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Main Boards => Dangerous Game => Topic started by: MountainTool21 on January 18, 2010, 07:50:00 PM

Title: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: MountainTool21 on January 18, 2010, 07:50:00 PM
Just wondering what the proper set up for Alaska Moose and Brown bear would be? My basic setup for most all of my hunts is as follows- 60" longbow 55lb @28", whether Im shooting carbon or wood it's roughly a 600 grain arrow. Im going to be hunting the fall of 2011 and want to start preparing my rig. I will be using a 2 blade broadhead, either a Grizzly or aboyer broadhead. Im wondering if I have enough rig to penetrate both species? Any and all help is greatly appreciated. Thanks again Gang- Andrew
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: oxnam on January 18, 2010, 08:11:00 PM
Never hunted either, but there had been a recent debate on similar setup for elk.  Many thought it was light for elk which would make it really like for moose or bear.  I would opt for at least another 10 lbs for moose, and probably even more for bear.  They have been killed with less but I don't think it would normally be advised.
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: Moosehunter on January 18, 2010, 10:16:00 PM
I have hunted both, and they are both tough critters to take down. I personally use a Blacktail set at 70lb. Your set-up may be a little light, but stick to what you are comfortable with. Moose are very thick skinned and do not go down easy. Even with a rifle. I've killed a dozen or so moose and they are one of my favorite big animals to hunt. Make sure you trust the person backing you up, cause things can and will get exciting very fast. Good luck on your hunt!
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: Bowshot on January 18, 2010, 10:25:00 PM
I have shot moose with bow weights ranging from 45#- 75#, lighter weights due to shoulder injuries, 55-60# works, you need to be close and have everything flying straight and sharp. Your arrow weight is pretty close to what I shoot. Tha Alaskan moose are larger than the moose around Central Alberta so I would move up in bow weight a little if possible, as long as you can maintain accuracy. I can't speak on the bears as I have only shot blackbears.
I think Fred Eichler shot his with less than 55#.

Terry
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: Ragnarok Forge on January 18, 2010, 11:33:00 PM
Focus on optimizing your arrows.  You already mentioned a shoulder injury so I doubt more poundage is an option here.  Read the most recent Ashby reports and make your arrows more efficient, and get your arrow tune perfect.  55lbs is plenty if you get close and put the shot where it counts.  You will get better penetration than a compounder with light arrows if you optimize your arrows.  I would also look at pushing my arrow weight above 650 grains, this is the bone breaking threshold.
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: MountainTool21 on January 19, 2010, 10:39:00 PM
Thank you guys for the help and suggestions. It is greatly appreciated. Im already considering a 60lb+ bow, maybe something in the 63lb -66lb range. It's interesting, i feel more comfortable with a heavier bow, case in point is my 68" 63lb Adcock 2 piece longbow. thank you again, Drew
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: akdd on January 20, 2010, 06:58:00 AM
I have yet to take a moose with traditional equipment. I used a 56# @ 29" long bow this year but just could not get a moose to where if felt like I had a good shot. In the last 30 years I have taken three moose with wheels and a bunch with a rifle. If you hit one of them through the lungs they will not go far.  Get close and wait for a good shot and 55# will probably be enough. I think that you are on the right track at least 600 grains and a two blade broad head. You could contact Alaska Bow Hunting Supply they can give you some recommendations. They also have some pretty interesting broad heads. From few dealing I have had with them they seem to be pretty good people.  http://www.alaskabowhunting.com/
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: kbaamigo on January 21, 2010, 11:06:00 AM
I took my first canada moose this year with a 64# @ 29.5" pronghorn with 2219 shaft and magnus 160 2 blade. Total weight was 657 gr. Shot was 40 yd and hit low shoulder penetrating into off shoulder. I felt very good about this combo. I think the key is a heavy shaft with good FOC.
Kent
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: MountainTool21 on January 24, 2010, 01:41:00 AM
Thank you Kent and AKDD
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: amar911 on January 24, 2010, 11:14:00 PM
I have no personal experience in shooting either moose or brown bear with a bow and arrow. Fred Eichler has shot most of the grand slam of North American game with his Palmer 54# recurve, including brown bear and a large Alaska-Yukon moose. So, if you are using an efficient 55# bow with the arrow weight and broadheads you mention, have everything well tuned, and hit the animals in the proper spot, you should have no trouble getting good penetration. Fred's moose was a long ways off when he shot, but his arrow was well placed and still penetrated well. I am not sure what kind of longbow you have, but not every bow is terribly efficient. Ed Ashby had about an 83# longbow that shot the same arrow at the same velocity as a more efficient 65# bow. So, you can't go strictly by draw weight. Try shooting your arrows through a chronograph and make sure your bow is getting good velocities. A fast 55# bow will be enough. A slow 60# bow may not be. If you can shoot a 63# bow better than a 55# bow, by all means use the heavier bow, assuming they are both equally efficient.

Allan
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: Jerry Wald on January 31, 2010, 08:02:00 PM
Your setup is just fine but like the others said I would try to dial in an arrows about 600 grains - 650 minimum.

