Trad Gang
Main Boards => The Shooters FORM Board => Topic started by: Bob L. on January 30, 2010, 11:56:00 PM
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May I get some constructive critisism on my shooting/fom. Please don't make fun of the beer gut.
(http://i491.photobucket.com/albums/rr272/boblamonte/shooting/th_shooting.jpg) (http://s491.photobucket.com/albums/rr272/boblamonte/shooting/?action=view¤t=shooting.flv)
(http://i491.photobucket.com/albums/rr272/boblamonte/shooting/th_shooting2.jpg) (http://s491.photobucket.com/albums/rr272/boblamonte/shooting/?action=view¤t=shooting2.flv)
(http://i491.photobucket.com/albums/rr272/boblamonte/shooting/th_shooting3.jpg) (http://s491.photobucket.com/albums/rr272/boblamonte/shooting/?action=view¤t=shooting3.flv)
Thanks
Bob
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I may be way off base, but here is what it looks like you are doing to me. Dropping your bow arm at the shot. Not expanding your draw (I don't see you squeezing your shoulder blades together much -- it looks like mostly arm muscle). Lowering your head to draw rather than bending at the waist. Not getting a tight anchor. Maybe it would help to hold at full draw and feel a stable release as you expanded and stabilized your shooting position. Also, you might turn off your cell phone when you shoot -- it is distracting. ;) I'm sure not an expert on shooting form and probably need a lot of help on mine too, so others can definitely give better advice. You actually look like you are doing pretty well overall.
Allan
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Thanks Allan I appreciate it.
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I'd agree with Allan about your bow arm and the expansion.
Keep your bow arm up until the arrow hits the target. In all likelihood, the arrow's way gone before your hand drops, but you want to make sure that it doesn't cause low arrows when you're fatigued.
For expansion, your string hand shoots out away from your face when you release, which indicates you're using other muscles other than your back muscles to expand your shot. Your fingers flare out too, which may indicate plucking.
Work on relaxing your forearm and biceps when you come to anchor. The only tension you should have during expansion is in the string fingers and your back muscles. Terry (Green) described it nicely as closing the door behind you with your elbow. When you are ready to release, just stop holding the string...rather than opening the hand. These two together should give you a clean release every time.
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What they said. Looks like you are collapsing on a lot of the shots and more of a forced follow through. In the one video you have a little to wide a stance, and you are really shrugging and tilting your head down and forward. If you get your head up and centered you may find your draw length increasing; with the same anchor point, you may get your arm back farther, and that will get your arm back in line so when you get proper back tension your follow through and hand movement will be close to the face.
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What was already said, and ya otta tuck your shirt in:) I got one too, PBR caused it.. I recently switched from a glove to a cordovan tab, the release is so much smoother. Seems like with a glove the fingers get stuck in the string more.
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I couldbe wrong -
Last vid, thing that jumped out to me is the way the bow hand seems to be way too deep and broken back. Leads me to feel that you're not push / pulling like I think you should. I try and use the heel of my thumb as a presure point on the bow to help minimize tiller influence with the bow hand.
All vids, release looks forced (as mentioned). Again this looks like push / pull issues.
Don't force or control the release. Simply let it happen.
Moot point, but the stance looks a bit more open than I'd feel comfortable with. May not be a issue for you though.
Also, using the pause / play on the second vid,,, you're really throwing your bow to the left on release. not so good. (push/pull)
You really like that glove? Looks like you're shaking off the pain at the end of every release. ;)
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I actually don't shoot with a glove at all, but I ripped off the calisus on my fingers from shooting so i put it on so i could make the video. I feel like I can't feel my anchor point at all with it on.
Bob
Thanks for the advise
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Try a tab. You will get more finger protection and feel the anchor like you do without the glove.
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A good tab is the way to go Bob. Get one that has the extra top layer of leather up and down facing the palm of your hand. That way when you hook up to the string, you have a vertical reference and can lay the string smack dab tight up against the vertical part. A glove lets your fingers move around too much. A good tab aligns them.
