Post by: trashwood on November 18, 2003, 06:36:00 PM
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/snake.jpg
Rusty Yeeeeeeks! Craine
Post by: StanM on November 18, 2003, 06:42:00 PM
Looking forward to the tutorial. As for the snakes, would love to back a bow with one, but you go ahead and kill 'em, eh? ;)
Stan
Post by: AZStickman on November 18, 2003, 06:55:00 PM
Post by: Timo on November 18, 2003, 06:55:00 PM
Looking forward to the sinew job! :thumbsup:
Post by: trashwood on November 18, 2003, 07:48:00 PM
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/sinew1twwn.jpg
Now for goodness sakes pound enough sinew. get your glue to 120 degrees; i use a thermometer. Have a pot of clean water for your hands.
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/sinew2twwn.jpg
'Em boys that say sinew don't add zip to your bow...jsut ain't done it right. We have the bow tip on blocks to add some pre-stress. Make has got the bow tied down with stout line in the middle of the relfex area. I will add zip, real zip
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/sinew3twwn.jpg
more later this even I got dinner with a pretty little red head....... :D
Rusty
Post by: the Ferret on November 18, 2003, 08:24:00 PM
You talking about having dinner with Bear? How's he doing? Tell him I said hi :D
Post by: wingnut on November 18, 2003, 09:07:00 PM
About the snakes, Rusty called and I went over and helped skin them. He doesn't like snakes and it takes a real long time to skin when ya won't touch.
Anyway bow is looking good. Rusty is going to let it dry at room temp for a day or two then in the heat box. I will take it home in a week and put in my box till it's ready to finish tillering.
Mike
Post by: deerfly on November 18, 2003, 09:24:00 PM
Post by: trashwood on November 18, 2003, 09:38:00 PM
more in a bit
Rusty
Post by: trashwood on November 18, 2003, 10:06:00 PM
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/sinew4twwn.jpg
Wingnut and I double team the job. He makes the bumdles out of da pile of sinew and handles them to me.
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/sinew5atwwn.jpg
I don't per-wet the sinew in water. I like to soak it good in glue till it is saturated and softened. Now ya can my a thin ribbon out of it by squeezing it between your fingers.
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/sinew5twwn.jpg
Here is about the size bunble we go for.
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/sinew6twwn.jpg
ys with me so far......dinner was really nice ;)
Rusty
Post by: Timo on November 18, 2003, 10:10:00 PM
? why's Mike always wearin that ninja band?Wouldn't those sweat drippins add a little more magic?
Post by: '46 on November 18, 2003, 10:37:00 PM
Now, being I'm a married man, I have ta sinew in the basement or the garage, don't get to sinew up in the dining room with all them windows and nice sheer curtains and stuff :D :D ..Good thread.
geo...like to sinew once in the dining room like Rusty...nagel
Post by: trashwood on November 18, 2003, 10:38:00 PM
here to two good courses
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/sinew7twwn.jpg
I think it is important to press it well into the bottom layer or back. Wingnut put it down. I come along with my messey fingers and press it flat and down into the back or bottom layer while he gets another bundle.
We like to bring it round the edge of the back so we round the back edge pretty well
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/sinew8twwn.jpg
Pressed and geled. up close
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/sinew9twwn.jpg
Listen when can put on more while it is wet, after it is dry. ya can file it down to make it smooth, ya can file it down and put more on.
Ya can't mess the stuff up.....but the stuff is messy
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/sinew10twwn.jpg
Rusty
Post by: trashwood on November 18, 2003, 10:45:00 PM
File it, sand it, leave it only, put more on, take more off.......it is the no fail backing that will indeed add zip to your bow.
Rusty -this ain't rocket science, jut get it on and get it stuck- CRaine
Post by: deerfly on November 18, 2003, 11:02:00 PM
Post by: deerfly on November 18, 2003, 11:09:00 PM
Post by: trashwood on November 18, 2003, 11:32:00 PM
Rusty -liked to finger paint and jump in mud hole when young- Craine
Post by: AZStickman on November 19, 2003, 07:36:00 AM
Post by: trashwood on November 19, 2003, 07:44:00 AM
On most of the sinew bows I that them to about 16" and a real good tiller there.
Rusty
Post by: trashwood on November 19, 2003, 07:57:00 AM
this makes hitting target weight more difficult.