Your longbow the 63# one would do the trick for sure, but if you can't pull it I would stick with the 55# and up the arrow weight.

My bud got a nice moose ( we have some dandies here - big bodies) and he took it with a 53# lonbow that he made himself (lots of glass and shoots fast) and a 580 grain arrow. He shot him at 12 yards and got a pass through.

I am not sure  if you would be wanting to shoot at 35+ yards though.

Jer Bear
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: fentiger on January 31, 2010, 11:21:00 PM
Agree with others regarding efficiency and "rated" poundage. My Hoyt limbs are expensive poor performers  compared to my Black Max Samicks. But have sneaking suspision that BM limbs are heavier than rated. Please, please no poundage! Would prefer arrow weight and speed!
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: JF on February 06, 2010, 05:08:00 PM
I made a complete pass through on a large brown bear(26- 10/16) with a 52# recurve,600 gn.ceader arrow at 30" draw,30 yd.shot, I would not hesitate on a moose with the same bow and a Grizzly Elgrande.John
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: Rick P on February 06, 2010, 06:21:00 PM
I hunt with a 60# Kodiak TD, arrow dynamics hammer head and a 150grn Alaska bow hunting supply samurai, total arrow weight is just above 600grn. 55# is plenty for moose, hundreds if not thousands of moose have fallen to a 40-45 pound bows before the 50 pound weight limit was instated. I also totally disagree about them being hard to kill! Lots of moose in the bush have been killed with a .223! In my experience put it in the boiler room wait 20-40 minutes and get ready to work harder than you ever have in the field.

Bears are another story. Doesn't matter what poundage your bow is you will need either a back up you trust with your life or a side arm you are proficient enough to risk your life with. 55# and your rig will definitely get the job done but arrows kill via massive hemorrhaging, that gives the bear enough time to take you with him! I have not had a serious charge yet but I focus on black bear, I do have 3 friends who had very close encounters with Mr. Brown last year. All three had to use there side arm to finish the job!
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: ak3blade on February 14, 2010, 10:51:00 AM
I hunt with a 60# Morrison TD Recurve, MFX shafts with 100 grain brass inserts and 145-150 grain broadheads. Haven't gotten a moose or a bear yet,but thanks to the many words of encouragement from the people on this sight and those on ***********, I feel very confident with my setup. This isn't a brown bear, but as Rick stated in his post..."you will need either a back up you trust with your life or a side arm you are proficient enough to risk your life with." I was the back up for this hunt...this is my brother's first big game kill with his set up.
  (http://i387.photobucket.com/albums/oo316/wnaskoak/IMG_3177.jpg)
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: MountainTool21 on February 14, 2010, 02:31:00 PM
JF, Rick, and AkBlade- thank you for helping me out. Im shooting everyday with my Adcock 60# longbow and am still deciding on some extra limbs from 2 different bowyers. I remember Fred Eichler telling me about both his Moose and Bear- his eyes became much more serious when discussing the Bear. I've been thinking about chasing a big bear for  a few years now and will hope to get an opportunity in 2011 when I head north to Alaska. if all goes well, i will get my first chance at a black bear hunt in Manitoba later this year. I can't wait. to the guys who have responded, again I can't thank you enough. Enjoy you day and go get it!
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: THE LYNX on February 14, 2010, 05:36:00 PM
My set-up is a little heavier than what is needed, but it can be very deadly. I have a 65# recurve, shooting a 29 1/4" 2020 Legacy. Up front in an aluminum insert is an Abowyer Brown Bear and steel adapter. The Brown Bear and adapter weight 245 grs. The whole arrow is 685 grs. What is important is the arrow tuning and flight. What you are working on will do the job.
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: Bowwild on February 28, 2010, 03:49:00 AM
I know it show go without saying, but be very careful about increasing bow weight. Proper shooting form is your foundation. If while trying to shoot heavier weights you degrade your form, reduced accuracy will be the least of your troubles. Way too many people get chased out of archery by woes brought on by being over-bowed.

A study (probably a survey) was done in Canada more than 25 years ago.  While the numbers I'm going to relay are very "rounded" this is what the survey reported regarding double-lung results on bow shot game:

Whitetail deer -- 150 yards to recovery
Elk -- 100 yards
Moose & Bear -- 50 yards
Cougar -- Zero yards (fall dead from tree)

The whitetail's speed of departure allows it to cover a bunch of ground ...dead.

