchor imagine your arrow again hitting where you want.
6- It should all come together after that. You will get faster at the draw in time.
I'll bet a buck someone will take issue with my statements. Just my 2 cents worth.
Good Luck!
... mike ... :wavey: ...
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Hi Yellowsnake,
I tried blind bale shooting which definitely help my form but I still had major trouble practicing drawing and letting down. That strong urge to let 'er go had me in it's death grip. It wasn't till I drew on things that would destroy an arrow that I started to control when I released the shot.
I read Ferguson's book awhile ago. Now that I've been shooting longer, I'll go back for a reread. I'll probably get more from it.
Thanks for the shout back.
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Thanks Mike,
Good advice. I have found that slowing down my shot has helped tremendously as well as shot visualization. I tried shooting at longer distances, which for me is 25-30 yards so I could
see the arrow trajectory better. Still having trouble making the trajectory work for me. However, at 30 yds, I have to be so slow and deliberate with my shot so as not to miss my not so big target butt that my t.p. is gone. I am 100% in control but it seems that the closer I get to the target, the faster I "have to let go of that string" which translates into less control and poor shots.
The human mind is a funny thing. At least mine is!! :banghead:
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FLINT see post below tp 100% cure by jd he has some drills that really work but you have to keep on em.good luck
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Best of luck......never had TP.....so I'm of no help on how to fix it.
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PM Jay Kidwell, he has helped me immensely, he is a great help, a great person and will answer you asap with help.
Jay is a credit to us trad shooters.
Hell, I'm thinking of naming my new bow J-KID :bigsmyl: :archer:
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Thanks for all the input.
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I have THE cure for TP. She is a 19 month old German Shepherd who has been going out to shoot with me since she was about 2 months old. The high point of her day starts when she sees me take the bow down from the rack and string it. When she was small she decided that her job was to test my concentration by barking as I came to full draw. Then she would chase the arrow downrange and sniff it when it was in the target. Now she is fast enough to bark and be downrange before I ever loose the arrow and this can get exciting. Imagine being at full draw with a eyeball lock on where you want the arrow to hit and suddenly there is a grinning doggie face in your line of sight. This, I promise you, will cure any tendency to snap-shoot.
I'm planning to rent Katie (the dog) out to those who need help with their concentration. She is a sure-fire cure. Feel free to contact me if you need her assistance.
John
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WOW! I have the same exact problem your going through I know what you mean by knowing what you have to do but you just cant do it. Im going to keep an eye on this thread and try some of this stuff I hope to be ready before October.
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I started concentrating on drawing, getting anchored, making sure all reference points line up, (yup, I do aim) and then letting down. I do this at various distances from the target before I even attempt a shot. It warms up my drawing muscles and my mental "muscles". It's almost funny that I have to mentally yell at myself "do not release the damn string, stupid!" After doing this several times, I can get off a few controlled shots before I start rushing things again. I then repeat the draw and let down process. My shots have been much more controlled and accurate. I'll continue to work things out this way. It's very satisfying to be able to take my time and release when it feels right. It's a damn good thing I am having so much fun or I wouldn't be able to keep at it. Someone said that it's simple but not easy. For sure!!
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I HAVE FOUND THAT WHEN I START TO RUSH MY SHOT I HAVE TO BLURR OUT THE TARGET.AS I START TO DRAW BACK I WILL CONCENTRATE ON THE SPOT I WANT TO HIT.THEN I TRY TO BLURR OUT THE TARGET UNTIL I AM FULL DRAW.THEN I PICK OUT THE TARGET AND RELEASE.
YOU CAN ALSO TRY TO SHOOT FORM WITHOUT PICKING A SPOT. HPOE THIS HELPS
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Flints, I can really empathize with the "I think you need counselling." response. I have heard that more than once. I also had TP for 15 or so years and have reduced it by using all of the suggestions given here.
But, have a theory that I've been running around in my head that might help someone. In the past, I did a lot of .22 pistol shooting. As most people know, to shoot a firearm accurately, you should breath in deeply and then exhale about half of that breath, relax and touch off the shot. Well, if you try to relax at full draw to aim, guess what happens - the shot goes off. Just a little food for thought.
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Read Jay Kidwell's book.
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KSdan,
I have the Kidwell book; read it years ago.Looks like I'll reread. Didn't have tp when I first read the book.
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Watch your point of the arrow until at full draw...then look at the target and pick a spot.
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Flints,
My TP experience pretty much mirrors yours. It started off slowly, just a little "tick" in my shot sequence, then manifested into a full blown train wreck. I could anchor, aim and hold on anything I had no intentions of shooting (like a brick), but as soon as I knew I tried aiming at something I wnated to shoot, the whole thing went in the pot again.
