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Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: Rob W. on August 09, 2014, 10:33:00 PM
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The binocular thread got me thinking about the fact that I stopped carrying binos a few years ago.
I understand that for western hunting they are a must but around here I try to get as many deer in the freezer before the guns go off. That means leaves are on the trees for the bulk of my season and 150 yrds is seeing a long way. I also ground hunt and have a minimalistic/lightweight approach to what I carry.
Don't get me wrong when I'm duck hunting I don't leave home without them. They are a useful tool and weight isn't a factor. That said I don't remember wishing I had them the last few years. I remember reading one of the Asbell books and he placed a lot of emphasis on optics. So, I carried them around with me a few weeks, didn't use them, killed a couple deer and put them back in my duck pack.
So what say yee am I not seeing forest or the trees for the lack of optics?
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You seem to have made a logical choice.
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Getting close to deer on the ground means seeing them first usually. Binos can help in that regard, especially when looking thru foliage. Stopping every few yards to have a look will also slow you down. JMHO
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Next to my bow and knife it is the most important tool I have. From midwest whitetail to turkey. I can not tell you all the turkeys I have taken due to binocs. I see deer I would never have observed. Dim light. I assess deer. Age, size, etc. Check out an ear or tail. I can not imagine hunting without them.
Dan in KS
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I hunt out west and don't carry them but I do carry a ten power monocular, fits in my pants pocket. I can spot an elk over a mile away but the monocular separates the elk from the elk rocks. I carry it tree stand hunting the river bottoms out on the plains too but it's still more open there than the bottoms back east.
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You should carry big, heavy binoculars that dangle loosely around your neck. They will slow you down while walking and you'll see more game that way! :bigsmyl:
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No right or wrong, let your hunting style dictate your use. I tend to use them scouting since I am a terrain hunter. Usually heading to a specific spot.
Still hunting in an unfamiliar area I can see where they would be useful.
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I suppose if I strictly hunted from a stand or blind I could justify forgoing optics. The only animals I would be interested in would be the ones sauntering down the path toward my manicured, pre determined shooting lane. My favourite hunting method is still hunting and spot and stalk. This is what Asbells book focuses heavily on and why he emphasizes quality optics.
Optics are not only for long range glassing of sheep or goats. I have picked out blacktails and elk 50 yards away while still hunting that I had failed to see a minute earlier while scanning the brush with the naked eye. Beyond magnification to erase distance, quality optics gather more light, bringing animals sitting in the shadows to, well, light. This is especially critical during the first and last hour of the hunt.
This is coming from a western hunter, but I would never intentionally leave my binos at home, even for a short hunt.
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I just love to see stuff closer. Even a deer at twenty yards I will watch with my binoculars to observe. Every deer I see in heavy cover I try to instantly glass and identify age and sex to determine if I will be shooting or not if a shot presents itself.
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Here in PA we have an antler point restriction. It helps in identification of a legal buck before he hits bow range.
Beyond that, I carry a good set all of the time in the woods, regardless of the season. They allow me to scan the woods beyond bow range and many times a season I will pick up a deer partially hidden in the brush that I had been missing with just my own eyesight.
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I'm with you Rob. At my advancing age and knees/hips begging for replacement, every ounce of gear has to justify its inclusion! I do like an economical, high magnification compact for 3-D tourneys to pick up the vitals on those black targets in the shade. Hunting, I don't tote 'em.
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Your statement about not missing them says it all. Any time I forget mine (rarely) I miss them. You're getting it done without an extra piece of gear. Hard to fault that.
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Originally posted by KSdan:
Next to my bow and knife it is the most important tool I have. From midwest whitetail to turkey. I can not tell you all the turkeys I have taken due to binocs. I see deer I would never have observed. Dim light. I assess deer. Age, size, etc. Check out an ear or tail. I can not imagine hunting without them.
Dan in KS
I agree with Dan. I don't go into the deer or turkey woods without them. I do use a good harness which even helps to keep bulky clothes away from my string. I use them to spot and identify before the shot and after the shot, I can use them to see the travel path of a wounded animal or even see the downed animal and determine if a follow shot is needed or if the animal is down for good.
Plus I love to check out all the cool birds and animals up close, that are around me.
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sure,..( you don't need them ) just like a video camera, I don't need it. its just fun to have along just incase you want to use it. really all you need is bow and arrows.
