Trad Gang
Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: South MS Bowhunter on November 23, 2011, 11:43:00 PM
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Just recently me and a buddy have been using a canoe to get to some water bound land to Trad hunt hogs, deer, and squirrels. The used canoe I purchased (15'.8" Ram-x) is a little heavy to load and unload unto the top of m FJ cruiser and was wondering what others are using for similar situation? I was looking at the Old Town Guide 119 as a solo canoe this would allow me easier loading and greater benefits in accessing the area's we're finding to hunt. The cons are it would limit carrying anyone else but would allow me to hunt alone without worrying about the loading. Anyone else used one? What your thoughts on them? And what have others found when bow hunting with the use of a canoe or small boat?
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I have an Old Town Royalex canoe which is a single person model. It weighs about 35lbs. and I can lift it myself without any trouble, the friend I got it from installed an extra seat for those times you might want to take a friend along, but you won't be carrying any big critters with you as it would be too heavy with another person along.
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Ken,
What the length of yours? Were you able to carry all you're hunting gear and another person?
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I use a 16' foot canoe and load onto my full size dodge by myself. I just take my time and have learned where to position it for loading. I have also seen some after-market loading systems that seemed like they would work.
Rob
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Man, I live in a canoe all sumer long, I have all kind... the one I use for hunting, is a Hellman Slocan, it is 17.5' and I use it solo but most of the time with my wife and daughter, We can fit a moose and 8 days of gear in it. It is a great canoe.
But there is so many brand to choose from, Do you do mainly lake paddling, or you do some mixe of lake, river and rivers with rapids? Do you need to cary a lot of gear for multy day trips?
If you do mainly lakes, I would suggest a 16 to 17' prospector in Kevlar, it will handle alsmost every thing other than class 2/3 rapids and be real light, can be paddle solo easily, and also can be portaged easily!
Let me know if you want more info.
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I have an Old Town Pathfinder, it's 16' and weights 50#'S. I bought it just for the purpose of portaging from lake to lake and it will carry two people and some modest gear. Made of Royalex material. Great canoe for what you described.
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i have 2 i use
a 15 1/2 foot poly clearwater design i solo on the dams and easy rivers its just big enough for the if i want to take more stuff and a buddy.
or me deer and stuff for a few days. about 60ish#'s
then a blue 11 1/2 foot thick plastic 1/2 canoe 1/2 sitin kayak no name but man i love it. its just big enough for me and a deer or a bunch of treerats. it had 2 seats and i re did it to solo about 40ish#'s. i have been trying to get my buddy to go hunt like that.
while fishing we see lots of game but havent tried it yet. i had a coleman 15.5 and it was just to heavy like you said like 80ish#s but heavy duty solid canoe got rid of it for my bearcat recurve. i looked into the 119 and the i think it was the pac 12 oldtown the reviews said. great canoe but to lower the seat brackets to make it more stable. when my lil blue canoe don't float i think thats what ill get. the smaller canoes are a blast im 6'4" 265#. go for the solo and then you got both. maybe your buddy will get one also. a few of my buddys did and we have a blast on the water summer and fall.
just remember to wear you floatation device
safe hunting to you n yours
happy turkey day
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i recently bought an old town saranac 146 XT
love it heaps. not too big for solo and great for my wife an i and our little girl.
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Have you thought about a small trailer for the canoe that might solve your problems. I had a coleman canoe made of ram-x and although uglyand heavy it was indestructable. I used to drag it across the ice in the spring and fall for trapping and even ran it over tith the truck once by accident...tough canoes.
Last year a buddy and I flew in to do some moose hunting and we used his kevlar canoe, it was light enough for one guy to handle even though it was a 16 foot canoe with room to spare.
The lighter the canoe the more it's going to cost you.
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I've got an FJ and built a custom rack for it. Works like a charm for me. I hunt from a Native Ultimate 14.5, and it's perfect for what I do. It weighs 65#, but I have no trouble getting her up on my rack. The secret is the rear most loading bar. I put the kayak on the ground with the stern on the centerline behind the rack and the bow off to the side. I then lift the bow up and rest on the rear slide loader. Then walk to the stern, lift, and push her right on up into the saddles.
