Trad Gang
Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: BAK on September 28, 2011, 09:46:00 AM
-
I recently read an article in a local newspaper written by a regional outdoor writer. He went into great detail on how he was setting up his 10 year old daughter to get her first black bear.
Maybe this is just another one of the generational differences I see today, as I frequently read on this site where the prowess of someone’s child is praised. I only know that in my generation, being allowed to hunt deer was almost a right of passage. It wasn’t for children, it was for those who had shown they could be trusted with weapons, and whose judgment would allow them to survive in the bush if worst came to worst. Oh, we could go out rabbit or squirrel hunting on our own, but going out for big game was for adults, and you knew it. You strived to show your maturity to be allowed that right.
To me the idea of taking a 10 year old out and putting him/her on a bait site is ridiculous. It smacks of sensationalism. It’s like parents who want their child to be the youngest to sail the Pacific, or fly a plane. Why can’t they just let them be kids while they can? I don’t argue the point that the future of hunting is in our youth, but have some common sense when defining it. In my opinion the idea of putting pre pubescent children in the big woods to hunt as adults is wrong and should not be promoted.
-
My question was the parent there with her? If the adult is there with her then I don't have a problem with it.
-
It all depends on the situation and the kid. Every situation is different and every kid is different.
-
Local laws can differ too, some places have a minimum age for big game.
People stretch stuff all the time and having a 10 year old boy or girl killing bears with a bow (if that is what we are talking about) is really marginal; but they teach archery and skiing to the blind-so why not-right?
-
it was kind of like a right of passage for me too! I was more excited on going on my first deer hunt than to get a driving license!
I do agree every situation is different
-
daughter just killed her first deer last weekend during the youth season here in in.she is 12,and thats the age i started my journey bowhunting.i told her she cant bowhunt yet cause she pulls right at 35 lbs.and she only has a 23in draw.but she shoots indoor spots and has won local 2nd at state 2 years in a row and 5th in the nationals,she can shoot..told her if she can pull about 40 id let her try next year..i can only support what she wants to do when it comes too hunting....
-
Local laws, a kids maturity, and a parents mind set all come into play. Some kids can understand whats involved, some can't yet. I see no reason to rush a child into the adult world......it comes fast enough as it is! I introduced my daughter to shooting and archery, she got her hunters safety certificate and then proceeded on to other things. Now she just has no interest in hunting. Every kid is different!
-
Too many kids today have "nature deficit disorder". They know little or nothing about nature, where food comes from or in some cases what real food really is. I am all for kids being in the field as observers or hunters if they want to be and are ready. My wife happens to do the web site for Hunter's Point Guide Service. If a kid qualifies and holds a youth hunting license and an adult brings them along on a paid hunt the kid gets to hunt for free. It has been great to see kids get their first bear. I don't think you can start them too early. Here's a pic of me and my two grandsons with last Spring's turkey. Now they know when we have turkey, chicken, venison, etc. that meat actually comes from a living creature. And whether or not it has to do with hunting they love the woods and streams/ponds in particular.
(http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a322/Arrowworks/Billboysturkey.jpg)
-
So then in your eyes me taking my soon to be 8 year old (birthday this Friday) hunting in Texas for hogs this November would be irresponsible?
I begged my dad from age 6 to take me hunting with him. He got me a Red Rider to shoot in the yard. When I was 10 I begged my dad to take me hunting with him and my Grandpa. He said this is "Man Stuff" and they went squirrel hunting without me. When I was 14 I begged my dad to take me deer hunting and was told I was to young. I finally got my license at 16 and if I wasn't in school, I was in the woods. I only hunted 2 times in my life with my dad and never with my grandpa. I do regret that.
I graduated school joined the Army (Military Police) traveled the world protecting the country, got out started my own business which I operated for 13 years then moved on to a more stable career and a family (I only mention this to show that I have responsibility ingrained in me).
Both of my son's have asked to hunt with me since age 3, and they have been in the woods on a limited basis ever since. My son told me he wanted to go hunting with me this year, so I got ahold of a friend in TX and set up the hunt.