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They are the second most important tool I have, the first being a weapon. With that said I have poor eyesight and they let me tell the difference between a blob and a tree, stump, dirt, debrit, or animal before I am within 20yds. It's more important than a knife for me as I could use a broadhead to dress game but I need the glass to be able to hunt effectively.
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I have found that even at closer distances, 50 yards and under, my current vision needs all the help it can get from 500 yards to the 50 yards and under. A bedded deer might twitch an ear that binos will help me see. My naked eye wouldn't be able to see the detail I now see as blurred images without the binos. Sweat and fogged up lenses cause me to leave the eyeglasses off. Binos take their place for an as-needed use.
That reminds me, my new eyeglass lenses are ready for pick-up at the eye doc...
Bino use is an individual decision based on necessity.
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I'm also with Dan on this.
I wouldn't think of hunting whitetails without them. Mine are setup with bino buddies so they don't move around. The straps also keep my clothes back out of the way of my bowstring. I don't scan the woods with them....too much movement but I will use them to verify size of deer, sex (button bucks)and shot placement. Clarifying where my arrow hit and studying the deers body language after the shot is huge and will help determine when to take up the trail. I also use them to study the deer before I approach them. With whitetails I take nothing for granted and verify everything.
I will also use them to scout alternative tree stand locations from the stand I'm in. Also, did you know that if you flip them upside down they can be used as a magnifier. :notworthy:
I never leave home without them.
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I'm with you Bud. I may not be aging, but my eyes sure are.., :banghead:
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I personally dont use them. I feel if I am constantly putting them to my face, I am making too much movement.
I can understand the logic everyone has mentioned and see how they can be useful.
One last note before I leave....
Binoculars are not traditional :laughing: :deadhorse: :shaka:
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Unless I'm hunting open country (croplands, west, etc.) I don't take my binocs either.
I'll admit there have been a few times, maybe once every season, that I see a bit of deer out of range moving through trees that I couldn't quite make out. Of course these instances haven't been shot opportunities, just "scouting" incidents.
I wouldn't use the binocs to constantly scan from my treestands. I'd be far too concerned about excessive movement.
Maybe, if I owned super-dooper binocs (mine are Leopold) I might appreciate them more?
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I bought a pair of Savorskies around twenty years ago and they have been used maybe three times. Once in awhile I find them in my closet and verify that they are still present. Hate carrying extra stuff. If I was going on a western hunt probably would use them.
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wouldn't leave home without them. a quality pair of binoculars just makes the whole experience more enjoyable. the few times that I have forgotten them, I always missed them.
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Before I started wearing glasses I never went into the woods without my compact binos. Now I rarely carry them except on my annual hog hunt to SC.
Just yesterday I went groundhog hunting and took my binoculars. What a pain in the butt to prop my bow on the ground and hold under my arm, take off my glasses, and look at something with the binos. I was sorry I took them.
You are supposedly able to roll the rubber eyepiece back and use with eyeglasses on but it never worked for me. What you get is a view like you are looking through a pipe and smudged glasses.
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I use binos while scouting and occasionally while hunting. While I like having them, and sometimes wish I had them when I dont just don't feel they are worth the trouble in the type cover and terraine I hunt in. I did buy a set of Vortex monaculars last year for hunting. I like the fact that they are lighter and can be used and focused with one hand. But I still didn't Cary them very often. I can see in a different area or style of hunting that they would go to the top of the list in stuff to take.
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I don't leave camp without them. With my advancing years and hips and knees begging for replacement (thanks, ol' dog rib!) I can scope out the difference between a rub and a dead stick without walking up to it, or spreading my wonderful human scent in an area of suspected deer activity. Without them, I have spent hours waiting for a bedded stump to arise.
I can use the focus wheel to "travel" through gaps in the foliage, to tell the difference between one shadow and the next, between bark and hair. My glassing is done as slowly as molassas in January, and serves as a passtime while waiting in ambush. I love watching all kinds of wildlife, and use them year-around.
I recently bought a pair of Swarovskis, set me back a thousand dollars. I wish I had done it twenty years ago, when my eyes were better than perfect. Now that I wear glasses, binocs are not quite as fun, but the Swaros have eyecups that twist in, and make them quite compatible with eyewear. For long sessions, I can take my glasses off.
I feel crippled in the field without binoculars.
Killdeer
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I can't ever remember thinking, "Darn... I wish I didn't have these binos." But can recall many case thinking "Damn! I wish I had my binos!" I use the harness style (I call it the bono bra) strap. The keep the glass from bouncing on your chest, dangling as you draw, and help contain loose clothing around you chest. They are critical for picking deer out of heavy cover. And.... There's lots of other cool things besides deer out there to look at!
