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Main Boards => Hunting Knives and Crafters => Topic started by: tomsm44 on February 20, 2016, 06:53:00 PM

Title: Need some help with a new technique - would love pictures if you have them.
Post by: tomsm44 on February 20, 2016, 06:53:00 PM

I'm wanting to try something new on a couple knives I'm working on that I've seen a couple of you guys do before.  It's the two hidden tang knives I recently posted that I started.  Instead of threading the tang, I want to hammer the end into a button like I've seen I think Lin, Darcy, and a few others do.  Here's the questions I have:  First, what's the best way you guys have found to secure the blade when doing this?  Second, do you have to heat the end of the tang to do it?  Haven't tried hammering carbon steel cold before like you would a softer pin material and am not sure if it would work, even when annealed.  Third, if you heat it, how do you keep from dis coloring the buttcap underneath it?  Any advice, tips, instructions, pictures, or whatever you have to offer would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Matt

Title: Re: Need some help with a new technique - would love pictures if you have them.
Post by: D.Ellis on February 21, 2016, 01:02:00 PM

I normally make a finial "nut" and thread the tang, but I have peened the end of the tang a few times.
You need to make sure the end of the tang is as dead soft as you can get it. Heat cycle with a small torch several times to not more than dull red. If you hit the transformation temp, many steels will air harden to a certain degree, peening will be impossible.
I then put the finished blade tip down in a large bench vise. Pad the jaws with leather, and have the tip of the blade resting on a thick lead block. Try to get the vise as snug as possible, and then use a very light ball peen hammer to peen the tang over the end of the butt cap.
You need to make the tang fit the hole through the butt cap very close fitting so minimal expansion is required to get a tight fit. Round over the end of the tang before peening, just like peening pin in a handle.
You can leave the tang end "button" proud above the cap, or file it flush and polish it up.

Hope this helps. Honestly, threading the tang and using a nut to secure the handle and cap is easier without the risk of marring the blade finish.......peening works though, is strong and doesn't require thread forming tools. I would only use a tough handle material like antler or a strong hardwood.

In my mind, the best low tech method for making a bomb proof knife would be an antler handle, steel butt cap and a peened thru tang......doesn't get much tougher than that.

Darcy    :campfire:

Title: Re: Need some help with a new technique - would love pictures if you have them.
Post by: tomsm44 on February 21, 2016, 05:31:00 PM

Thanks Darcy, that answers most of my questions.  I'm still undecided on how exactly I'll do these two, but thought I might try this method on at least one, just to do something a little different.  You know, expand my skill set a little.

Title: Re: Need some help with a new technique - would love pictures if you have them.
Post by: Doug Campbell on February 21, 2016, 06:11:00 PM

Darcy has it nailed, if I don't happen to have enough tang I've welded an extension of mild steel onto the tang. Grind it to fit thru the butt cap. I always do at least a couple hidden 1/16" pins into the handle also. Radius the "stick thru" a little, it doesn't take much tang sticking thru either.

I epoxy the cap on then after the epoxy sets I typically just hold the knife by the handle. I use a small gunsmith ball peen I've had many years and lightly tap, tap, tap.

Here an easy way to hide any wandering peen marks also.
   (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v82/gotahunt/FullSizeRender-20_zpszdyycwzh.jpg)

Title: Re: Need some help with a new technique - would love pictures if you have them.
Post by: Lin Rhea on February 22, 2016, 08:18:00 AM

That's a nice trick Doug and good construction logic.

I often braze a Nickel Silver rod to the tang just inside the butt cap and go ahead and get it adjusted to the butt cap and handle, after which I pour my epoxy just up close to the butt cap and let that set up. After that cures, I can fill the remainder and peen the button. The cured epoxy supports the Nickel Silver during the peening. I also will mix my epoxy and let it sit in the cup and stiffen up to thick syrup before I fill the last areas under the butt cap. It don't want to run everywhere that way and will tend to fill up the hollows in the butt cap.

Title: Re: Need some help with a new technique - would love pictures if you have them.
Post by: tomsm44 on February 22, 2016, 09:07:00 AM

Thanks guys.  Sounds like there are a couple options for this type of construction.  Mine is designed for the carbon steel tang to extend through the cap, so I'll have to do something similar to what Darcy described.  I may steal Doug's trick for hiding the peen marks.     ;)

Title: Re: Need some help with a new technique - would love pictures if you have them.
Post by: Bladepeek on February 22, 2016, 11:09:00 AM

Here's another idea that I haven't seen mentioned, but might be of use. I have a very shallow angle hand reamer that I use to taper the hole in the butt cap. Maybe "shallow angle" is the wrong way to describe it, but it tapers VERY gradually, so there isn't a countersink type hole, but the hole tapers only slightly. It has a definite tightening effect when the tang is peened.