I can't begin to remember how many different ways I tried curing it. Blind bale, draw-aim-let down drills, whatever...I think I tried just about everything out there. Nothing worked for me. Reluctantly, I started shooting with a click a couple years ago.
After a few months of learning how to use it properly, the difference was night and day. I'm more in control of my shot now than ever before. Honestly, if nothing else works, a clicker is the best thirteen dollars you'll probably ever spend.
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I have tried a lot of everyone's suggestions since I started the thread in June. They all seemed to help me put my shot together. Thanks!!
I guess I use what I found out is called a swing draw and I was pre-aiming while slowly drawing and just let 'er go as I touched my face - not a solid anchor, just a touch and go. Today, I decided to try coming to full draw quickly and holding while solidifying my anchor and getting my reference points in focus. Takes more strength to hold so I didn't shoot as much but my t.p. is so much more controlled this way and my shots are much more consistent and accurate.My windage fliers just about disappeared. Well, I have to go now and replace two broken nocks!! It was a great shooting session. :archer:
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I wish to thank Dr Jay Kidwell in public. He realized I had the earlier version of his book that did not deal with t.p. and e-mailed me the excerpt from it. Flints
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Good advice on Kidwell's book.
My advice is to stop looking for a quick fix. Their is no quick fix.
You have to decondition yourself so that getting on target or getting the string to your face doesn't equal release.
My best tip is to try to draw up on a real target 10 times without letting go of the arrow. Get dead on, squinty eyed, single hair picked out, on target before letting down. Do it 10 times in a row. I bet you can't make it to 10. Heck I couldn't do it once when I first started. Keep working until you can. Once you've gained control back the key is to keep working on it everyday from here on out. Get on target and let down more than you release. Always work on it first thing. Eventually you can decrease the number of times you let down.
I think you always have to have a target in front of you because otherwise it just comes back when you go back to something you really want to hit. The association of releasing is when you "get on target". Something that gives you butterflies or buck fever.
I don't think you are every really over target panic as it will creep back as soon as you stop or until the next time your around you buddies. You have to make the exercises something you do everytime you shoot not just when you start flinching or short drawing. I do them at 3-D shoots if I start flinching.
Once you've draw up enough times (and gotten on target) without shooting your brain finally stops trying to anticipate and waits until your really ready to release.
It is really a cool process to get control over the deep recesses of your brain. In doing so you will be a better shot without a doubt. You will have learned a lot about your shooting as well.
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Thanks Chris,
I never thought I would have to de-program myself,but it looks like the way to go.
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Flints;
I have an idea on how to help you with the "snap" part of your shooting... There is a Mediaeval re-enactment/re-creation group called the Society for Creative Anachronisms, Inc. (you may have heard of it - or not). The archers in the group(s) hold many competitions, all over the U.S (and in Europe and other parts of the world), and one thing they do is called a "Cadence Shoot". Count out each portion of your draw/release: Take an arrow from the quiver; nock the arrow on the string; draw the string to anchor; AIM; release. Do everything to a set rhythm, and it will start to come together. After a while, you will be able to control how long each portion actually takes, and you will -- hopefully -- no longer be hurrying your shots.
And a way to shoot fast -- without actually hurrying -- is to practice loosing (shooting - but why would you want to shoot your arrows? That would just break them. You shoot deer, bears, elk - you don't shoot arrows..) as many arrows as you can (ACCURATELY, of course) in 30 seconds. I've seen a few who can loose up to 9 arrows in those 30 seconds, with excellent accuracy; I usually get only 5 off the string and into an 8" group.
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Artur - I don't know much about the SCA but have seen some sites relating to it; looks like a good time. Thanks for the advice. I am trying to gather up as much advice as possible for future reference. I just received Jay kidwell's revised
edition of his book that has a lot of info on t.p.
At what distance do you practice "loosing"? Speed shooting and getting an 8" group sounds pretty tough.
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Flints;
At the risk of going off topic... My "private" practice range (it's off the side of the driveway, in an old shallow gravel pit - if you're driving by and stop in, feel free to use it, just don't trash it!) is approx 30 yrds. The whole idea of "speed shooting" is to do it smoothly and quickly, for those times when a fast, smooth shot is vital. And an 8" grouping isn't really all that great, even at 30 yrds, unless it happens to be centered on the bull's eye -- but that's why we practice, innit?
And the thing about "loosing" vs. "shooting"... It's just about the terminology we choose to use. Like "the car drove down the road": Did the car do the driving, or did the person who was operating the car? It **can** be misleading.
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Thanks Artur,
I live in NH, so the chance of my just driving by is slim but I appreciate the offer. Flints