Trad Gang

Main Boards => The Shooters FORM Board => Topic started by: Trab on March 15, 2009, 08:46:00 AM

Title: Moment of Release
Post by: Trab on March 15, 2009, 08:46:00 AM

I know some of you TradGang veterans aren't crazy about novices like myself asking preK style questions   .......I have seen some of the comments......... I don't mean to lower the level of the sight or anything, but I have limited resources to learn the basics from, so I must ask my questions. I have definitely noticed there are MANY out there more than willing to help........so I ask my questions despite............My apologies to the advanced guys out there....I respect you guys big time.....but a guys gotta do what a guys gotta do,,,,,,,,,,,Having said that....         :help:   .........

How long do you guys hold when you are in full draw on a longbow and in anchor position ?    I have just begun practicing and was under the impressiin having watched films, that it is an instant release once the back hand on the draw reaches the anchor position..(just under my right eye for me)......the problem I am initially having is that my accuracy seems to be much better if I pause about 2 seconds before releasing.....I want to do things the right way from the start, so I don't develop lousy habits at the get-go     ......Any help MUCH APPRECIATED...

TRAB

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: broketooth on March 15, 2009, 08:59:00 AM

i dont know about anyone else but.... when im shooting and i draw back the moment i come to my full draw is when i release. the trick is to not pluck the string . 2 reasons for this. 1st is it makes for a loud release. 2nd is it effects your accuracy .. dramatically i might add.causes you to jerk the bow, nomatter how slight.if you miss by an inch or a foot it is still a miss. this could mean the difference in a clean harvested animalor a animal that is wounded for days or weeks at a time.you want a clean release which is acheived through practice practice practice. they say that practice makes perfect. i say perfect practice makes perfect .good luck to you on clean releases

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: DJTJR on March 15, 2009, 09:04:00 AM

Trab, there is no set formula use what you are more comfortable with.  Some of the pure instictive shooters release upon contact with their anchor oethers hold a few seconds.  those who shoot with an aiming system Gap or Point of aim tend (but not always) to hold a bit longer 2 to 4 seconds but again nothing is set in stone do what you feel comfortable with and where you see the best results.  in time you will develop a feel and will be able to release a lot faster if this is what you desire.
Also in my humbel opinion dont be afraid to ask anything here, at one point in time everyone on this site was starting out could have used the great rescources here to speed the learning process.  I know it has helped me a lot.
best,
Don

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: WESTBROOK on March 15, 2009, 09:06:00 AM

Trab,   nothing at all wrong with holding for 2 seconds. There is no "correct" length of time to hold anchor, just stay there till all feels right and then release. In time you will probably begin shooting faster with good results, it will become something you dont have to think about, just a habit.

Good luck

Eric

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: bentpole on March 15, 2009, 09:09:00 AM

I release as soon as I hit FULL anchor. I hit the corner of my mouth with my pointer finger.Someone just starting out can put a clothes pin on the end of their arrow. Practice drawing back to full anchor. .You'll know when you hit the clothes pin against the front of your riser.. I had a Bud over yesterday shooting for a while. I have come to a decision that the release is the most important part of Tradional Shooting. He was having problems. I told him to visualize flicking a fly off your cake    :eek:    or flicking a BOOGER off your finger    :scared:    LOL! OR you can let the string slide off your fingers and touch your ear to become consistant.    :thumbsup:  You have to practice Mark. Sooner or later everything will work together and you'll become consistant.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: wingnut on March 15, 2009, 09:13:00 AM

Your doing fine and if you are much more accurate holding. . well then hold.  I have a quick release after maybe a second.  That's what feels right to me.  Rusty holds for probably 4 seconds at draw and Jason is in between when he shooting well.

So if you are a "slow twitch" muscle guy, then a hold is good.  If you are "fast twitch" then you will have a quick release.

Mike

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Chris Wilson on March 15, 2009, 09:14:00 AM

"How long do you guys hold when you are in full draw on a longbow and in anchor position ?"

2-3 seconds.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Charlie Lamb on March 15, 2009, 09:17:00 AM

Trab...I'm one of the old guys and if anyone gives you crap about asking ANY trad archery question, just let me know.
Having said that, this probably needs to be discussed on the "Shooters Forum".

I'll let it sit here for a while so some of those impatient dudes get the point.

The bottom line for your question is control. Do whatever you need to do to have it.

It's a common fallacy among new instinctive archers to think they have to shoot "touch and go" because so and so does it that way.

The fact of the matter is that most of the "good" quick shooters that you'll see started out with a much more deliberate pace.

Once all the basics are firmly ingrained the pace just seems to speed up naturally.

I, for one, tend to practice a very deliberate style, but shoot more quickly in hunting situations... two completely different things that shouldn't be mixed.
There is a time to practice good form and a time to just let the shot happen.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: waiting4fall on March 15, 2009, 09:49:00 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qpwu1xNoQjs

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Widowbender on March 15, 2009, 10:07:00 AM

Trab...Don't be afraid to ask questions here. Anyone who isn't willing to help ain't too "ADVANCED" in my book...
I tried the "touch and go" method when I started out and I struggled to improve until I sloowwwwed everything down.