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(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f43/wachatz/NCM_0064_zpslqtybthm.jpg) (http://s44.photobucket.com/user/wachatz/media/NCM_0064_zpslqtybthm.jpg.html)
Here is my answer to need versus portability, they do take some getting used too, but they have the eye cup you can adjust to make compatible with my glasses.
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I love them turkey hunting. Like many others I use a harness to tote them around. I only take them deer hunting when I take my backpack. Most of my hunting is private owned farms so I'm never more than a mile from the truck, so I don't have to pack a bunch of extras there fore I don't always take a pack. When I'm "trad hunting" I like a bow, quiver full of arrows, tp, knife, and a stylus light.
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I hunt eastern whitetails and hogs 99% of the time. But I never go without binos.
Point in case for anyone that read my posts about hunting with Faith last year...a buddy and I were hunting and walked to a field edge (far edge was only 200 yards away). Deer were everywhere on the far side, but we couldn't make out any in the pine grove that fed that end of the field.
My buddy attempted the stalk through the pine grove. There were still more deer there that we hadn't been able to see with the naked eye. They picked him off at over 100 yards. My point is I was watching the whole thing through my binocs. He didn't have any and couldn't pick a route to make the stalk effectively.
I also feel that being able to monitor a deer that never makes it in range, helps me to more effectively hunt that deer later.
I can see not having binocs in a stand or blind, but on the ground, moving, tailoring my stand choice to what I find....I feel like they are imperative and well worth their weight.
Ken
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I mostly used mine to watch squirrels so when I downsized from a daypack to fannypack they were left out...........only use them now for gun hunting..........
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Have to admit to not carrying them while deer hunting close to home. Will also have to admit to carrying them 100% of the time hog hunting.
Smaller "profile" of a hog allows them to look a lot like a stump / downed tree. Been fooled a time or two and won't make that mistake again. They've proved handy to even tell which way a hog was laying in the palmettos when close.
Tend to favor a long "shoulder" strap type arrangement that allows them to hand by my side out of the way. Still hunting/ stalking up on hogs is fun of the highest order and chances don't come often.
As with most things....YMMV
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One of the joys of our sport is to enjoy all of the rest of natural activities going on while we wait. My binos get a workout checking out birds, small animals, whether or not those beech trees are carrying nuts, etc. And occasionally identifying movement in the trees that turns out to be what I'm hunting for.....
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Same as birdbow
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When I saw the title of your post, I was planning on paraphrasing the Asbell book and explaining how that helped me to slow down and see more (when I remember to use them). Then I read your post (and noticed who it was posting). So, all I can say is this: They're only helpful if you use 'em. You don't appear to have any problem filling the freezer without them, so I reckon they're just extra weight for ya, until you find yourself saying, "I wish I had my bino's."
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Practically speaking, I never NEED binocs for hunting in the East, especially from a blind or stand. But I've had a lot of fun looking at critters and birds at some distance on a slow day.
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I like them because even at 25 yards, in the closing minutes I can see MUCH better PLUS, I can see if it is a doe or a smaller racked buck, which is important if you don't want to bust your buck tag early. I take mine nearly every trip, but I don't always use them, then again, when I do, I am TOTALLY glad I had them.
Plus. . . hear weird noise near the truck, get high and use the bino's. I can see what is going on and they can't see me.
If I take a shot, I can check out the place that the deer was standing and even the arrow (heavy arrow stuck in ground !) without moving from my stand.
CHuckC
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Your logic for your situation, works. I hunted swamps in NC and used binos because I was nosey or curious. They just helped pass the time, looking at squirrels or woodpeckers
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You admit carrying them for a few weeks and not using them, so how many deer do you think saw you first? You did not mention the size, but in similar cover, I would opt for a 6x or 7x power with a wide field of view. I think if you walk little and look more, you will see deer color, movement, and antlers easier. I see more body parts, and movement than without binocs.
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My first answer was that the man seemed to have made the choice that satisfied his logic.