I will be with him the whole time and vowed to not shoot anything till he puts some bacon in the freezer.
There is very little in this world we can change, but there are so many areas we can improve. I will not allow my son to not be able to do something because it is just for "Men", in someone elses eyes.
Maturity does come into play here, and my boys are better behaved at 6 and 8 than the 20,000 Twenty year old "Kids" I have to deal with on a daily basis.
To each their own, but me and Mine are going huntin'.
Here are both my boys this past 4th of July. My oldest can outshoot me, and this picture shows it.
(http://i846.photobucket.com/albums/ab28/miklvines/IMG_0018-3.jpg)
-
I like that picture Bill. If it wasn't for the fooler in his mouth he would look like a little man!
-
He's only 2 and his brother is 4. When he was about 3 Elijah, the oldest, would look out the back door across our pond and say, "Nana, can we go see the world, now"? They love to shoot water pistols at frogs and bugs. Who am I to say "No"?
-
PA passed the "Mentor Hunting" thing a couple of years back and just on it's face I'm dead against it. That being said, if you have a kid that's less than 12 that is phyiscally big enough to actually load-unload, hold and aim a rifle on thier own then you have 1/2 the problem licked. My biggest concern is the mental state when no 6-10 year old has the mental ability to process exactly what they are doing when pulling that trigger on a live animal. Heck, I know a bunch of adults who mentally have no grip on the actual taking of an animals life and what that really means and the reverance it holds or should hold. No, when I see pictures in our local paper with 7 yr. old Suzie and her first deer kill and she's not as tall as her rifle she supposedly used I'm just not for it.
I guess the Dad's and Mom's need to be patient and teach all the aspects of hunting until their kid is old enough mentally and phyiscally to grasp it and show the kids that patience too.
-
A couple of years ago I was dropping off an elk at the meat processors, an 11 year old was there also, he had shot an elk and he and his Dad were dropping it off. Always being an encourager of youth, I enthusiastically ask him what he got. He pointed at the elk and said. "I don't know, one of those".
Just my opinion, he was to young.
A kid should be mature enough to know what they are really doing. The animals we harvest deserve respect...
Every kid is different.
Joe
-
Joe is exactly right.
-
I'm with Mike....”to each their own, but me and Mine are going huntin”. My eldest (now 19) started joining me in the woods at 4. Every year we shed hunt, scouted, plant food plots, and he sat in the stand with me often! He hunted small game at 7, deer and turkey with a gun at 10 and a bow at 11. My youngest, now 11, is following the same path. They both get to join me, my father, all my uncles and friends in the woods each year. It may not be their thing forever (my 19 year has found girls, sports, cars and college for the time being) but they will always remember the times we spent together in the woods....guaranteed!!
-
I think it depends on the kid really
My oldest Daughter is 16. She took her first deer when she was 8.
I never could tell her she had to stay home. I too only hunted with my dad a handful of times and my grandpa not once. I swore I would never let my kids wish I would have hunted with them more.
If my girls want to go to the woods they know they have to pass a hunters safety class and all 3 have. They attend shoots with me anytime they want to go and they go to the woods with me anytime they want to go. They always get to be the shooter but during fire arms season it's all them. None of them bow hunt yet but have sat in a blind with me on many occasions.
Luckily I have property for them to hunt on and don't have to worry about all the yahoo's running around. I teach them to be ethical and respectful and above all safe.
-
I belive it should be up to the parents to decide. Both my kids were in the woods with me at a young age while I was hunting both saw me harvest a deer at age 5 with a bow. They both started hunting at age 8. Both of them (now 9 and 12) know more about hunting then alot of adults I know. They started to hunt when ages 7 and 8 because I thought they were ready and they told me they were ready. Please do not judge anothers decision most parents make the correct one.
-
I just guided a worthy lad onto his first kill, a 60kg boar. It was also his first hunt, and one of the most memorable hunts that I have ever participated in. He killed it with a Ruger No.1 in .300H&H. Though young, he has the right attitude. I drummed the rules into him, and he observed them correctly. I was seven when I killed my first rabbit, with a Ruger 10/22 .22. If a kid has the right attitude, the sooner someone takes them out for a look, the better it is for the future of hunting.