David

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: elknut1 on March 15, 2009, 10:22:00 AM

Between 1-2 seconds after anchor on a longbow here! I'm not looking to change either!! (grin)

  ElkNut1

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Jason R. Wesbrock on March 15, 2009, 10:36:00 AM

I agree with Charlie.

I've shot instinctive, gap, and point-of-aim. No matter how I'm shooting, I always like to pause at full draw, most of the time for a few seconds. I also like to vary the length of time I hold at full draw because it gives me more flexibility in the hunting woods.

In the end, go with however you personally shoot best.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Smallwood on March 15, 2009, 10:46:00 AM

nothing wrong with holding at full draw for a couple of seconds. just don't let your mind start wandering and second guessing  :banghead:  . keep focus on your target until the release happens.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Ybuck on March 15, 2009, 10:49:00 AM

For myself, a few second pause lets me dial in on target, and then pull through my shot better.
Do whats most comfortable to you.  :thumbsup:

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: George D. Stout on March 15, 2009, 11:08:00 AM

What Mr. Lamb said!  I personally hold for about two or three seconds to allow the brain and body to synchronize with one another.  You will see a lot of different styles, but you will see more bad shooters not holding at all.  There's no time-limit on accuracy.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Pat B on March 15, 2009, 11:13:00 AM

I release when my hand hits my anchor point. That is not necessarily the right or wrong way to do it. When I find myself short drawing or my accuracy drops I will hold at full draw for a second or two before releasing. This gives me time to correct any of the fundamentals I may be skipping in my draw. Also, I shoot selfbows or wood backed bows and a longer hold is detrimental to these bow. With glass bows, this is not a problem.
   IMO, the longer you hold at full draw, the more strain you are putting on your muscles and the more apt you are to loose consistency. However, there is a guy that I see at lots of the shoots I go to. He holds at full draw, with an Olympic style draw for up to a minute before releasing. The guy can drive nails with his shots but it hurts me just to watch him.    Which ever method works best you is the method you should use.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: elkbreath on March 15, 2009, 12:05:00 PM

MY release is almost instant too.  BUT there is a brief moment at full drew before release.

When I first came over to the greener side of the fence, i was leaving alot of shots through a compound behind.  IMO I was really good with a compound (all humility aside).  I'd draw, hold, find my sights, breathe, shoot.  Arrows were always next to each other.  

As soon as I started shooting trad, I'd draw and let her rip.  It was like I just shot for the enjoyment of shooting, not hitting a spot, just the target.  arrow after arrow, draw and shoot draw and shoot.  

As soon as I noticed this, that I wasn't staring down a spot, I wasn't take care arrow to arrow to hit that spot, I realized I had to change something.

NOw, when I get to full draw there is a split second where I get a sight picture of the arrow and the spot, and then the arrows gone.  MY groups shrank a ton.  Just MY experience, I have to be mindful of arrow to arrow actually trying to hit something with good form and release, though the whole process really takes very little time.  Without I could shoot 100 arrows and never even think about anything, just flinging arrows.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: NorthernCaliforniaHunter on March 15, 2009, 12:33:00 PM

I tend to hold a few seconds too. It seems I do this little circular dance around the target with my bow arm. My release hand just seems to know when it all lines up and lets go at that critical moment. I found the key to my shooting best is to let the movement happen (that is how I off-should shoot a rifle too). Too much work to try to stop the movement (especially if it's your target that's moving) so it's much easier to relax and trust that your release fingers will just do what they do when your brain senses that the moment is right.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Buckeye Trad Hunter on March 15, 2009, 12:38:00 PM

I hold for 2-3 seconds myself but in my oppinion whatever makes you more accurate is YOUR correct way to shoot.  After all the object is to hit the target not shoot like the next guy.  :thumbsup:

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Killdeer on March 15, 2009, 12:44:00 PM

Lot of good answers here. If I were a better shot, I would add one, too.   :wavey:

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Dartwick on March 15, 2009, 01:16:00 PM

As other people are saying - dont try to release fast.

Get to your anchor and hold it till you are ready to shoot. In time the gap between anchor and release maybe come very short(or maybe it wont.) But consistent form and release are what matters most for accuracy so your best served by keeping a hold phase in your shooting process.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: JL on March 15, 2009, 01:37:00 PM

I also hold for a few seconds. It allows me to really drill my focus on the exact spot I want to impact.

I tryed snap shooting and I too was all over the place. I think snap shooting is for advanced shooter who have built their form and shooting sequence thru thousands of shots.

It will take you a while to get your form down. Just remember to repeat the exact same shot sequence from shot to shot. Also, right at the time of release, think, Statue. You want to keep everything still/motionless as you can until the arrow impacts the target.