Some fellows string their bows backwards to hold the pre-stress relfex in while they sinew them. This works great too. This method puts a lot of reflex in the bows and it is distritubed more evenly thru the limbs. I like to add the reflex more like the r/d that is more toward the tip.
Well the point is if ya string your bow backard to hold the relfex in ya have to tiller it pretty far down the draw length. So I guess I'd say get it tillered pretty well how ever ya do it.
Sinew applied to a flat limb will add some zip to the bow cause it will pull the limb into a little reflex on it own and it will stop the natural amount of set. A sinwed limb put into pre-stressed reflex will add !!!ZIP!!!. The sinew will hodl the reflex. I have even had sinew lift the limbs off the blocks as it dried. Ya know ya'as adding flue to the FIRE!
Rusty
Post by: '46 on November 19, 2003, 09:05:00 AM
Never happened to me but it drove Cooter crazy on a couple of bows he did, and a couple of guys posting on the LW last year had the same thing happen. ...What do you think?
Post by: trashwood on November 19, 2003, 11:49:00 AM
What I'm looking for is a bow that will delivery a 10gr per pound of draw area at 160 fps. 160 fps is my natual "groove". I know we talk about 180fps bows. at my 26" natural draw I don't get them at draw wieghts I want to shoot. I'm plumb happy, plumb tickeled pink with a fine shooting sinew bow in the 50 to 55 pound range sending a 600 gr arrow 160fps. A bow that is well shot in, no tricks on the speed trap without too much reflex, good sweet shooter.......nice tidy and short.......that is what i'm about with sinew.
I leave the fire breathing missle lunchers to the better shots in the group
Rusty
Post by: trashwood on November 19, 2003, 11:55:00 AM
Rusty
Post by: Madpigslayer on November 19, 2003, 03:14:00 PM
Quote
Originally posted by trashwood:this might be a small point Mr. Rusty Sir...but barfly is going to Killdeer, not Deerfly...sorry about that deerfly! (I just gotta try and help out when I can....haha)
deerfly - 'em little coon tials is going on your bow Barfly :)
more in a bit
Rusty
Post by: trashwood on November 19, 2003, 10:46:00 PM
Rusty
Post by: trashwood on November 20, 2003, 08:37:00 AM
I'll get ya a pic tomorrow
Rusty
Post by: trashwood on November 20, 2003, 08:44:00 AM
If ya look real close ya can see the dark belly lam of garlite in some of the pics.
Stay tuned. gonna be interesting to see how she flings an arrow
Rusty
Post by: wingnut on November 20, 2003, 03:34:00 PM
Garolite is a phenolic that Joe Don turned me on too. To tell the truth, I'm trying to get down a design for a hunting bow for myself using baleen on the belly. The stuff is so darn expensive I decided to do my experimenting with the garolite. JD says it works a lot like the baleen and I can make a lam for a bow for about $4.
We'll see when it's dry.
Mike
Post by: AZStickman on November 21, 2003, 01:35:00 PM
Post by: Adam Keiper on November 22, 2003, 01:08:00 AM
Throwing out another tip, I accidentally discovered a handy way to pre-soak my sinew bundles in warm water. I kept my hide glue in a plastic grocery store container that I floated in a pot of hot water. I kept a short (8") 5/16" dowel floating alongside the plastic container to mix the hide glue after running upstairs periodically to nuke it. Anyway, I found I could drape 4 or 5 sinew bundles over the floating dowel to get them pliable while I worked on laying in another bundle. The dowel kept them neat and tidy...alot easier than having to fish discheveled bundles from the bottom of the pot. :wavey:
BTW, Think 2 weeks in a warm, dry basement is long enough to allow 2 layers of sinew to dry? I'm trying to get this bow done for Christmas.
