Trad Gang

Topic Archives => Build Alongs => Topic started by: Jeremy on April 30, 2005, 11:41:00 AM

Title: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on April 30, 2005, 11:41:00 AM

I glued up a nice tri-lam r/d all bamboo bow this week.  68" total length (66-1/4" NTN), 1-3/8" at the fades, 1/2" tips.  The boo backing has a gentle taper to midlimb and the taper increases to the tips.  The boo belly is the full 1-3/8" out to midlimb and then tapers to the 1/2" tips.  The result is a limb that gets progressively more trapped out to midlimb, and less from midlimb out.

      (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/rd%20All%20Boo%20Bow/b4shortstring.jpg)

      (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/rd%20All%20Boo%20Bow/roughhandle.jpg)

She came off the form with about 2-1/2" of reflex and after floor tillering and longstring tillering out to 10" still has all of it.  She's 60# at the 10" and ready for the short string.

As this is my first r/d bow I'll be posting tillering pics as I go from here out.  She's starting to come round, but still needs more work midlimb out... at least that's what she looks like on the longstring - we'll see what the short string tells us.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on April 30, 2005, 11:49:00 AM

For anyone interested in what type of form I use and all that, check out my previous thread... I used the same form and methods, just added some pieces onto the form to get the profile I wanted.

 http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=015896;p=1

I cleaned the shop... so it won't be confused with the mess that is Scifres shop!        

Not sure how much I'll be able to work on her this weekend, so be patient with me guys.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Huntrdfk on April 30, 2005, 12:24:00 PM

That's has a nice look to it Jeremy.  Looking forward to watching this one.


David

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: mich-mtnman on April 30, 2005, 12:58:00 PM

i had some problems last week with a heavy weight bamboo lam project.
 im looking forward to seeing this thru as well.
 great start !

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on April 30, 2005, 02:55:00 PM

First stringing at a low bh:

 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/rd%20All%20Boo%20Bow/lowstrung1.jpg)

Upper limb (Left) is stiffer than lower.  Needs work midlimb especially.
After a little work here she is 50# @18":

 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/rd%20All%20Boo%20Bow/50at18.jpg)

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on April 30, 2005, 03:00:00 PM

I like the way the lower limb (on the left in bottom pic) is coming around.  The upper limb still needs more work midlimb... it's also still too stiff - just under 1/4" negative tiller at midlimb at brace.  Most of that should be fixed by getting the middle 1/3 bending more.  Sill looking good at the fades and out at the tips though (to me anyway).

Tillering these r/d bows takes some getting used to!  Anyone see something I'm missing (or think I'm dead wrong)?  Mr. Scifres I'd appreciate your input... I'm headed to your site now to see what these things are supposed to look like!

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on April 30, 2005, 04:13:00 PM

Worked on the upper limb a bit more and increased the bh to 5".  Here she is at about 20":

 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/rd%20All%20Boo%20Bow/205bh.jpg)

Upper limb still a bit stiff, but only 1/8" negative tiller now.  Another few rounds of the Bowyer's Edge later I increase the bh to 6" and here she is at about 22":

 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/rd%20All%20Boo%20Bow/226bh.jpg)

The tiller is dead even here.  The upper limb still needs work midlimb out.  What I'm seeing (I think) and not liking is the wood working too much right past the fades.

I'll work on it a bit more midlimb out on both and try getting the bend out more toward the tips.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on April 30, 2005, 04:17:00 PM

Actually, I think I'll hold off on working too much on tiller until some others weigh in on it.  I'll start getting the tips ready for the phenolic overlays.  

My wife tells me we're going to a movie tonight, so there may not be any more pics until tomorrow.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Slim Buttes on April 30, 2005, 04:49:00 PM

looks good, I'm know expert but it looks like the right limb is stiff mid limb, and the left is stiffer at the fade. If the limbs are even length, the right tip is lower than the left tip. I think that is do to the stiffer area at the fade on the left limb.  

Hope I helped, if not, I WAS NEVER HERE.

I got one in the shop that I'm going to post pics of later today.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on April 30, 2005, 06:01:00 PM

The lower limb is shorter... I think by 1-1/4", though I'd have to go measure to be sure.  Also, b/c of the flat area on the handle the bow is slightly tilted toward the upper (right) limb.  That kind of screws with how it looks.  The left fade is actually working more than the right; I've had a big "W" at that spot since I initially thinned the limb when floor tillering.

She feels good in the hand while short drawing.  She does want to pull toward the upper limb a bit, but the tiller is dead even so that'll be fixed by getting positive tiller on the upper.

I'm happy with the way she's looking at this point.  I still have room and weight to spare to bring her into tiller, so I'm not too worried (yet).  Just need to get more wood working midlimb out on both...  if I screw it up you can be sure I'll delete the thread quickly!   :knothead:

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: horseapple on April 30, 2005, 06:32:00 PM

If I squint realy hard I can see tiller:)  other than that you need to put something behind the bow so we can get a better view of both limbs bending without all the distractions from behind... how about a white bedsheet...

Joe Don

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Keith Deters on April 30, 2005, 07:39:00 PM

Jeremy,  It's looking real good so far.  You've been working the right spots as far as I can tell.

I don't think the fades are bending too much.  The deflex sometimes makes it look that way.

Tips are a little stiff at this point, might not be at a longer draw.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on May 01, 2005, 10:37:00 AM

I (mostly) shaped the phenolic tips - that's tough  stuff!! - and worked on the outer limbs some.  Here she is braced at 6":

 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/rd%20All%20Boo%20Bow/brace.jpg)

And 55# @24":

 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/rd%20All%20Boo%20Bow/55at24.jpg)

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on May 01, 2005, 10:44:00 AM

To me, midlimb out on the lower(left) limb is looking a little flat.  The tips on the upper limb could probably come round more also.

Hope the cardboard behind the bow helps some JD... my wife may not let me back into the bedroom if the good bedsheets disappear!  :(  

After a thorough workout on the tiller tree and a half dozen shots at about 24" draw, her tips are dead even with the handle after unstringing.  There's 1/8" positive tiller on the upper @ midlimb and she's well behaved at release.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on May 01, 2005, 03:20:00 PM

All the selfbow guys out turkey hunting today or are you    ??      

After a bit more scraping and finishing the tips - I really need to thin the phenolic down before gluing it on next time    - here she is at 26" draw:

 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/rd%20All%20Boo%20Bow/26.jpg)

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on May 01, 2005, 03:28:00 PM

I think it's about time to put away the bowyer's edge - possibly even the scaper - and bring her into final tiller with sand paper.

The outer 1/3 of both limbs could use a little more work, I think.  But she's downright sexy with her gentle curves      

That'll probably be all the tillering for today.  I'll smooth out the handle a bit more and maybe glue on an arrow rest.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: mich-mtnman on May 01, 2005, 05:37:00 PM

very cool, im still watching.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Keith Deters on May 01, 2005, 07:29:00 PM

I like it.  It looks like the upper limb is on the left?

I think you're right about putting down the edge tools.  

I looks to me that you could move your clip on the string more towards where the arrow nock would be.  That may weaken the lower limb a bit.

The outer limbs of these bows usually show a bit stiff.  I like to leave them thick and narrow them to get the mass weight off them.

How are you doing on draw weight?

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on May 01, 2005, 09:38:00 PM

Keith, the upper limb is the right limb.  Going back to the original pic on the camera I see the clip is a little low, so the upper limb is actually a tad weaker than the pic shows.  There's about 1/8" positive tiller at brace.

She's somewhere between 55-58# @26" right now, so I'm on track to making weight... it's nice when that happens!

I'll shoot it a bunch tomorrow and see if/how the tiller changes and then ease her to the final draw and tiller.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: John Scifres on May 02, 2005, 09:48:00 AM

She's stiff from just outside the fade to almost midlimb on the left.  Your right tip starts getting pretty stiff just outside midlimb.  Left is stiff just a bit farther out than that.  Right limb is stronger than left.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on May 02, 2005, 07:39:00 PM

Thanks John!  I was about to PM you an invitation to come look at the thread.

I softened the tips up a bit and took her shooting... put a couple dozen arrows through her at about a 27" draw (my draw is 29").  I like her!  Just unbraced she follow the string by about 1/2"... not bad for the carbonized boo!