-
My oldest son at 11 is not eager to kill game yet and he may never be but Ill leave it up to him to let me know when the time is right. I think that this is more of a per case situation than any I can think of. Some people may not cherish the same traditions as you and your kin. I get offended when people tell me they dont like what I teach my kids, not that your post is attempting to do such but in essence it does. This is something to leave to the parents of said child. There are enough entities telling us how to live because it makes them more comfortable while disregarding the way we feel about the deal. :campfire:
-
I invited mine along from the time they were 6. I wouldn't have let them shoot anythign at that age, but they were welcome to come along and spot, track, etc.
Involving a kid in hunting and handing them a rifle are not the same thing.
-
Originally posted by Jeff Strubberg:
Involving a kid in hunting and handing them a rifle are not the same thing.
I think that's the key for me. The age doesn't matter as much. If they can actually participate in all aspects of the hunt, appreciate the time spent with the parent/mentor, and appreciate the life they've taken then I think it's something to be celebrated.
Who's to say the guy writing about his 10 year old daughter didn't have all that going for them? But it doesn't take much of an imagination to imagine the kind of parents taking their kids out to get that first animal with all the emphasis on the collecting the kill. You see it in all the other sports as well, they're teaching winning and not respect for the game. Those kids also rarely experience the satisfaction of having attained success on their own. But now I digress...
Those truly involving their kids as early as possible in hunting for the right reasons have all my respect. And I'm sure they are the best judge of when their child is ready to pull the trigger or release the string.
-
I know I was taging along on Quail hunts before I was 5 and more likely 3. I hunted squirels and rabbits with a pelet rifle when I was 6, alone. I was trained to handle guns carefully and what was safe. I didn't hunt alot with my dad but I did enough to learn the right way to do things. I was on my own hunting deer with a bow by 14 and slug with my dad the same year. I didnt kill a deer until I was 16 and I was alone at the time. I have hunted ever since.
I now have a 3.8yo son who wants to go hunting with me. He has seen deer I have killed as well as squirels. He knows where his food comes from and he tells me it is not nice to kill fawns(I don't,) he has an understanding of how things work. I think he is ready to sit in a duck blind or go squirrel hunting, or even sit in a deer stand this year. He will be 4 Nov. 10 and I would love to take him hunting. However I am maried to a city girl who has no interest or idea about hunting other than what I have tried to teach her. She says he cant go hunting untill he is 12. Her father hunted but didnt share that with her. I will have to wait a few more years out of respect for her. In the mean time we shoot bows and walk in the woods and get outdoors as much as possible. He will be hunting before he is 12 but probaby not for deer.
Every family and child is different. I have cousins kids who have been hunting since they were 5-6 and killed deer and turkeys before they were 10. They live in the sticks and their dad hunts all the time and spends lots of time with them outdoors. They were ready. I know my son will be too when we decide he is allowed to go deer hunting. You cant judge that from a distance only the parents can make that decision.
-
My 8yr old shot his first deer with me right beside him last friday night, he's been hunting with me for 4 years now but this was his first time with a tag. He is to young for a bowhunt since he cant pull the weight but he is a crackshot with the 45 cap and ball. When we heard it crash he said "Dad, this is the best day of my life!" I sure wont deny my kids the chance if the are willing and able. (key word- Able) If they couldnt handle the weapon, they wouldnt be out there.
The kid really makes the difference, my daughter is 12 and this is her first year of any interest at all, she has been shooting 2 times a week all summer long and we are trying to fill her tag now. But due to her lack of interest when she was younger she is nowhere near the woodsman as her younger brother.
-
My 11 year old just got his hunter safety certificate. He sat there for 2 days, paid attention and got a 96 on the test. He knows he can't even hunt til next year.
-
Wow, amazed at the people against it. Suppose you would rather have them playing video games or on the computer. Sorry if it is legal and the parents or a responsible adult is present, I say let them hunt. As said I know enough grown-ups that should not be in the woods and they are, I would rather have a responsible young person in the woods with me than a lot of the idiots I see out there. I had my daughters in the woods with me early on and let me tell you kids learn pretty quick what death is and understand that life is precious. Shawn
-
We agree on that Shawn!