(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o203/Apex-Predator/Kayaking/Comparison9.jpg)
(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o203/Apex-Predator/Kayaking/DSC01837.jpg)
(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o203/Apex-Predator/Kayaking/KayakRack7.jpg)
(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o203/Apex-Predator/Kayaking/KayakRack8.jpg)
(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o203/Apex-Predator/Kayaking/KayakRack4.jpg)
(http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o203/Apex-Predator/Kayaking/KayakRack1.jpg)
Here is a post I made on the FJ Cruiser forum with links and tech info on how I made the rack.
http://www.fjcruiserforums.com/forums/interior-exterior-visual-tech/127128-home-made-kayak-roof-rack-system.html
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It doesn't appear like the links in my link work any more! :) If you have interest just pm me and I'll see if I can locate the pieces for you.
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I'll suggest to the wife I quit my job and every time you get ready to hunt I'll be Johnny on the spot.Think it'll work! Good morning bro and happy Thanksgiving to the Langleys.
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Nice rig Apex!
I have an Old Town discovery 16'
It will hold two people and lots of gear.
I can paddle it solo, it helps to weight the bow though.
I'd love to see how it works with a deer up there...
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I have the Guide 119. It is a great canoe. It is fairly lightweight, I can carry and load it very easy. I have not hunted out of it and I think it may be a little tight getting a big deer in it but can probably be done. The nice thing about it is that it paddles easily with a double bladed paddle. This will get you to your destination a whole lot faster. I also have a Old Town Guide 147. If you are looking for an inexpensive canoe this will also be a good option. It is very stable, will have enough room for 2 but can easily be paddled solo. I have had mine for about 15 years and it is still holding up great after a lot of use. Of course the 147 is heavier but I can carry it on my shoulders using the yoke and it isn't bad at all. Let me know if you have any questions.
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I have a 16 foot Bell Northwind in royalex...weight 57# I think...I can lift it by myself easy enough but two makes it a snap. It is a little large but has great load carrying for coolers, gear, or the occasional guest (human, deer, hog, etc)....tracks good in wind...not overly tippy and glides very well over water even with moderate chop.
I have paddled it solo but need to move to the next cross member if you put the front up too high. :)
I carry it on my 100 series Land Cruiser but also did on my FJC. I ended up putting BajaRack on FJC since it was plug and play but before then...and even now I have the MALONE Canoe feet....they are great. I also have a pair of the padded velcro and tye pads you get from watersport stores for your racks....they make sliding the rig up onto rack a bunch easier....huge difference.
Here is link for the Malone Bigfoot Pro canoe carriers....comes with bow and stern lines as well.
http://www.maloneautoracks.com/canoe-carriers.php
I like it as it removes guesswork...is sturdy...and very well built for fair price.
Then buy a pair of the cam buckle load straps as well and you are set.
Chasing redfish and trout all summer here in tidal flats of SC it took me maybe 4-5 minutes to load, install cam straps, tie off bow and stern.....and less time to remove using my rock sliders as steps.
Good luck and good paddling
Ron Herman
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I've got an Old Town 17' made from a material they call Oltinar. It's a laminated PVC material that is indestructible. this thing is a freighter that you can load 1000 pounds in and does white water pretty well with two paddlers.... but she weighs 70 pounds and i have a full size van. i used to use top mount racks, but found it much easier to use a small utility trailer rather than muscling the thing over head....
Just recently i changed my strategy and got something much lighter... these things are excellent.