Post by: trashwood on November 22, 2003, 01:13:00 AM
BTW when "I" talk about a sinew bow. I'm not talking about an osage bow with sinew on it. I talking about a sinew bow with sinew on it
for example
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/turkeystick.jpg
50" ntn 1&1/2 static lift in the tips, 62#@26" (i draw it 26") est 2000 shots thru the bow, 3 hunting season and one 3D season......1" of set thru mid bow. now that is a sinew bow mate
Rusty
Post by: trashwood on November 22, 2003, 01:23:00 AM
Rusty
Post by: trashwood on November 22, 2003, 10:36:00 AM
http://stavestobows.homestead.com/files/sinew11twwn.jpg
Put her in the drying box and let her load put the heat. She storing it up to fling 'em arrows
Rusty
Post by: deerfly on November 22, 2003, 12:11:00 PM
thanks Rusty, gotta' work one of these into the schedule and feel the "magic" myself. :)
OK Calvin, I got yer number bucko... ;)
Post by: Madpigslayer on November 22, 2003, 01:33:00 PM
:wavey:
Post by: trashwood on November 22, 2003, 06:07:00 PM
Rusty
Post by: Madpigslayer on November 24, 2003, 11:36:00 AM
...oh yeah. "makin sinew heap work" think I gave myseld tennis elbow pounding out them things!
Post by: Bowjunkie on November 24, 2003, 12:24:00 PM
The bow I hunted with this year was a snakey, sinewed, diamondback-backed, Torges-style osage bow. Sinewed it straight, it took about 1" of reflex when it dried, which it's since lost. It's now straight again and holding there.
- love that smell
Post by: wingnut on November 24, 2003, 12:30:00 PM
I used artificial sinew to tie it down. Just drill two holes in the board not the bow. One on each side of where the center of the bow rides and thread the art sinew through the holes and around the bow. Tie it down tight and when the sinews dry, just clip it off tight to the sinew on the back. Works good and it will be under the grip.
you could probably do two bows with the sinew you have pounded so I think it's about right.
Are you using hideglue or knox?
Mike
It's at my place in the dry box at 90 degrees and 30% humidity for the next week. We'll take a look then.
Post by: Madpigslayer on November 24, 2003, 01:38:00 PM
one more quick question if I might...on these bendy handled sinew bows, is there much more thickness in the handle area? and what are you gentlemen preffering for handle wraps on these type of bows?
...I will be using (store bought) hide glue too BTW.
Post by: trashwood on November 24, 2003, 02:10:00 PM
Rusty
Post by: wingnut on November 24, 2003, 02:23:00 PM
DON'T DO IT!! No dang pink handles allowed. That Trashwood needs to get in touch with his male side. (not that male side) Anyway a wrapped grip with heavy leather or cork under is the way to go. They look and feel good. A nice black or brown lacing will do fine.
Mike
@#$@#$ pink hand wrap, next thing he'll be putting snake skin on and namin them Lucy
Post by: Madpigslayer on November 24, 2003, 03:03:00 PM
Post by: the Ferret on November 24, 2003, 04:43:00 PM
Adam...IMO no way is 2 weeks long enough on drying sinew..6 weeks maybe and 8 would be better.
Post by: Madpigslayer on November 24, 2003, 06:37:00 PM
I have only ever bashed emu, elk and buff sinews...the buffalo is the easiest in my opinion. feels right too.
"muchum medicine"
Post by: wingnut on November 24, 2003, 06:40:00 PM
Mike
:D
Post by: trashwood on November 24, 2003, 09:40:00 PM
When that little sucker turns all the heat it's taking on and shrink'n in, 'at afterburner will be blowing blue flame all the way to the target :)
Rusty - sinew is magic- Craine
Post by: Timo on November 24, 2003, 11:10:00 PM
Thanks Doug.HeHeHe :bigsmyl:
Post by: trashwood on November 25, 2003, 08:50:00 AM
Rusty
Post by: wingnut on November 25, 2003, 04:55:00 PM
Mike
Post by: AZStickman on November 25, 2003, 05:01:00 PM
Post by: Terry Green on November 25, 2003, 05:03:00 PM
See you guys Saturday :D
Post by: wingnut on November 27, 2003, 09:28:00 AM
mike
Post by: DCM on November 27, 2003, 10:17:00 AM
I've only made a few sinew bows but not one I've made kept it's initial shape after a few months of drying. Seems like the longer it drys the smaller the outer limbs can be. It can get into trouble if you don't leave enough bow in the middle. I busted the handle outa one that started out a 45# tillered bow and wound up closer to 55# after sinew and seasoning.
Post by: wingnut on November 27, 2003, 10:23:00 AM
Then we sinewed it.
Whe the sinew is dry, I'll finish the tiller from the sides and belly. maybe some sanding on the back if necessary.
The bow is in a box at 90 degrees and 30% RH. 24/7. they dry pretty fast that way. i will start weighing it daily next week to see if it's loosing any weight.