-
I would like to also say I shoot with a 7 year old boy all the time. He is the son of a friend of mine, he has been taught and taught well. I will say I feel safer with him handling a gun around me and others than I do with half the yahoos I see at a local gun club and this kid can out shoot 99% of the adults I know, including me!! If it was legal here in NYS I would not hesitate to allow him to hunt with me and even let him sit in a stand by himself as long as we were in sight of each other, he is just one of those kids like me, that was taught right and has disipline like no other. Shawn
-
I think the hunter safety program is a good judge of when they are ready. If they can take the class, understand the manual and most importantly pass the test they can hunt in my books. If not, wait til next year.
Jason had too take and pass with a 100% score when he was 10 years old. Then he had to pass a shooting test with dad before he was allowed in the woods with a weapon. He'd been going along since he was 3 months old but to be a hunter he had to pass the tests.
BTW try hitting 20 straight in a 9" pie plate at 20 yds under pressure some day.
Mike
-
Originally posted by BAK:
... being allowed to hunt deer was almost a right of passage. It wasn’t for children, it was for those who had shown they could be trusted with weapons, and whose judgment would allow them to survive in the bush if worst came to worst. Oh, we could go out rabbit or squirrel hunting on our own, but going out for big game was for adults, and you knew it. You strived to show your maturity to be allowed that right....
That is how it was where I grew up in Maine.
!2 years old was pretty much the bench mark that we had and if you got a big deer earlier everyone knew you had no clue and it was true. We all knew that the kid who was ten that shot a nice buck didn't do it himself. Yes, he maybe pulled the trigger, but it was all Dad. I mean, we saw these kids every day on the play ground. They were idiots. ( From the perspective of an 11/12/13 year old).
When kids started bagging game in their teens we took notice because we knew they were not only shooting the game, but stalking it, learning its habits and other wood craft and not following Dads direction.
A good hunter in high school was VERY respected.
This was well before any hunter safety or other program.
On a more personal note it is good, IMO, to require youth to wait because it teaches an important lesson in patience. The argument about age is irrelevent alone. There will always be justifications for very young hunters based on opinion. I was required to wait and will require my kids to wait. I am better for it and so will they. I don't mean they won't be in the woods. But they can wait to stalk the woods for big game or take a deer stand. And they will be very proud when they do get the go ahead.
Joshua
-
They've got to start some time.
Sometimes in the name of "correctness", we overlook the obvious.
Children are our future, not just in hunting, but in all facets of life.
The need to be mentored, as mentors, we need to respect their age, and their passions for the things we do.
Each child is different, in maturity levels, the ability to reason, and to understand what we are trying to teach them.
It is up to the mentor, to evaluate each child, and make a decision based on that evaluation.
I went afield at a very young age with my grandfather and uncles, and my sons and grandsons have gone with me, and their grandparents at a very young age. I was comfortable with it and so were they, as were their parents (my grand children).
Don't be too quick to jump to conclusions in either direction, you might be surprised.
Just my .02.
-
Originally posted by BigCountryOK:
It all depends on the situation and the kid. Every situation is different and every kid is different.
Agree 110%
-
Why not let them hunt? Kids are dating at 12 years old. (don't think they arn't...they are, you just might not know it) What's the big deal anyway?
They are eventually going to grow up and have to be responsible arn't they?
I started out in the woods when I was in the third grade, no weapon, I sat with my mom or dad in a ground blind. When I was 11 I could sit alone with my dual shelf orange & white dreamcycle long bow and an arrow my dad set-up for me. I was hunting...all by myself, with my dad perhaps 100 yards away...sleeping no doubt.
Nobody baby sat me. I had a compass, a flashlight, and my knife. I led my dad into and out of the woods till he was confident I could do it on my own. Did I get turned around...certainly, but I figured it out, the answer was not handed to me.
Every night the grown ups would tell the stories of the day...I even got my turn. I learned by listening and asking questions. Nobody and I mean nobody held my hand. If you wanted to run with the big dogs you at least had to act like a big dog!
