Trad Gang
Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: Fleatrap1 on October 28, 2013, 06:33:00 PM
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Seems Illinois has seen a slow increase in large cat (cougar?) sightings. Although not quite as obscure as bigfoot these animals are the story of lore among hunters. Trail cams have caught and confirmed (by Illinois DNR) cats on a couple occasions. Another picture has surfaced just to the south of me.
A few people I have spoken with (myself not included) would love to shoot one to protect the beloved citizens of Illinois and the children who might be in the woods. Myself, I doubt I would shoot it even if I could. For those of you who live in "Big Cat" territory, do you take any sort of protection into the woods with you. Also, despite the hype in my state how aggressive are these guys in your neck of the woods?? I would much rather base my opinions on facts than local lore. Thanks all.....
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Howdy Flea,
I live above 8,000' and deep in the Rockies. We have them here and every few years we'll have a human-lion interaction - sometimes with tragic results.
The reality is that they are extremely rare, a single cat typically roams a 'turf' miles and miles across.
I typically carry a sidearm when on walkabout (unless hunting) in case the occasional bear doesn't scapper off like they usually do and in the unlikely event I see a cat.
The general rule of thumb we use locally is, if you see the cat it's because he wants you to or doesn't care...and neither option is good for you. The recommendations from the DOW experts are roughly the same as for bear, make noise, look bigger, don't run. With cats however, chances are if you see them they've been tracking you for lunch so they may not discourage easily. I wouldn't hesitate to shoot one if it was circling and wouldn't scare off.
AJ
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I have lived in mountain lion country for a bunch of years, and I spend a lot of time in the woods. My lone sighting was a lion crossing a highway in Arizona, not Wyoming. I did have a lion kill a deer on a trail I had walked about 2 hours before, but I never saw the cat. No telling how many have watched me without my knowledge, but I don't worry about them and think they are much more interested in taking deer than taking me.
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I had one walk within 50yds of my home and cross hwy one about 3:30 in the afternoon 4yrs or so ago.
I know they roam through here..Shawnee.
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Here in CO there have been at least three deaths that I can remember wherein lions have preyed upon humans. Two were young children and one a teen age boy.
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Below is the link to an account of one of my encounters with a mid-sized kitty:
http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=055765#000000
My bet is I have walked by several hundred kitty's over the years and never knew they were there watching me.
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I lived in Billings in 1973&74 and spent a great deal of time in areas that had lions. I have cut their tracks a number of times but have yet to see one in the wild. I suspect the odds of being attacked by a lion are considerably higher than being struck by lightning and I rather doubt the value of a sidearm as protection against a lion that really wants to do you harm. They attack from behind, from ambush at close range and make practically no noise. If I remember correctly they are the most efficient at kills per attempts among all the world's large cats but again they are extraordinarily difficult to even sight and the odds of a simple encounter much less suffering an attack are miniscule.
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Even if you hunt in the cat's area, I believe it is highly unlikely you will be in danger. We have a good population in Washington and most of us hunters rarely see them.
Cougar attacks in residential areas are rare, and those are usually limited to small pets or small children (running around squealing). For some odd reason, folks on bikes seem to be a rare target as are joggers.
To be really safe, avoid running around (or riding a bike) and yelling or acting like an injured critter. Just enjoy the moment if you happen to see one.
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I killed a nice lion two years ago while hunting in Idaho, but it was over my dogs. I've seen about 2 dozen lions treed by my dogs. Without my dogs I hunt a lot of days per year in Washington State and Idaho and in 16 years of hunting I've had one encounter. I was turkey hunting north of Spokane. Made several calls, stood up and turned around and there 30 feet away crouched down about to spring was a big tom. Impressive animal! He stood up turned to walked away and stopped and looked at me with complete disdain. Gave me a silent hiss and walked away. What really struck me was knowing he was there and watching him walk away he still made absolutely no sound. I think he was about to pounce, but it was clearly a case of mistaken identity. He heard turkey calling and saw my camo'd form from the waist up. All that said when my kids were growing up I never allowed them to run free in the woods up there, they are in real danger from lions, particularly young lions just out on their own.
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Thanks Guys. I don't doubt they roam here and there in Illinois. I will take the sightings very seriously though. Seems if they are around they are a very formidable predator.
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I grew up on a ranch right on the face of the bighorns in Wyoming,and there was cats that went through the yard several times when i was a kid. Every once in a while one would eat a barn cat off the front step but other than that we never paid them much mind. We didn't seen them very often but would find there kills quite a bit. Never seemed to bother the cows and horses though.
I did get to fill my loin tag once while deer hunting but that was just a moment of opportunity more than anything else. All that being said whenever we were out and about we normally were packing a pistol of some sort but that was just as much for the coyotes, skunks, porcupines and snakes as it was for the lions and bears. My feeling is that as long as there is plenty of deer and space for them lions don't really bother much, now you start getting young ones pushed out of the woods and closer to town were deer might be scarce and problems might arise.