Personally, it has been the very rare deer that I've had travel more than 70 yards with double lung.
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: Granite Mtn on March 01, 2010, 01:56:00 AM
I have killed both moose and grizzly with 70ish self bows shooting ash arrows with home made trade points made from old skill saw blades.  My draw length is only 26 inches which is a huge factor.  Shoot the bow you like, a heavy arrow STRONG broadhead and don"t buy in to the bs carry a 44. mag you will be fine.
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: Granite Mtn on March 01, 2010, 01:59:00 AM
Call me if you have any questions (907)301 2800
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: jrchambers on March 11, 2010, 12:10:00 AM
what you have is fine, dont wory about penetration on the bear, just hit the right spot, their hide is much thiner than a moose and the bone structure is not quite as stiff, they have alot of muscle but a sharp head and true flyin arow knows what to do with that.
for the moose i would say you are right at the bottom of what i would use, maybe try to find a little skinyer long 2blade, if you center punch a rib you may not get in,  make shure it is broadside or ,some may argue, a good quarter away so you can go behind the ribs completely.

i also shoot a 63lb at 28 adcock but i pull 30.5 i havnt shot it long and it is 5 lbs heavyer than what i used to shoot,  it will mess with your form if you over do it. 2011 is a ways off so you could work into it if you shoulder holds up, just think quality over quantaty, if you find yourself tired and falling apart Stop shooting and start fresh the next day.
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: MountainTool21 on March 15, 2010, 12:43:00 AM
JR thanks a bunch man. I appreciate your reply. Thought about coming up there this year to fly fish and survey the area!!
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: Norseman on March 15, 2010, 01:43:00 PM
I think it has all been said here. You have enough bow. Keep the broadhead shaving sharp, and your shots to a max of 20 yds; put it in the vitals and you will have yourself both trophies. Being good with a lighter bow is better than poor with a heavy bow. It is all about the shot placement and the penentration will be there with that setup.
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: tawmio on July 14, 2010, 01:09:00 AM
Bowwild, important point, Form is the very base, i dosent take much for the body to try and compensate for the heavier bow weight by changing form. Group your hunting arrows w. broadhead (not target arrows) at 20yards and you can take your bow hunting. If not dont
Tommy
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: vernon on July 14, 2010, 09:02:00 PM
I think your setup is fine.  Never shot a moose or gizzly though.  Have plenty of buddies who have shot wyoming moose with low 50# bows.  I shot a big mature bull last year with a  #54 longbow and stuck it in the off shoulder.  Like mentioned get close, wait for a good shot, and pick a spot.
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: MountainTool21 on July 21, 2010, 09:34:00 PM
thanks again guys. Just hitting my stride with my 60lb @ 28" Cari-bow. It is sending my 600 grain CE heritage 250's down range quickly!!
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: MountainTool21 on July 25, 2010, 10:13:00 PM
Im going to try this set up on some Manitoba black bear first. I was told yesterday at my local archery shop in Denver that blackies are nothing like brown bear in terms of  being thin-skinned and don't run far after being hit right. Andrew
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: Steve H. on July 26, 2010, 05:00:00 PM
On the bottom side of light for moose but more than adequate for grizzlies.  My quickest blackie kill went 25 times farther than my brown bear, same bow, similar arrows.
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: cacciatore on July 27, 2010, 04:13:00 PM
I love your stories of moose and brown bear,lucky Alaskans.
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: plentycoupe on July 29, 2010, 01:08:00 AM
I killed a full grown cow moose with a 55@ 28 Habu Viperkan with less than 600grn arrow and a magnus stinger broadhead.

I have seen my friend John shot a moose with a 56@29 black widow longbow and same broadhead. Complete passthrough and stuck in the pines on the other side.

Two years prior he had another complete passthrough with the same set up.
His arrows are just over 600.

I would tell you how easy it killed a grizz this year but couldn't get any closer than 50yds before the breeding pair winded us.

55lbs will kill em cleanly all day long as long as you do your part.

Use what ever you are the most comfortable with and have fun killin them critters.
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: Steve H. on July 30, 2010, 12:00:00 AM
Pines? PC, we need to have a tree ID course ; ^ )
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: weedwacker on August 31, 2010, 10:07:00 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Bowshot:
I have shot moose with bow weights ranging from 45#- 75#, lighter weights due to shoulder injuries, 55-60# works, you need to be close and have everything flying straight and sharp. Your arrow weight is pretty close to what I shoot. Tha Alaskan moose are larger than the moose around Central Alberta so I would move up in bow weight a little if possible, as long as you can maintain accuracy. I can't speak on the bears as I have only shot blackbears.
I think Fred Eichler shot his with less than 55#.

Terry
Exactly what I was thinking.  For some reason the number 57 is coming to mind for Fred's bear setup.  Worked plenty fine for him.
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: michaelschwister on January 09, 2011, 08:02:00 AM
If you are shooting a 63# adcock you have enough for ANYTHING with the right arrow. Read some of ashby's writing on the matter.  I have a 73# R/D longbow that performs well enough with the proper arrow for cape and asiatic buff according to the numbers most agree as required.  I had a 61# adcock that significantly out performed that bow!!!, just could not shoot it as consistantly as I liked, very finicky to form.

Mike
Title: Re: MOOSE & GRIZZLY SETUP
Post by: yukon254 on January 10, 2011, 11:37:00 PM
your set-up will be fine. I guide bowhunters to 4 or 5 Yukon moose each year and after 25 years have found them to be one of the easier animals to bring down. Elk and Mule deer are much tougher IMO. obviously shot placement is still important. Lots of moose are killed each year with a 50# bow.