After many years of missing deer completely I put a tag on my first deer when I was 17 years old. I earned that little buck, and 33 years later I can still remember every little detail. This same group of men talked ME through field dressing my first deer. They didn't so much as hand me my knife. Once home I learned how to cook and eat what I killed. Anything less was unacceptable.
Let the kids go out and learn...if that's the real reason for being there. However the hand holding to guarantee they won't be dissappointed? Well...that's a personal choice today's helicopter parents are going to have to make.
-
My daughter Mattie will be hunting next year when she will be 11 years old, she been taging along with me for the last 5 years and has seen deer shot, help with feild dressing and cutting up the meat. She needs 1 more year to build up her strengeth to shot a 35# bow. I know she's ready.
doug77
-
better than sitting around playing video games
-
I just got inside from a hunt with my little man. He is 9 and this is his first season with a tag. He is an amazing shot with his .45 cap and ball. He has showed me during this season that he is twice the woodsman than a lot of grown men I know! Yet, he has been tagging along with me for years. Scouting, shed hunting, tracking, field dressing and butchering. Just helped me clean 6 chickens yesterday:)
On the other hand, I know kids that were not ready at all but pushed into hunting by parents.
Guess it depends on the kid and family.
-
I started going with my dad when I was 4 or 5. Our church at the time always had a big dove hunt and my dad would let me tag along, with a cap gun. We practiced all the safety rules and I had to treat it as if it were real. Then we moved up to a bb gun. I was allowed to go squirrel hunting and carry my bb gun but again I had to prove I could handle it to move up. I moved from there to a .410 and killed my first squirrel when I was about 8. You have never seen a kid more proud. we always prayed and thanked God for the animals we took. I then passed my hunter safety course and moved up to a .243 and killed my first deer when I was 10. Again, I was absolutely elated and both my dad and grandpa were there. I picked up bow hunting on my own much later but I think gettin a kid in the woods can never be done too early. However, it is sort of a right of passage and a kid must prove he or she has what it takes to hunt safely and effectively. That is different for everybody and it depends on the kid. today I am 22 and hunting is an even bigger part of my life now. Even though I started early, the respect for the animals and our Creator, as well as the ethical responsibility we have to be effective hunters that was taught to me so thoroughly by my father still resonate with me on every trip into the woods God blesses me with.I don't think it is as much of a question of "when" as it is a question of "how." I was taught that how you hunt and why you hunt are much more important than whether you kill or not. Success was and still is (thanks to my dad) spending time in the woods, observing and thanking God for His creation, and realizing life is not about me. "Train a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he shall not depart from it" Prov 22:6
-
I wouldn't trade the days hunting with my Dad for anything,he taught me to always be safe no mattter what my weapon of choice was.
-
One thing I'll never forget are the times when one of my shoes would come untied and I'd have to stop and try to tie it while tagging along behind my dad quail hunting. The reason is because I'd always get further behind and have to try and catch up. He didn't wait on me and I still begged to go every time he went. Probably was about 4yrs. old.
Every child is different..some have the burning desire within and some don't. I always have.
-
Beginning age is a judgment call. If they are ready and willing at 10 so be it. You think this young man should have been told no?
http://tradgang.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=108765
I think the deciding factor for me would be if the kid was practicing and proficient enough to make a clean kill regardless of age. I know some adults that wouldn't pass my test.
-
At the same age some kids are more mature than others.At 10,for blackbear,an adult MOST be on his/her side.
-
kentucky tj that kid was almost 12 and put it where it counted...
-
Well, I agree, to each his own. Maturity plays a big role. My boys, 5 & 7 are more careful with their bow and pellet guns than most grown men. My oldest,7, has killed 2 deer. I don't think that is wrong or "man stuff".
These are my boys, I want to take them everywhere with me and be a part of everything I do!!!
God Bless,
Nathan
-
I would also venture to say that most of the members of TradGang, and all of the ones who care enough to read and comment in this thread are the kind of parents or mentors that make hunting a wonderful thing in a child's development.
:help: