Post by: vermonster13 on July 10, 2006, 11:41:00 AM
Below is the result of your feedback form. It was submitted by
Molly Simmons ([email protected]) on Monday, July 10, 2006 at 11:15:51
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location: Nashville, TN
message: I am very displeased with the philosophy, proposed format, and goals of Worldhunt. This is a travesty created without thought for the serious damage it will cause hunting. I am a longtime bowhunter, and I've never seen anything more abominable or frightening in its potential for harm, than this event. If you are part of the Worldhunt creation team, please reconsider what you are doing. If you are sponsoring Worldhunt, I will use every available resource at my disposal to prevent you from selling ANY product to anyone that I have influence over, and I will encourage everyone I know to do the same. Consider the potential for long term harm this project has to the sport that drives YOUR business!
Post by: vermonster13 on July 10, 2006, 12:14:00 PM
So Do-All has been removed from the e-mail list and are on our side in this folks.
Post by: BTH on July 10, 2006, 02:07:00 PM
we are not an official sponsor. We do not pay for the link. We do not
position our selves in the same line of thought as Chuck.
Post by: vermonster13 on July 10, 2006, 05:19:00 PM
Thanks so much for caring enough about our sport to take the time to send an email. I appreciate and respect your concerns. We at Mossy Oak and BioLogic are very passionate about hunting and its traditions. Its our lifestyle. We have the utmost respect for Chuck Sykes and the Management Advantage television show. Chuck loves the sport as much as any of us. Its my understanding that Chuck is managing the wildlife on the property to be used and they couldn’t have a better guy. I know in my heart he wouldn’t align himself or support anything that would harm our sport.
I don’t know many details, but I understand more info is coming on what the WHA is doing. I trust Chuck and I am willing to wait and see and keep an open mind. I’d like for us all to keep an open mind and see what this is all about before we make rash emotional decisions. At some point in life and business…you have to trust others….and I trust Chuck.
Thanks for your past support and I hope you will be willing to wait and see.
Bobby Cole
BioLogic
Post by: vermonster13 on July 10, 2006, 06:08:00 PM
We appreciate the time you are taking towards this subject matter.
Sincerely,
Shane P. Leanna
President & Chief Manager
Do-All Outdoors
Post by: lucznik on July 10, 2006, 07:13:00 PM
Quote
Originally posted by vermonster13:vermonster13,
Dear Sir,
Thanks so much for caring enough about our sport to take the time to send an email. I appreciate and respect your concerns. We at Mossy Oak and BioLogic are very passionate about hunting and its traditions. Its our lifestyle. We have the utmost respect for Chuck Sykes and the Management Advantage television show. Chuck loves the sport as much as any of us. Its my understanding that Chuck is managing the wildlife on the property to be used and they couldn’t have a better guy. I know in my heart he wouldn’t align himself or support anything that would harm our sport.
I don’t know many details, but I understand more info is coming on what the WHA is doing. I trust Chuck and I am willing to wait and see and keep an open mind. I’d like for us all to keep an open mind and see what this is all about before we make rash emotional decisions. At some point in life and business…you have to trust others….and I trust Chuck.
Thanks for your past support and I hope you will be willing to wait and see.
Bobby Cole
BioLogic
Could you post the direct email address for this gentleman so that the rest of us can express our dissapointment to him about this stance directly?
Post by: JC on July 10, 2006, 07:22:00 PM
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Post by: Ernie Black on July 10, 2006, 07:24:00 PM
we are not an official sponsor. We do not pay for the link. We do not
position our selves in the same line of thought as Chuck.
Post by: vermonster13 on July 10, 2006, 07:30:00 PM
Post by: Bill Carlsen on July 11, 2006, 09:26:00 AM
Post by: JC on July 11, 2006, 09:33:00 AM
Post by: Rob DiStefano on July 11, 2006, 01:04:00 PM
Could you please tell me why I am getting all these Management Advantage emails? I have nothing to do with the Management Advantage show or the WHA.