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I live on Vancouver Island and we have one of, if not the highest concentrations of cats in North America. In forty years of working/hunting/hiking in the woods I've seen four. In your area at this time chances of an encounter I'd say are slim.
Most attacks here have been younger cats looking for easy prey, usually kids or small animals. My buddy's dog was attacked on the 3D range within ten feet of him. There have also been adults attacked. Most adults I've heard of that survived an attack have had a knife. (One used his bicycle)
An attack on a human will usually but not always come from behind. You won't hear it until it's on you. A side arm might work but I can't carry here.
I'm 63 and spend a lot of time scouting, hiking and stump shooting on my own so my choice is a fixed blade knife worn at the front, handle down on webbing over my shoulder. It clips into the sheath with no snaps or buckles and can be withdrawn simply by pulling on it. Some might call it a combat knife. It's no guarantee but it will give me a chance in the unlikely event I need it.
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Although not quite as obscure as bigfoot these animals are the story of lore among hunters.
How about a "Big Foot" slaying a mountain lion...
A Big Foot Obsidian actually....
(http://i171.photobucket.com/albums/u301/kirkll/Bows%202012/Big%20Foot%20Obsidian/LaramysMountainLion2.jpg) (http://s171.photobucket.com/user/kirkll/media/Bows%202012/Big%20Foot%20Obsidian/LaramysMountainLion2.jpg.html)
We have quite a few of these cats in Oregon. most of the bow hunters carry side arms for bears and cats.... I've seen them on several occasions in broad daylight, and had them circling our camp at night.... You never heard a sound so scary as having one scream at you at close yardage.
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We had one follow the Truckee right into a casino, a young tom. I agree many of them observe us to everyone wevsee. I hunted in Dec and the deer yards had cat tracks all around them in the snow
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I think you have a lot better chance of being gored by a deer than attacked by a lion. I don't consider them much of a danger but I do consider them very tasty.
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i lived in washington state for a while just west of mt st helens up in the rain cloud. went fishing in the near by streams and hunting up in the mountains, and never saw one...saw the sign and heard them cry at night but otherwise not a thing. i wouldnt worry about it but i would as always be hunting with a tentative eye...i knew a few hunters who would take them out with a bow...just remember that before the gun and smoke poles came around there was only arrows, spears and knives and the Native Americans survived just fine. This is just my $.02 worth tho ;)
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I live in Fremont County, Colo, rumored to have highest number of lions per square mile in the state. I spend all my spare time out side and I have never seen one. Tracks, scat, dead deer, yes but an actual cat never. I'm sure they've seen me but...
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I grew up in lion country and have hunted them for a long time. I grew up with a good friend whos dad had some of the best hounds living at the time. I have seen some where around 50 in a tree over dogs. I now have my own and spend a lot of time pusuing them.
I have also seen lions without dogs. Five in wyo while out and about. One of them my cousin even took. One in texas and one in UT.
I had an amazing oppertunity to watch a lion hunt many years ago. A large male cat took down a healty mature bull elk. The entire strugle was only about 30 seconds. Since that day I have not been to scared of them. I figure if they want me they got me.
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I just ran into some people (extended family of some close friends) from around Galena, IL who have property in that area. They spotted a mountain lion on (or near) their land last year and got a good look at it.
Another friend of mine claims to have spotted one on his 1,500 acres somewhere north of Dixon, IL several years ago.
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We have seen their sign-tracks and scat-had a large deer kill less than 100 yards from the tracks at our local range. Last year there was a road kill lion 1 mile from our house in town. Cats have turned up occasionally in neighborhoods, school yards, bike paths-you name it. And I'm still looking for my first sighting. LOL
Maybe I'll get lucky sooner than later. :archer2:
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I've been (un)lucky enough to have seen half a dozen while hunting. Most have not seen me, but I have encountered them at very close range on two separate occasions. One was while hunting in Eastern Oregon. I decided to stalk up the side of a hill with tall grass and wind blowing right at me. It was a good idea, seeing how a cat had decided so as well. When it's head popped up above the grass and looked at me, I froze and stared right back for at least an hour (maybe 10 seconds in real time), before it bounded off in the other direction. When I resumed my stalk, I ran right into a cow elk that I managed to shoot a foot or so over her back. Maybe it was the nerves.
On another occasion here in California, I came across some fresh deer tracks with even fresher lion tracks on top of them. I followed the tracks for a bit and then heard a hiss from a bush about ten feet behind me. I turned in time to see the biggest cat I had ever encountered bounding away from me. Had he decided to pounce, I am certain I would have been done for.
We get a lot of reports in California recently regarding cat attacks on dogs and occasionally on children or sitting adults. We are no longer allowed to hunt them here and they are starting to become a bit more daring. I imagine there will be more attacks in the near future as climate change increases drought weather here and the complete lack of any predators increases their numbers.