Mike
Post by: DCM on November 27, 2003, 10:29:00 AM
Post by: wingnut on November 27, 2003, 11:44:00 AM
Mike
ps I know it's not primitive but it is fun to play with.
Post by: DCM on November 27, 2003, 07:07:00 PM
Humm.... Fiberglass. Should give some real benefits.
I like to spearmint perty good myself and have often thought of making a "real" glass bow. I never could get anybody to glue me up a blank and don't want to invest in the setup. I got a boy that will probably have me one this spring. I only see him around 3d season. I set him up on some selfbowyerin stuff.
Sinew backed and phenolic bellied selfbow should make a real humdinger. Trapped down nice and skinny on the belly side maybe?
Post by: Killdeer on November 27, 2003, 07:45:00 PM
Aw Rsuty, how couldja?
I'm gonna go sulk now.
!["[dntthnk]"]("graemlins/dntthnk.gif" "\"\"")
Killdeer~the woman he left behind
Post by: trashwood on November 28, 2003, 08:45:00 AM
:knothead:
Rusty
Post by: Killdeer on November 28, 2003, 05:51:00 PM
Those TIAs are the pits!
Hope my sobbing didn't raise the humidity in the drying room...
Killdeer~snif~
Post by: Adam Keiper on November 30, 2003, 09:50:00 AM
Post by: trashwood on November 30, 2003, 10:03:00 AM
Rusty
Post by: Timo on November 30, 2003, 10:29:00 AM
Curious if it would be more inclined to lift the sinew from the curves?(drying faster)
Post by: Adam Keiper on November 30, 2003, 10:38:00 AM
Wonder if I just didn't let it set on the blocks long enough or if 1-2 thin layers of sinew on a 66" bow doesn't provide enough "yank"? (1 thin layer on the whole bow, leftover sinew went on as a 2nd layer on lower limbs).
BTW, The purpose of the sinew in this case is to keep the back intact. The stave had very thin rings (18/inch) and a myriad of small checks. Nearing final tiller, I noticed that a few very tiny horizontal cracks were trying to form by jumping across the closely spaced checks. They just screamed, "Splinter!", therefore I opted for the thin sinew job.
Rusty, I've always enjoyed and learned alot from your bowmaking forays. Thanks for posting! :wavey:
Post by: trashwood on November 30, 2003, 10:43:00 AM
One thing I do is I get a pretty aggressive tooth on the back of the bow before I sinew it. This could be one reason I don't have any problen with the sinew lifting since my first one.
Rusty
Post by: loyd on December 04, 2003, 06:10:00 AM
Post by: Timo on December 04, 2003, 07:01:00 AM
Can't wait!
Rusty ,wingnut, Hows things going with your sinew bows?
Post by: wingnut on December 04, 2003, 07:34:00 AM
Wish me luck.
Mike
Post by: Timo on December 04, 2003, 08:38:00 PM
Post by: wingnut on December 04, 2003, 08:45:00 PM
Holding it's lines real nice, but not quite enough weight. Rusty told me that we should have put more sinew on when we were doing it.
:knothead:
Mike
Post by: Timo on December 04, 2003, 09:35:00 PM
Got to thinking the other day about mixing horn dust/powder, with hide glue? Think it would have any strengthining effects?Elastic?
Post by: wingnut on October 14, 2004, 11:33:00 AM
Of course, I listened and got it outta the pile on the chair. We went out and flung a few and I was very surprised at the speed and manners. I didn't like the tiller as much so we went back yto the shop for a little pick me up. Ended up taking a little off the lower limb to get her bending right.
Put it in the hot box over night at 100 degrees and shot her again when she cool off.
WOW! now that's what I'm talking about.
It is right on 50# @28 and is only 60" long.
Mike
Post by: wingnut on October 14, 2004, 11:34:00 AM
We'll get a look at her tomorrow.
Mike
Post by: DCM on October 14, 2004, 01:06:00 PM
Post by: Jimmy on October 14, 2004, 02:37:00 PM
On this one I decided to use walnut for the core wood, Bamboo backed and thicker (bamboo) than normal and a little more reflex than usual. My thinking The Walnut makes the limbs light, is not doing much of the work as the garolite and the boo is the major power. Well I can say it shoots real nice, and I think it is the fastest bow I have ever made. :) Will try to take some pictures one of these days.
Jim Nichols