And my email reply ...
Hello Todd,
First and foremost, thank you for not supporting the WHA/Worldhunt. Your email address is being removed from the Management Advantage form email immediately - please excuse a few straggler emails that may get by.
Trad Gang's position is that anyone who supports anything to do with WHA or Worldhunt will not receive our support.
Anyone, any group, any vendor, any business or corporation that aligns themselves with the utter greedy nonsense that WHA/Worldhunt is fostering will be boycotted by as many sportsman as we can get the word out to - for manufacturers and vendors, this will mean a measurable loss of profits.
With that in mind, and your understanding that Mr. Sykes and "Management Advantage" are part of the WHA/Worldhunt scheme, your business link is found on their "Sponsors" page ...
http://www.themanagementadvantage.com/sponsors.htm
In your own best business interests, you might want to request of Management Advantage to remove anything to do with your business from their website. Any hunter that views their site will think you are a Management Advantage sponsor, and that means you also support the WHA/Worldhunt, and therefore you may likely have one less customer.
Best Regards,
Rob.
Trad Gang Admin
Now, Todd's statement kinda goes against what Bobby Cole preached to Ray Hammond, eh?
Post by: Bill Carlsen on July 11, 2006, 03:08:00 PM
Mr. Carlsen,
BioLogic has no connection at all to Worldhunt or Mr. Farbam. Where do you get that from - because some radical whiner told you? Fighting amongst hunters is what's going to be the demise of our sport!!!
Shoot Straight,
Todd Amenrud
BioLogic, Scientifically Proven Wild Game Products
Director of Public Relations, Territory Manager & Habitat Consultant
It seems to me that these guys are being used by Worldhunt with out their knowledge...wonder what is really going on?
Post by: vermonster13 on July 11, 2006, 03:12:00 PM
Bill I sent him a copy of the letter from Bobby Cole posted above. He says BioLogic/Mossy Oak trusts Sykes to do whatever he's doing. Sounds to me like they need to get their story straight over there!
Post by: Bill Carlsen on July 11, 2006, 03:22:00 PM
Mr. Armenrud: I do not think that this is a matter of me getting upset over someone whining, nor do I think that it is a small matter. Rather than trying to make a case I would refer you to the website, www.tradgang.com (http://www.tradgang.com) and find their Posts on Politics and hunting. There are well over 600 responses posted there in regards to this issue of Worldhunt. It seems that Management Advantage, of which your company is a sponsor, has been connected to the World Hunt program. In fact, World Hunt duped the editor of Bowhunt America Magazine, Bill Krenz, into taking out ads for World Hunt before Mr. Farbam would tell him about the nature of the program. As soon as Mr. Krenz realized what he was getting into he discontinued World Hunt advertising in his publication.
In any event, as a bowhunter for the last 54 years, I have a great love and passion for the sport and do not want to see it bastardized by a program like Worldhunt. I, like you, think that we are, at times, our own worst enemies. However, in this case, we need to be standing together. Thank you for your reply and if you have any knowledge of any of the sponsors of Management Advantage being involved with Worldhunt it may be worth your while to discuss this issue with them. A gentleman by the name of Chuck Sykes has been identified as one who is already involved with WorldHunt. If he is not then World Hunt is using using names of sponsors without their knowledge or permission.
Sincerely,
Bill Carlsen
Post by: Bill Carlsen on July 11, 2006, 03:24:00 PM
Mr. Armenrud: I do not think that this is a matter of me getting upset over someone whining, nor do I think that it is a small matter. Rather than trying to make a case I would refer you to the website, www.tradgang.com (http://www.tradgang.com) and find their Posts on Politics and hunting. There are well over 600 responses posted there in regards to this issue of Worldhunt. It seems that Management Advantage, of which your company is a sponsor, has been connected to the World Hunt program. In fact, World Hunt duped the editor of Bowhunt America Magazine, Bill Krenz, into taking out ads for World Hunt before Mr. Farbam would tell him about the nature of the program. As soon as Mr. Krenz realized what he was getting into he discontinued World Hunt advertising in his publication.