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Here is a new Video. I tried to work on up right posture of the body and head as well as trying to focus more on extending the elbow and back tension. I also closed my stance more at a 90 degrees and it felt like I was drawing farther?Can you tell me if i am on the right track. I didn't film it but practise shooting this new way and felt like I had some cleaner releases and few good groups at 20-30 yards just see what it was like. Thanks
Bob
(http://i491.photobucket.com/albums/rr272/boblamonte/shooting/th_revisedshooting.jpg) (http://s491.photobucket.com/albums/rr272/boblamonte/shooting/?action=view¤t=revisedshooting.flv)
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Much improved!
Keep working :thumbsup:
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I think your stance is okay. I don't think it's a huge issue for hunters because it can change in the field. Your new stance, though, is an improvement over your original and can work in competition if that was your goal.
You've obviously put a lot of work into your release over the last day or so because it does look cleaner than before...your fingers aren't flaring out like before.
How your string hand ends up (in the chest) makes me think you're still using a lot of bicep and forearm to do the work, as opposed to back muscle. Then again, everyone's built different and maybe that's just how your body moves. Using the back is easy to describe but hard to pull off. Takes some people years to finally have the lightbulb go off. Generally though, proper back tension will cause the hand to slide to the back of the head or to the top of their shoulder when they loose the string.
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Stance is too open I think (even more). Just try closing (swing the bow a bit around in front of you ..sorta) in varying amounts and see if something feels more natural comfortable to you.
I mention that because you look to be overdrawing from here. (string touching your rib cage?)
Release is 1,000 times better!!!!
Something else, first vids, when you released (rear view) you were pulling your hand around behind you? New one looks more straight back. Good going!
By the way, you shooting for points (target) or practicing for hunting?
Ask because different things matter differently for each. (to most folks)
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riarcher,
I'm a bowhunter but want to improve overall form release etc..Its hard to tell on the new vid but my stance is 90 degrees to the target.
Thank you everyone for the input, it has helped alot, I need all the help I can get Ive been into traditional bows for 2 years.
Bob
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Much better Bob, but try holding the bow up till the arrow hits the target. After you release, your bow arm should stay in the same position as when you are aiming.
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Wow big improvements in a short time. The stance looks closed to me. You have to play with that to see what works for you. A good solid upper body form base will not let you down. I can do a lot in the field with position when I know what I should feel like when my upper body form is right. Maybe try to close that door with the elbow softly and not slam the door. For me the back tension is now more subtle than at first, and that has helped gain a smoother follow-through. I was tensing up too much trying to really force the back tension. Really work to relax the forearm and hand. Cupping the hand or turning the hand in at the wrist may cause tension to drive the hand lower. I had that also, but it is mostly gone now. I am not quite sure what did it, but these are the things I have done. Also try to mentally envision the hand moving to the back of the head and shoulder. I have recently really concentrated on feeling the palm of my hand on my face. That has helped flatten my hand more and relax everything so my hand slides back on my face better.
I would not be surprised if you gained some draw length. Just don't over do it so you curly your hand, or force your forearm out. I found it helpful to put a little tape on my arrow at what I thought was my draw length. It allowed me to see if I was consistent and to try slight variations in length. I shot blank bail by just watching the tape and concentrating on the release feel. I found that just the right draw length makes a big difference in how the release feels. If it is too short or long the hand will move out from my face.
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The second video shows a lot of improvement over the first set. For what it worth from my perspective, you really straightened up, which as others have said i think will lengthen your draw a bit, making the bow more efficient. I also think it will help you be more consistent because the core of your shooting will be more stable for consistent anchor and draw length. The release seemed much smoother and less forced, in the first set you seemed to bring your hand back because you were supposed to, not because your back tension caused it. Another view from behind to look at elbow forearm alignment would be good. I personally try to practice with my feet and body in a variety of positions related to "openness of stance", since I primarily bowhunt and I have had to take some shots from weird positions.
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That second video is a HUGE improvement. You are on the right track.
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Thank you, I am thinking about posting another updated video since practising for a while.
Bob
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Yes very good.
Get a deep hard anchor point and keep what ya got till the arrow hits home.
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Thanks everyone for all the help. just wanted to give an update I have been taking all the advise and shooting the bale working on form. I was working on form today at 7 yards and this was my best 5 arrow group. It is making a big difference.
Thanks
(http://i491.photobucket.com/albums/rr272/boblamonte/arrows/form.jpg)