My wife had the camera today, so tiller pics will have to wait until tomorrow afternoon.

I did the final shaping of the handle and sanded everything down.  May have some tiller adjustment to do tomorrow, but there's some room to move and still make a hunting weight bow.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on May 04, 2005, 09:13:00 PM

Here she is at 27"

 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/rd%20All%20Boo%20Bow/27.jpg)

I increased the positive tiller from 1/8" to 1/4".  Right limb (upper) looks good to me.  Nice gentle bend until right before the tip where there's a little extra flip in my form.  Left is better; there's a stiff spot right before the flip at the tip... it's at a node and the boo suddenly gets quite a bit thicker.

I glued on a built up leather rest and saturated it with superglue (there's a thread about that on here now) and shot it some more.  No additional set from last time, but I haven't taken her past 27" yet... ~57#.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: John Scifres on May 04, 2005, 10:33:00 PM

I'd shoot her.  Looks nice to me.  Maybe just a hair more at midlimb on the left and just a touch from 4" outside of the dip to midlimb on the right.

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on May 05, 2005, 07:42:00 AM

Thanks John!  I'm real happy with the way this one is turning out.  I think I'll put another 50 or so arrows through her, check to see if the tiller changed and stain her.

The next bow - there's always a "next bow" isn't there? - will be glued up on the same form, but will have a walnut core and osage belly.... I get all giddy just thinking about it   :D

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: bvalentine002 on May 05, 2005, 07:47:00 AM

Jeremy,
I'm still waiting to see what you make with the Rosewood I sent you...
:-)
Brett

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on May 05, 2005, 08:20:00 AM

Brett, I can't get that dang stuff not to feel oily!  I've tried acetone, alcohol, dish detergent... nothing seems to work.  The stuff warped pretty badly when I dried it out too, so I hope your floor still looks OK!!  
If I can every figure it out there's a tri lam bow ready to be glued (birch center lam, rosewood belly, boo back)  I've also prepped some pieces to use as the sole of a few wooden hand planes...

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on May 08, 2005, 01:10:00 PM

Well, here she is:

 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/rd%20All%20Boo%20Bow/SweetGrass.jpg)

 (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/rd%20All%20Boo%20Bow/lacedhandle.jpg)

She's got over 100 shots through her now, is pulling 55# @28" and follows the string by about an inch just after unstringing.  After sitting she comes back up just behind the handle.

I'm not sure how the pic will show it, but she's stained mahogany at the tips (to match the handle) and then the stain fades to a nice golden oak color.  Deer leather laced handle wrap, rest and side plate.

I'm calling her "SweetGrass"  I just need to add the lettering and a couple of coats of wax.  Thanks for following along!

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Huntrdfk on May 08, 2005, 03:15:00 PM

Great job Jeremy, that's a good looking bow!

David

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: larry on May 08, 2005, 06:01:00 PM

I'll second that, better bring it to the bunny hunt next year so as we can shoot it!

larry

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Sparky on May 08, 2005, 06:32:00 PM

Great Bow Jeremy!...fit and finish look top notch...not to mention the tiller..outstanding.
  I bet that Boo' makes  smooth drawing bow.

Sparky

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: warder1268 on May 09, 2005, 12:22:00 AM

Very nice looking bow.  I am jealous.  The last one I was working on broke but I learned quite a bit and have already started the next one.  It will have a hickory core, boo belly and raw boo back.  Like you said, "there is always a next bow."

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on May 09, 2005, 07:40:00 AM

Thanks guys!  I'm real happy with this one!  Larry, this bow won't be around for the Bunny Hunt... it'll probably be going up on the classifieds in a week or so - after I have fun shooting it a bunch more   :D  - but don't worry, I'll be bringing a bunch of bows!
Warder, I learn something from each bow I make; that's what keeps it fun!

Title: Re: "SweetGrass" - Finished r/d all bamboo build along
Post by: Jeremy on May 10, 2005, 07:49:00 AM

ttt for anyone that wanted to see it, but hasn't.

Interesting thing to note.  After another 50 shots she still reads 55# on my tillering tree, but 52# when drawn by hand with an arrow and a stop at 28".  Not sure if that's b/c the pully on the tree needs oiling or something, but it's something I need to keep in mind on the next couple of bows.