In any event, as a bowhunter for the last 54 years, I have a great love and passion for the sport and do not want to see it bastardized by a program like Worldhunt. I, like you, think that we are, at times, our own worst enemies. However, in this case, we need to be standing together. Thank you for your reply and if you have any knowledge of any of the sponsors of Management Advantage being involved with Worldhunt it may be worth your while to discuss this issue with them. A gentleman by the name of Chuck Sykes has been identified as one who is already involved with WorldHunt. If he is not then World Hunt is using using names of sponsors without their knowledge or permission.
Sincerely,
Bill Carlsen
Post by: BigRonHuntAlot on July 11, 2006, 04:09:00 PM
Dear Mr. Andrews,
In response to your e-mail regarding the WHA, you are mistaken in your claim that we support WHA. We do not support WHA and in fact had not even heard of WHA or known of its existence until very recently.
We have received a few e-mails regarding WHA because one of the many television shows that we happen to sponsor is “The Management Advantage” of which Chuck Sykes is the host. Commitments for television sponsorships for 2006 were made last year, long before we even knew that a WHA existed or that Chuck had any involvement with WHA. I have not seen any mention of WHA on “The Management Advantage” television show and also do not see any links or reference to WHA on the web-site of “The Management Advantage”. I do not know what Chuck’s involvement with WHA is other than the quotes dated June 21 that I have just recently seen on the World Hunt web-site after it was called to our attention.
Last year we chose to sponsor “The Management Advantage” because we believe it to be the best deer management show on Television and we make trail cameras that are an excellent management tool. That seemed to be a good fit. We also appreciate the underlying stewardship theme of the show. By the way, “The Management Advantage” show only runs for 6 months of the year from about April through September and will therefore soon be off the air until spring of 2007.
I personally would not like to see hunting made into a competition and have no intention of sponsoring “World Hunt”. In fact, I do not see any sponsors listed on the “World Hunt” website.
Thank you for calling the matter to our attention, but again, you are mistaken in your claim that we are a sponsor.
Don Saxon
Vice President
VibraShine Inc./ Leaf River Outdoor Products
Post by: Dave Lay on July 11, 2006, 10:44:00 PM
Dear Mr. Lay,
Thank you for your e-mail of July 7 regarding the World Hunt organization.
Actually we were not aware that such an association existed until it was brought to our attention very recently, nor were we aware of any involvement by Chuck Sykes.
Commitments for television sponsorships for 2006 were made last year, long before we even knew that a WHA existed or that Chuck had any involvement with WHA. I have not seen any mention of WHA on “The Management Advantage” television show and also do not see any links or reference to WHA on the web-site of “The Management Advantage”. I do not know what Chuck’s involvement with WHA is other than the quotes dated June 21 that I have just recently seen on the World Hunt web-site after it was called to our attention.
Last year we chose to sponsor “The Management Advantage” because we believe it to be the best deer management show on Television and we make trail cameras that are an excellent management tool. That seemed to be a good fit. We also appreciate the underlying stewardship theme of the show.
I personally would not like to see hunting made into a competition and share your concerns. We have no intention of sponsoring “World Hunt”. In fact, I do not see any sponsors listed on the “World Hunt” website.
The commitment to sponsor “The Management Advantage” television show was made last year and there are only about 2 months remaining since this show only runs 6 months of the year from about April through September.
Thank you for calling this matter to our attention, but we are not and do not intend to be involved with “World Hunt”.
Don Saxon
Vice-President
VibraShine, Inc./Leaf River Outdoor Products
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From: Russellville, Ar | IP: Logged |
Post by: Rob DiStefano on July 12, 2006, 07:32:00 AM
http://www.themanagementadvantage.com/sponsors.htm
... if your company is shown sponsoring The Management Advantage, you have aligned yerself with WHA/Worldhunt in the eyes of anyone reviewing the above website, and in your own best business interests you might want to consider contacting Chuck Sykes/The Management Advantage and ask for all mention of your business removed from that website.