Welcome aboard!

JL

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: mcgroundstalker on March 15, 2009, 01:42:00 PM

First: Questions are good. If I had a PC and this site ten years ago it wouldn't have taken me many years to be happy with my shooting!

Second: You can read the books, watch the videos, ask questions and get answers BUT... You have to put what you will (learn) into practice!

Get together with some trad guys and gals that have been at it for a while and see how fast you pick it up....... It worked for me. Otherwise, being new to Trad, you can overload on information and get confused.

... mike ...

*** Mark, Check Your PMs ***

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: dragon rider on March 15, 2009, 01:56:00 PM

Trab,  For what it's worth (citing the Killdeer corollary here), I hold for about 2 seconds to make sure I actually have things where they belong.

On your other point, as a relative newby to trad stuff, and inveterately curious about much of it, I've found that most of the people on here are either really happy to help or Academy Award caliber actors.

Keep on askin'.  Very often you're not the only one who learns from the answers.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Killdeer on March 15, 2009, 02:31:00 PM

Mikey, it isn't nice to tell everybody here that he has pms.

   
Killdeer

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: woodchucker on March 15, 2009, 02:39:00 PM

More "focus" is good, Grasshopper.....   :pray:

(hold as long as you need to)

It will also help avoid a "premature release" which is BAD!!!!!   :mad:

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Trab on March 15, 2009, 02:40:00 PM

Hey guys, I really appreciate all the responses....after reading them all real carefully, it sounds like the following would be a pretty accurate summary.......The most important thing at this early stage is to shoot the way I get the best results with......since that currently includes about a 2 second pause, I should stick with that....as time goes on It sounds like I most of you guys evolve into a quicker release...and I guess that will happen to me too.....so I will do just that.....continue my pause on anchor and wait    :bigsmyl:   until I naturally develop a quicker release.....at the this point it seems that quicker release should start kickin in sometime around 2020.... javascript:void(0)

On my other point, judging by all your replies, I think my original read on the forum here at TradGang was very accurate.....THAT IS.......THE OVERWHELMING ATTITUDE HERE IS TO NOT HESITATE IN THE LEAST TO HELP EACH OTHER.....for that reaon I am pumped that I found the site.....and I tip my cap and applaud  each and every one of you guys   :clapper:    :clapper:    :clapper:    :clapper:      

By the way, Mike,MC Groundstalker........good suggestion about hooking up with other Trabguys from the site in my area.....I plan on doing just that (Joe  from Highland and Chuck from Dutchess County) ....both these guys were nice enough to touch base with me and offer guidance....I plan on contacting both of you guys at some point.....By the way Mike, I don't see any PM's....maybe I checked it wrong and missed it....I'll check it again......

As always, MUCH APPRECIATION to all .....now I gotta go help the little lady with some grub shoppin.....TBC ...To be continued !!

Trab

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: frassettor on March 15, 2009, 03:45:00 PM

I hold for only about a second, but I am "locked on" to my spot even before I draw, otherwise I would hold for longer. There is NO right or wrong answer. You do what feels good to you and keep doing it that way everytime. The repetion will create the "muscle memory"....soon you won't even give it a second thought....you will just do it! Good luck to ya.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Brian Krebs on March 15, 2009, 04:17:00 PM

I enjoy watching Byron Ferguson shoot; and I have noticed that sometimes he releases the arrow almost instantly when he comes to full draw. Sometimes though - its seconds; and he seems to switch his attention from his anchor to the object he is shooting at. That results in his draw hand to go forward two or three inches before he releases.

 I hold back a couple seconds with my longbow. I do not snap shoot; as hey - when I am shooting at live animals - I feel the need to be sure of my shot. So I tend to hold a little longer than a snap shooter would-- not that it necessarily makes me a better shot for it !

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Terry Green on March 15, 2009, 04:44:00 PM

What Charlie said...........

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: jrchambers on March 15, 2009, 05:06:00 PM

i think a trad archer should be able to hold or snap with acuracy being equal, that is my goal to be able to hit when i need to.  that being said when i started i had to confirm anchor and focus on target backtension and release for a couple to 5 seconds to hit the broad side of a barn. then the barn changed to the x and one day i found that i could snap just as well as hold.
sometimes.

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: bayoulongbowman on March 15, 2009, 05:16:00 PM

Trab, I start my practice with one arra , good form, pick spot , brain takes over as you anchor , for me about 1 mississppi 2 mississppi hold,  brain has my picture where I want my  arrow and  needs to go on tatget or kill zone...Release and follow through. For you  thats be about 3 new yorks...      :wavey:

Title: Re: Moment of Release
Post by: Trab on March 15, 2009, 07:48:00 PM

Well in NY we talk to damn fast....so maybe it should be 4 or 5 NY's.....what do you think cajun ??      :bigsmyl:      Go LSU !!