(http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u301/kirkll/River%20boats/IMAG0270.jpg)
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Old Town "Charles River". At 85lbs, for me it is the most versitile canoe on the market.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v323/Osagetree/Greenbrier%20River%20Canoe%20Trip%202009/IMG_0210.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v323/Osagetree/Greenbrier%20River%20Canoe%20Trip%202009/IMG_0233.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v323/Osagetree/Greenbrier%20River%20Canoe%20Trip%202009/IMG_0390.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v323/Osagetree/Greenbrier%20River%20Canoe%20Trip%202009/IMG_0396.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v323/Osagetree/Greenbrier%20River%20Canoe%20Trip%202009/IMG_0418.jpg)
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Thanks guys for the info. Marty I talked to you awhile back About your rack(very nice). I made a simpler rack out of conduit that works for now. My only issue is when loading by myself. That why I'm looking at a small lighter canoe for times when the buddy not around.
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Here's some canoe pictures
(http://www.shrewbows.com/rons_linkpics/Armstrong%20Creek%20Buck.jpg)
(http://www.shrewbows.com/rons_linkpics/Buck-in-canoe.jpg)
(http://www.shrewbows.com/rons_linkpics/Canoe_Buck.jpg)
(http://www.shrewbows.com/rons_linkpics/Yew_canoe.jpg)
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To really appreciate todays modern canoes you've gotta try a real birch bark.
(http://www.shrewbows.com/rons_linkpics/Birch_Bark_hunters.jpg)
Here's me in my little 12' canvas canoe next to a 26' birch bark Northwest canoe
(http://www.shrewbows.com/rons_linkpics/Lake_trip15.jpg)
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Cool pics Ron!
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Ron,
Those are so cool, i'm dreaming of a deer or hog pic in my future!
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Canoes are not that heavy, they're just awkward to handle for there weight and shape. Once you learn how to properly carry a canoe on your shoulders they're quite easy to manuveur around. This includes learning the proper way to get it up on your shoulders. As well as learning proper tie-down techniques for your vehicle. canoeing is a lot like traditional bowhunting....there's stuff you gotta learn to do it right! Unfortunately, this stuff is hard to describe but easy to learn when you watch someone do it....like twisting a flemish string. Pick up a Bill Mason DVD and watch it.
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17.5 wood and canvas canoe I built. Pretty light at 74 pounds and very quite. I think once you paddle one of these you'll never go back aluminum or plastic. They kinda fit right in with the stuff we shoot and are easy to look at.
It will carry two adults and a weeks worth of gear with no problem.
If your gonna carry a good load use a longer canoe. You will float in less water and you can manuver much better. At least that has been my experience. Also, they will pole a heck of alot better than a short boat. Depending on the water your in, poling is the only way to go, again, that has been my experience.
Something else to consider, again depending on the water, you may or may not want a keel. A flat bottom boat is less manuverable than a boat with some rocker. A boat with a keel is less manuverable than one without.
You know, canoes are kinda like bows, you can never have to many.
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Note the carrying yoke in this wooden canoe. It has no seats and we had to kneel on a boat cushion.
You can probably tell that this is a pretty old picture. I had a dark beard back then and my young son in the picture is a grandfather now... :)
(http://www.shrewbows.com/rons_linkpics/Father%20&%20Son,%20Trappers.jpg)
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Ron, Your pictures are always the best and I never get tired of looking at them. :readit:
Tracy
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I just bought the OldTown 116Guide Unfortunatly it was to replaced my recent stolen 126 Guide that I have had for 3 years. I like the cannoe but I don't have a lot of seat time in it yet. The Front Plastic handle was miss fitted and I have to get a new one. I am not sure about haw much weight it can hold with hunting gear and my fat but a deer might require 2 trips. J.Michael
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X2 Ron!
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I use an Old Town Guide 14' model. I can carry myself, but it does get heavy. Old Town Guides are built like tanks and are good boats - as many posters above own and have commented.