Clearly, that's the message those businesses need to understand and enact upon.
They need to walk their talk.
Post by: vermonster13 on July 12, 2006, 08:03:00 AM
Post by: JC on July 12, 2006, 08:05:00 AM
Post by: vermonster13 on July 12, 2006, 08:19:00 AM
Bobby Cole [email protected]
Joedee Henry [email protected]
Public Relations Content Manager
Mossy Oak
P.O. Box 757
200 E. Main St.
West Point, MS 39773
662.494.8859 x.234
This is what Joedee had to say. Sounds like none of them knows what the other is doing.
"We have not released any news about WHA"
To clarify, Mossy Oak owns Bio Logic now I'm led to believe. The original e-mail was sent to Mossy Oak/Bio Logic and the answer given to me by Bobby Cole is posted above in this thread. Then we received Todd's reply and I received Joedee's via another member.
Post by: Bill Carlsen on July 12, 2006, 08:30:00 AM
Post by: Ray Hammond on July 12, 2006, 08:39:00 AM
The responses that you have received are "off the mark" meant to deflect you from a true understanding of the situation.
We don't care if MO, or BioLogic, or Do-All, or Leaf River support WHA or not, do we? What we care about is letting them know they are shown as sponsors of Chuck Syke's show who DOES espouse great support for WHA...they are supporters by association.
I have mailed mossy oak all the camo I own with their name on it...with a letter in the box explaining my reason for giving it back.
Bill and others, I think we sort of wanted to keep our site "free of hackers" by not pointing people here...it may be too late for that or I missed something but think we should not put links to our site on emails and letters. Copy and paste all the stuff you like but don't link to tradgang.com
We didn't hear back from Chuck, but we have his statement on WHA website and that's all we need.
Post by: vermonster13 on July 12, 2006, 08:58:00 AM
Dear Sir,
Thanks so much for caring enough about our sport to take the time to send an email. I appreciate and respect your concerns. We at Mossy Oak and BioLogic are very passionate about hunting and its traditions. Its our lifestyle. We have the utmost respect for Chuck Sykes and the Management Advantage television show. Chuck loves the sport as much as any of us. Its my understanding that Chuck is managing the wildlife on the property to be used and they couldn’t have a better guy. I know in my heart he wouldn’t align himself or support anything that would harm our sport.
I don’t know many details, but I understand more info is coming on what the WHA is doing. I trust Chuck and I am willing to wait and see and keep an open mind. I’d like for us all to keep an open mind and see what this is all about before we make rash emotional decisions. At some point in life and business…you have to trust others….and I trust Chuck.
Thanks for your past support and I hope you will be willing to wait and see.
Bobby Cole
BioLogic
By the way I'm not willing to wait and see, that tends to not work out well if history has taught us anything.
Post by: vermonster13 on July 12, 2006, 10:06:00 AM
Here is the issue, I have read in several places Mossy Oak does not support the WHA. I see Chuck Sykes is supporting the WHA and your company is a sponsor of his show Management Advantage. I would hope Mossy Oak picks who they sponsor with the same ethics and respect for hunting as Mossy Oak has shown in their own shows. Chuck Sykes has written a letter of support for the WHA that is on their site and is very questionable, especially since he manages the herd of the resort where the WHA is planning to hold their first "event". I hope Mossy Oak will pick to sponsor individuals and shows with better judgement in the future. Chuck Sykes seems to be lacking in this area.
