Trad Gang
Main Boards => The Shooters FORM Board => Topic started by: rickmasters on November 19, 2012, 06:39:00 PM
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Hi, I am new to Trad bows. I have hunted with a compound and gun for about 20 years and shot many whitetails with bow and gun. I recently have been wanting to get back to fieldcraft and have always wanted a longbow. I started watching some videos and reading up and now am hooked on traditional hunting. That being said I don't know crap about longbows. I thought it would be simple but it seems very complicated. I bought a few used bows and am trying to get arrows and there is a ton of different info that the arrow guy needed to know with regard to centering of draw string etc. Anyway, sorry for going on in my first post. My question is how long should you be able to hold a longbow at anchor? I am trying to figure out what weight will be good for me to start? Thanks
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Welcome to the gang :)
Some guys don't hold very long, me I usually hold 2-4 seconds then let go. I am sure others will chime in so welcome again and glad you found us :)
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yea i hold at least 2-4secs. however long it takes me to get steady and focus on my spot. welcome to the gang
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2-4 seconds for me too. If I could give you advice based on my own (bad) experience - hold at anchor from the start. I started with the 'touch and go' release and it morphed into target panic that took me years to beat.
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I tend to shoot quickly once at anchor. My finger touches anchor and the arrow is away.
Welcome!
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Originally posted by rickmasters:
My question is how long should you be able to hold a longbow at anchor?
How long should you be able to hold a longbow at anchor is a lot different than how long you should hold while shooting a longbow. I think some of the previous responses are mixing the two.
Me - I'm a touch and go type of shooter (aka snap shooter). As soon as I hit anchor the arrow is loosed. Now I can hold at anchor without shaking for probably 30 seconds or more. That's with a 59# bow. I don't know if there's any hard rule, but you'll definitely drop from what you shoot with a compound. When I converted to traditional bows I was shooting an 85# compound and found that 55 - 60# was a comfortable weight in a traditional bow for me.
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I also hold for two to four seconds. In my opinion if you can't draw and hold steady for a few seconds then you need a lighter bow.
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I hold for 2 seconds usually, sometimes less when field shooting - but lately I've been training to hold for longer - up to ten seconds - to build up my endurance. I don't shoot my best when shooting like that, but at some point while hunting the ability to do that might come in handy.
All that said, there are some guys who barely touch anchor before the arrow is away - those are usually instinctive shooters.
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Welcome from Indiana! :wavey:
I would say the answer to your ? would be long enough to get off an accurate shot. There are many variables to picking a starting wieght. Most will suggest a pretty low # to get form down first. I went from a 73# compound to a 45# recurve then to wieghts in the 60's and 50's. It took me a few years to figure out what I really like. Attending a few large trad events would have helped considerably.
Good luck on your journey! Rob
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No holding-just letter rip
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You need to be able to hold at full draw for atleast 10 seconds without shaking. That said almost nobody holds 10 seconds to shoot. Most guys hold under 5 seconds when shooting. My standard hold is somewhere around 3-4 seconds. However depending on how game presents itself I can hold longer or shorter time periods.
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I used to not hold at anchor at all. About a year ago I started holding 2-4 secs, my accuracy great improved. Especially on longer distances.
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5 to 10 seconds. I'm very methodical. Works best for me.
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Pull to your anchor point and release. As mentioned in the zen of archery, it should be like a raindrop rolling off a leaf.
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I hold 5-7
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My mentor taught me: "draw slow release slow, draw fast release fast."
Has to do with the ryhtym of the shot. If you're snapping at a bunny taking off you swing up and release the instant you hit anchor. If you're facing a target bale you have more time.
And, sometimes, you're waiting for a deer to take a step and clear cover you have to hold several seconds. Though usually trying to hold a drawn bow is MUCH worse than raising the bow and waiting to draw and take the shot at the proper time. At least IMHO. The thing about hunting is the situaions are varied and require adaptability.
Practice them all.
Targets and stumping I hold 1-2 seconds.
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I was just talking/teaching my 9 year old cousin about that today. I believe you should be able to hold it for a 10 count just in case but for a shot a 2-4 count. My cousin was snap shooting and missing horrible so i made him do a 2 count and he greatly improved. My last shot of every practice is a looong hold to practice that and to build strength. Just me. Good luck and welcome to the gang!
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google "Rick Welch"
his style of vshooting has done more than anything else to help my archery.
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The "Masters of the Barebow" DVD set helped my shooting out considerably, I would recommend that to get a good idea about the different styles and techniques. For me it is a solid two point anchor and hold until I feel settled and confident, which is usually a few seconds or longer at anchor.
In regards to draw weight to start at that is a tough question that only you can answer. But whatever bow you can get correct form with during long shooting sessions to start is the best (which is usually lighter) and then work up once form is down. 40# is probably a good starting point.
Good luck and welcome!
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I shoot bows that I can hold as little a two seconds or as long as necessary for an animal to clear for a shot. I shoot 45 to 50 pound bows and find that they are more than powerful enough for all the animals I have taken. If I shot any heavier equipment I could not do this.
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I'm lucky if I get to full draw. Chronic target panic. If I do make it to full draw it is only for a second at best. I guess I am what you would call a "snap shooter".
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I release when I get to anchor, no holding.
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Shoot well and feels more natural to snap shoot, but if necessary hold it back until a animal clears for a shot. I haven't found myself to be any more or less accurate doing either, but shooting faster just feels right for some reason.
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If I hold any longer than one or two seconds I start to louse concentration.
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Originally posted by huntnmuleys:
Shoot well and feels more natural to snap shoot, but if necessary hold it back until a animal clears for a shot. I haven't found myself to be any more or less accurate doing either, but shooting faster just feels right for some reason.
X2
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2-5 seconds for me
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I haven't counted but, a few seconds... maybe two to five or so.
I've been working on making this part of my form: I find I'm more accurate when I pause long enough to check my form each shot - alignment, finger pressure, back tension, push pull, etc. Then, there's often a moment when my sighting/focus becomes kind of lucid, and that's always a good shot.
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I think if you stand in front of a target an try different holding times you will find one that works for you.you dont have to let go before your ready hone in on the spot an hold your fourm dont drop your bow arm.dont try to see where your arrow hit it will throw your shot.just follow through.5-7 seconds my seem like a long time but it is not.
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Depends on the situation. In the back yard and when shooting 3d 2-4 seconds is probably my norm. When hunting I have had to hold longer waiting for the right shot. I am not a snap shooter, I have tried it and just do not like it. The exception being if I am shooting a selfbow I will try not to hold at full draw for more than a second.
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I like to draw when an animal cant see me. This doesnt always occur, but its my preference.
So I practice holding as long as I can offseason and at the target butt, often not even releasing an arrow.I like to do this at a different time than actual shooting. Its my strength/form builder, not my shooting practice. Just in case the deer stops or is slow showing itself, which happens often. The deer are skittish around here and will pick you off drawing a bow very easily.
During hunting, I have no idea how long, as said here already as long as it takes. Sometimes a second or two, sometimes seems like an eternity.
But I at least have the ability to hold if I need to. Your strength will increase very quickly when you practice holding, not worrying about the shot itself.
When you start to shake, you have held too long to shoot accurately. Which is okay while practicing, but if you are drawn on an animal, you want to reconsider releasing an arrow at it at this point.
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I practice holding at least 5 seconds when I shoot at foam. My goal is to hope that in the real world when everything is moving a lot faster I hold for at least 3 seconds...So far it has worked well...
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I'll only hold for a second, once I hit my anchor I let her rip. I have 2 anchor points, but I've found that if I hold much longer then I'm second guessing my self and moving the bow all over. I'm much more accurate and consistant when I hit anchor and release.
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I currently practice blind bale shooting 90% of the time and hold for 5 - 10 seconds before releasing. At least once while practicing I will hold and let back down without releasing to exercise even more mental control. When actually shooting at game, I only hold for a second or two.
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I find I shoot my best holding a good long time...getting to multiple anchors, relaxing, stabilizing, and really focusing on a spot. And that is easier said than done at times.
BTW, "a good long time" in reality is seconds. It may feel long...but it isn't. So holding will not get in the way or diminish your hunting.
And, as with all shooting - trad is no different - good shooting requires consistent form and form matters more than any other variable.
So whether you hold or not, try to find a method for consistent form.
Have fun and welcome.
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I hold 2 to 4 seconds I think Rick welch says 2 to 3 seconds if I remember correct.
Larry
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If you want to know how long you're holding at anchor, or if you want to practice holding for a particular amount of time, they make some neat metronome aps for the iPhone. I have one called Tempo, and use it now whenever I practice on the blank bale. You just turn it on and set it somewhere close enough to hear the clicks, and it will count off the seconds until you stop it.
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I hold between 2-5 seconds when I'm practicing. In a hunting situation I do whatever is required maybe 8-10 seconds if necessary. I also practice form shooting so I can be as instinctive as possible when shooting. Thanks and great post.
Kenny :archer2:
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I find that the more I consentrate before I draw the bow, the less time I hold.
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A split second when shooting instinctive up close and no more then 1-2 secs when gapping at longer distances.
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thats what i mean , mark land, although somtimes at loger distances i get the feel and can shoot fast. It all depends on what my consentration level is at that time.
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Snap shooter here, though I can hold for a few seconds if need be. Prefer not to.
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I can hold for 10 seconds, then start shaking (47 # recurve). I suggest a light enough draw weight to allow you accuracy, develop your form, and practice a lot. However, your strength will build and you may want a heavier bow within a few months. Good Luck
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I go ala G Fred. My spot is acquired long before I reach full draw, do I have no hesitation. But then again I am not the best shot either.
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I would say 2-3 seconds at anchor as an average. I seem to feel comfortable at that point.
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Until I see my sight window with my spot inside it, 1-3 seconds.
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I release when I reach my anchor, no holding. I have found that when trying to hold for at least 2 seconds I seem to lose accuracy. For me, a slow, smooth, and consistant draw is vital to my accuracy.
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About this long.....unless the game dictates I hold and reengage back tension when the shot window opens again.
Isolation repeat & slo-mo (http://www.tradgang.com/videos/tg/tgshot91.wmv)
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Hold as long as it takes to get the arrow to the spot youre wanting to hit....sometimes i hold for less than a second....I ALWAYS get to anchor,settle in,let the bow settle aim the arrow,then pull thru my release.....
However long it takes.
Dewayne Martin
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With targets you can hold at anchor until the cows come home and the only pressure you'll feel is what your mind and/or draw weight will generate. The bullseye isn't looking at you and it isn't going to go away. But with animals and especially when hunting thick cover, if you can't pick a spot and then hit close to it within a few seconds of drawing your bow then the critter will often move off, or move enough to ruin what had been a golden opportunity. A controlled but reasonably quick shot has definate advantages in hunting situations and like any aspect of shooting it just takes practice to get effective with it. I sure wouldn't want to have to RELY on a 5 or 6 second hold-at-anchor style to make shots on game.
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I hold like Fred Bear..just dont shoot hit like him :bigsmyl:
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I have posted very little in six years. My opinion may bring the wrath of some--it is only one opinion that I have earned over a life time of doing this. THE LONGER YOU HOLD AT ANCHOR, THE MORE YOU ARE AIMING AS OPPOSED TO PURELY INSTINCTIVE SHOOTING. I do not play golf, but if you watch the great golfers of our time you will see ZERO hesitation at the pinnacle of the back swing. I have never seen much difference in the two actions. The golfer and the archer use one implement to drive an object forward. Putting is even more obvious because of the precision. If you are holding at anchor, you are thinking. If you think, you aim. Snap shooting gets some sort of bad rap. Is this not truly and purely instinctive? I AM NOT SAYING YOUR ARE WRONG FOR HOLDING LONGER AT FULL DRAW. I am saying that a person should not be discouraged for aiming, drawing,(or is drawing, aiming...hmm), anchoring, and releasing in one fluid, consistent motion without pausing to think about it. TRY THIS: SOME NIGHT WHEN THERE IS NO MOON SET UP A TARGET IN YOUR GARAGE. LIGHT A BIG EMERGENCY CANDLE AND SET IT IN FRONT OF THE TARGET. WALK OUT ON THE DRIVE WAY WITH A SINGLE ARROW AND SHOOT OUT THE FLAME AT 20 YARDS. SEE HOW LONG YOU WANT TO HOLD WHEN IT IS JUST YOU AND THE SMALLEST PARTICLE TO SHOOT AT--YOU CANNOT SEE THE BOW OR THE ARROW OR YOUR WIFE'S SUV. DO THIS AT MIDNIGHT SO IF YOU MISS, THE RACKET OF AN ARROW BOUNCING AROUND (gotta love a little pressure) THE GARAGE AWAKENS EVERYONE IN THE HOUSE. This topic is like religion, no one wants to hear there's is wrong. NOT SAYING THAT.
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Did I mention that you need to turn all the lights off in the garage for the aforementioned exercise? Hahaha!
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Originally posted by McDave:
If you want to know how long you're holding at anchor, or if you want to practice holding for a particular amount of time, they make some neat metronome aps for the iPhone. I have one called Tempo, and use it now whenever I practice on the blank bale. You just turn it on and set it somewhere close enough to hear the clicks, and it will count off the seconds until you stop it.
Thanks for the app suggestion. I just downloaded it to my phone. Now I don't have to ask my daughter to stop what she is doing to time my holds.
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I agree with Stumpkiller I do what the situation dictates. I am a fast shooter by nature. It is the most natural method for me to shoot. I reach anchor focus and she is gone. Now with that said I had a back problem and a slight shoulder issue about 1 year ago and some bad habits started to form. I got to a point where I was short drawing trying to shoot when I should have taken some time off from shooting. My posture changed my head was moving forward all of which is bad news. I have spent the last few weeks working on my form all over again. Posture, head position reaching full draw using back tension settle in and focus before releasing the arrow.
With the help of one of our members here I have really made a effort to make these a priority in my shooting routine. Thanks Moebow! One thing he had me do is practice these things but I do not shoot at a target. I blind bale or just practice in a mirror. I did cheat one day and took a few shots at a lemon on the ground, I shocked myself I drew the bow, held at anchor settled in, focused and let her go. My need to release on contact with my anchor or failure to reach full draw and anchor was gone. I will still probably shoot fast when I go back to my regular shooting style. I just won't feel the urge to release before I am truly ready. Through my practice I can now hold for a full 20 seconds for a few reps and when I do shoot into a bale my avg hold is 1.5-1.8 sec and if I need to can hold longer.
Training and shooting are two different animals and I have a much better feel for both after my change.
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I did 6 when I was getting used to my 62, but now about 3-4 is nice.