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John,
Some good advice here. While I don't generally canoe hunt (only because of opportunity) I pretty much do everything else in one. That said, my current one is a used, plastic, canoe-rental cast-off beast and I feel your pain. I used to have an Oldtown Tripper that was Royalex/ABS (I forget which or even if they're different mat'l)that I will forever regret getting rid of. It was longer, lighter, and way more manueverable than my current one. The point is that light-weight space-age material canoes have been around for a long time. You will "slap-leather" for them, but deals can be had and now's the time to be watching Craigslist. Peolpe buy top-of-the-line, use one season, and sell at steep discount when they need a little winter cash. Don't overlook older ones if the price is right. The aforementioned Tripper had been owned by a whitewater junkie and the hull was severely abraided at both ends. The upside is that the alot of the "technoweenie" stuff could be patched quite easily with fiberglass cloth and marine epoxy compared to today's bombproof "plastic", which nothing wants to adhere to. She looked like Fido's a**, but God I still miss her!
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I have an old town 119 and while it is a nice little boat to float small creeks , I would not think of it as a good stable utility boat. I have had a several canoes and kayaks and would consider the 119 a cross between the two. Very tippy and rather narrow. It is great for navigating small streams and fishing, but there are much better choices for what you want. I would consider a major brand 14' royalex boat designed for fishing. Would be short and stable.
(I had to move the seat forward and lower it on my 119 in order to make it the most stable for fishing. And really no room to transport a deer) Good luck
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I have been looking at getting a Sportspal. Aluminum, foam lined, good flotation, reportedly very difficult to tip, under 50 pounds and pretty good payload. Hard to find a used one around here though and I have a terrible disease; I have a real need to purchase a new bow first.
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That Sportspal looks good and it seem that there is two different brands one made in Canada (thinner Aluminum) and one made in USA (Thicker and a little heavier).
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Whatever canoe you choose, you might want to consider a Weston canoe loader. I can load an old 17' aluminum canoe on my Ranger slicker than snot on a doorknob with it. No more worries about the paint on my truck, and no more folding myself into a pretzel getting out from under it after loading.
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Ron
that last picture is awesome...brings back memories...
I can feel the dampness and smell the fur...
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Unbelievable pictures Ron! You really have a way of capturing a story in each picture. Whenever I see your posts, I always check them out for the great pictures.
Bernie Bjorklund
NC Iowa/SW Wisconsin
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The photo Apex Predator had early on showed a Native-ccraft Kayak. Really neat boat, I got one last spring and I'm very pleased. Kind'a half kayak/half canoe, very stable and the seats are really comfy....you can go all day. Next fall I may do a hunt in the Adirondacks out of mine!
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To get back to the original question. If weight is an issue, plus the ability of the canoe to handle two people or one with gear and game, there are a number of canoes that fill the job nicely and they are all made of kevlar. A symmetrical canoe can be paddled backwards and rather quickly with either Bill Mason style paddling techniques or using a longer than normal kayak paddle available at a reasonable price from Red Rock Outfitters of Ely, mn. There are a number of designs that work from manufacturers like Souris River, Wenonah Canoe, Bell, or Mad River. My utility canoe is a high grade 16'4" Mad river Explorer in a lay up that is no long made is 42 pounds. The souris river Quetico 16 or any Prospector copy will be just as good. What you don't want is a spar behind the front seat, it gets in the way when using the canoe as a solo, but I would want something with reserve floatation for when things are not perfect for paddling or you get a heavier than normal load you need to get out. Solo canoes and kayaks will not be very good at getting a deer out if there is current or wind driven waves. Call the man at Red Rock outfitters, he knows his stuff about using weighed down canoes in all conditions, no sense trying to reinvent the wheel on your own. The folks up north live this stuff. You would be surprised how easy it is to get a canoe from the Ely, Mn canoe outfitters to almost anywhere in the country. Take a close look at the Souris River 17, it will do anything and hold up well doing it. Who knows maybe one day we will cross paths somewhere out in the Canadian wilderness.
http://www.redrockstore.com/ or
http://piragis.com/
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1911 old towne I rebuilt for use up here. Love old stuff!!!
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I have a 16ft Wenonah kevlar canoe - 39 lbs. It is easy for one person to lift, and control in the water, but can easily carry two people with equipment. Consider a set of outriggers. They cost about 200 dollars and will really allow you to move around in the boat or load a deer into the boat without worrying about the boat tipping.