Thank you for your time,
Post by: vermonster13 on July 12, 2006, 11:29:00 AM
Just got back in the office last night to read all this e-mail about WHA. I have not had time to dig through everything that has been written yet but I can assure you that Mossy Oak is not in anyway supporting the WHA. No one takes the hunting heritage to heart like we do. It’s easy to figure out where we stand on these type issues by watching some of our TV shows. They have always been centered around average people, the critters, the land and most of all the experience. Thanks for your concern and stay vigilant.
Ronnie “Cuz” Strickland
SR. VP Mossy Oak
Post by: JC on July 12, 2006, 11:54:00 AM
Post by: Ray Hammond on July 12, 2006, 12:01:00 PM
Post by: lucznik on July 12, 2006, 04:02:00 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Rob DiStefano:While I don't want to be seen as trying to dilute the importance of the issue, I feel I should point out that your logic here is not entirely correct.
The problem I have with Don Saxon (Vibrashine) is the same as the issues I have with Shane Leanna (Do-All) and Todd Amenrud (BioLogic) - they all espose no affiliation with, or support for, WHA/Worldhunt, yet The Management Advantage website clearly lists them as sponsors ...
http://www.themanagementadvantage.com/sponsors.htm
... if your company is shown sponsoring The Management Advantage, you have aligned yerself with WHA/Worldhunt in the eyes of anyone reviewing the above website, and in your own best business interests you might want to consider contacting Chuck Sykes/The Management Advantage and ask for all mention of your business removed from that website.
Clearly, that's the message those businesses need to understand and enact upon.
They need to walk their talk.
As a part of my job I deal with organizing events for which we search for corporate (and individual) sponsors. We then list those sponsors' names prominently for all to see and to hopefully generate revenue for them by way of somewhat passive advertisement. However, just because a company chooses to sponsor our facility or a portion of one of our events, doesn't mean they support or even have knowledge of everything we are doing.
Mossy Oak and Biologic sponsor the show Management Advantage. That is not the same as giving their support to WHA nor to concurring with Management Advantage's (or Chuck Sykes') support of WHA.
I wholeheartedly agree that both Mossy Oak and Biologic seem to have had some trouble issuing a single, clear (and non-contradictory) statement as to their stand but, we also all need to be willing to allow them the opportunity to formulate that response before we all start sending back our camo.
It may be that they were planning on supporting the WHA and are now trying to come up with some way to deal with the (righteous) backlash without looking like a bunch of weinies. It might also be true that they had no knowledge of Management Advantages' nor Chuck Sykes' involvement and are just now trying to formulate a response that both removes their name from association with WHA, while at the same time not destroying important business and professional relationships with MA and Mr Sykes. This is not an easy thing to accomplish and while I definately agree they need to get together and come up with a single, formal, and official response (rather than a slew of individual responses,) we need to give them the facts as we know them without laying judgement or ultimatums at their feet and allow them the chance to respond.
Post by: vermonster13 on July 12, 2006, 04:12:00 PM
Post by: Ray Hammond on July 12, 2006, 05:12:00 PM
I for one do not believe, given that October is the date for the event, that we have any time left to waste on this...battleships, once a course is set, are difficult to stop or change course..it takes miles...once advertising is committed, filmed, supplied, once commitments are made legally with contracts, its impossible to stop these things.
It has to be done now, with the few meager tools we have at our disposal. Once the poison gas is out of the bottle, it does no good to try and put it back..the damage is done.
Post by: vermonster13 on July 13, 2006, 10:16:00 AM
Post by: vermonster13 on July 13, 2006, 01:00:00 PM
QDMA Opposes WHA (http://tradgang.com/data/QDMA_Opposes_WHA.pdf)
Post by: vermonster13 on July 13, 2006, 01:49:00 PM
BASF
Polaris
Mega Outdoor Property
The Edge Outdoors
Brush Clearing Services, LLC
Great Day Inc.
Me Opta
Post by: BigRonHuntAlot on July 13, 2006, 02:21:00 PM
Post by: vermonster13 on July 13, 2006, 05:29:00 PM
Post by: vermonster13 on July 13, 2006, 06:35:00 PM