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A story to ponder :readit:
http://www.shrewbows.com/bowie_defender.html
:bigsmyl:
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Originally posted by Ron LaClair:
A story to ponder :readit:
http://www.shrewbows.com/bowie_defender.html
:bigsmyl:
Send me one of them bowies, and I'll tape a rabbit to my back and go trolling!
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Illegal here in Missouri, if you kill a mt.lion/cougar you will do jail time. Other than that, if I encountered one..............I'd just let it pass and go about it's way. If it faced me or aggressed toward me it would eat a broadhead or a bullet. Then the 3-S rule would apply. aka shoot, shovel, shut the fk up. Sorry, I didn't really say that.
MO
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Great story Ron, you should write more.........but it kinda turned into an ad for a Ron Clair Bowie Knife, and that's where you lost me. With that said, I would love to read about some of your hunts. So if you have some books in print, or online, please send me the links. You are definitely one of the original masters of the bow and I give you my respect Sir, and thank you for your contribution to the Traditional Sport of Archery! I mean that from the bottom of my heart.
MO
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Seems I hear of them every few weeks the past few months here on Vancouver Island.
Been here 4 yrs and not seen one.
When I hike with my two boys 5 & 6, in the bush I carry a knife and an 18.5 inch Mossburg 500.
I thought that was a bit over kill but after a couple of attacks since I've been here and the local RCMP and a military guy I know both suggesting I be armed, I am. Not just for the big cat's thou...
Jock Whisky - where 'bouts on the island do you live?
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Had two in camp last year. We use joggers for bait out here for them. The two that came in or camp was just walking on the dirt road and our camp was on their way. They did not care about us at all and was not afrade of us at all. Seen a couple others while hunting and those took off as soon as they seen me. I will never go calling in the sierras with out a partner and side arm. They are not to be trusted. No telling how many we never see.
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Those of you living in lion country, do you try to be out of the woods at dark? I would think walking in woods at dark increases your chances at being attack drastically!?
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Nope, walked many a mile in the dark in lion county with a headlamp and a sidearm.
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Originally posted by RedShaft:
Those of you living in lion country, do you try to be out of the woods at dark? I would think walking in woods at dark increases your chances at being attack drastically!?
Oddly enough, I have never seen or even heard a cougar at night. They should be out and about hunting, but still not one encounter, and I rarely ever use a light at night. Once it gets pretty dark, I do tend to make a little more noise than necessary, though, just in case. In California, we are not allowed to carry a side arm during archery deer season, so I figure noise is the best defense I can muster since I am not hitting squat with my longbow in the dark.
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I have seen them two different times in SE Iowa and someone got one on a trail camera in NW Illinois.
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Another cougar caught on a deer cam near Carlinville, Illinois by Broom's Orchard over the weekend.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v71/Iflytrout/Pictures/Cougar_zpsa1642a71.jpg)
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I was the outdoor editor for a major daily newspaper in Montana for 15 years and have bowhunted Montana for 30 years -- some years hardcore intensity and other years pretty casually. I have never encountered a lion in the woods. However, I have written five or six stories and interviewed people who have and they are nothing to screw with. Yes, they are elusive and likely to leave before you see them but on several occassions stalked bowhunters and on another tried to take a small child from a group of hikers on a trail near Missoula. Here in Montana I think you are more likely to encounter a bear than a lion. I also went on a lion research trip with a noted wildlife biologist and we captured and tagged one. Mighty impressive beast up close.
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I've seen them several times. I'm in Nevada, just over the hill from California and there's plenty of cats around. I watched one stalking and taking down a sheep on a ranch in broad daylight one Saturday morning. They can be incredibly fast!
As a general rule, the fewer the lions around the more secretive they are. Trouble starts when there are too many, and the young ones get pushed into new territory. Young toms seem to be the worst. There was one where I used to live that was way to friendly. He would sit in the cottonwood behind my garage, scratch and pee on the tree. He met his end a few miles away along the river when he went after a guys two dogs and the guy shot him with his sidearm.
We've had lions chase dirt bikes, joggers and bicyclists. Over in the Sierras in Shingletown (east of Redding) the lions are a huge problem. They just aren't afraid of people as they haven't been hunted since the early 70s. I won't go into the woods around there without a big belt knife.
I think you're pretty safe in Illinois, at least for a while.
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I had the (pleasure) of seeing one up close,11 steps while sitting in a tree stand while elk hunting. It was just breaking day and I heard it panting and I thought of National Geographic.Lions at the water hole. It turned and looked right at me, put its ears back and wrinkled its brow. I had an arrow knocked and decided to shout an obcenity for it to leave. It slowly turned and left. One of the neatest things Iv'e seen in 50 some years in the bush.
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While Elk hunting this past September in CO, my hunting partner and I asked our CO friends about mt. lion sightings. 3 of them were in their 60s and have hunted there all of their lives and hadn't had a half dozen sightings between them. Dick told me that someone once told him (conservation officer maybe?) that you could have 10,000 people walk a trail in mountains and one of them would see a lion, but the lion would 9,999 of the people.