Not for me! I have top performing optics around my neck almost 100% of my hunting time, even when sitting over a bear bait. There's are a plethora of tiny movements happening in the woods, whether you are looking 15 or 1500 yards! This May I sat over a bear bait for a week, passing up everything that came in. But, the big one that was visible THIS YEAR because of last summer's forest fire came to 80-150 yards almost every night and gave me lots to look at through my binocs! That sucker kept all the little bait bandits away, but watching him grunt, huff, and bluff charge through my glasses was a real treat! Yes, he got to gorge himself later, after dark! But, I also got some great views of many Western Tanagers(one of Mother Nature' most beautiful birds)and some Stellar Jays while they were on the bait just a few yards away. I watched every one of them through the binocs, just like the birders do. If you study the birding websites, you will learn they look for enough clarity to define the structure of a feather at 15 yards or less. But, some bow hunters seem to feel they don't need optics until they can barely see the outline of a several hundred pound animal at whatever distance? Sorry, I'll leave the camera and a lot of other things I normally carry at home before I will leave out the binocs!
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Depends where I'm hunting. Out west, never leave home without them. Hunting close to home, I leave them home.
In New Jersey and CT...I prefer having them. They come in handy for scanning the surrounding area I want to still hunt through, great for watching bears as they walk by you (Jersey) and when tracking a wounded animal, always checking ahead just in case the animal is bedded and checking his back trail.
At my age...an extra set of more powerful eyes are great. I use the Steiner 8x30 Predator Night Hunter binos.
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I use them while blood trailing often. I have found more deer by spying a white tuft of hair through the brush than I can count.
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Thanks for all the comments guys. I may dig my binoculars back out for squirrel season and spend some time with them scouting.
Old_goat2, I like the looks and size of that monocular.
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While I have hunted most of my early life without them, I will have to say that my ability to spot deer early on when still hunting seems to have increased measurably since I started using them religiously about 20 years ago.
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Always carry mine. Had a friend hunting with me a few years back and he complained of not seeing any deer. I loaned him a set of binos and told him to dissect the cover around him....especially before changing positions or doing anything that required movement. Missed a doe that evening and killed a buck the next morning. Saw a total of 7 deer between the 2 hunts. It is thick enough where I hunt that you can have deer within 40 yards of you and never know they are there. I think he was moving too much and getting busted before the deer got close enough to see them. Mike
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I only bring them late season to see out as far as possible for deer movement when the deer have changed their patterns,,, my theory is deer will stay on the same run until spooked again so if I see deer moving then I know the next day I'll be right over there with my climber waiting..... other than that I don't feel I need them,,,,, personally I love suddenly catching site of a deer that I didn't have a heads up was coming.
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I don't go hunting without them, regardless of where or what I'm hunting. Been using good glass for a lot of years. They add immeasurably to the hunt. Have helped me find and retrieve a lot of critters.
Also agree with Kildeer, Birdbow and oldbowhunter.
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My advice? Take a scouting trip with them and make a point of using them incessantly for that one scouting trip. You will know pretty quickly whether you are missing anything without them or not...
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I'd leave my knife at home before my binos. I really like the Bushnell Custom Compacts -6X- they are small enough to not get in the way and I've been impressed with them glass-wise in comparison to more pricey binos. Had a guide in BC badmouthing American hunters for bringing cheap glass. He had high dollar Euro binos. I spotted a couple moose waaayyy off with them and he didn't say much after that.
Like Killdeer said, using the short focal length, and focusing through cover, to pick apart the "layers" of brush even at close range will let you determine if that movement you thought you saw was a bird or deer or a windblown weed. I can say truthfully that it has been a long long time since I killed a deer that I didn't look at through the glasses first. Especially does...I'd hate to roll one over and find out "she" is a button buck!
R
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Oh, and I carry mine under my right arm (I'm right handed) on a string that goes around my neck on the left shoulder side - like a handbag carry - and the string is long enough I can stick the binos in my right coat pocket. I would never wear them around my neck - I can't imagine a bowstring not getting hung up once in a while - even with the elastic strap keepers. Just my 2C
R
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One of the few things I cannot be without!
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wow I'm suprised at how many really depend on Binos for basic archery deer, I guess someone should of mentioned terrain too,,, I hunt really thick areas and swamps so wondering if the southern folks use these things where its very thick .
I have Steiner leica and swarovskis that I havent used in two years they seemed like extra baggage out there,, I can understand why guides or trophy hunters or people in big open areas use them though.
my 24.00 thermocell means more to me than my 1200 swarovski's ha ha ha the mosquitos here surely beat me down..
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They may not really help you get more game. However, they will help you to see/observe deer better and learn a lot. Mostly, I think they make hunting fun. When you see a deer and can't or don't want to shoot it, it is really fun to watch them (as well as other animals) with binoculars. Do you need them? Should you take them? Perhaps not, but they can make hunting more fun.
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I seldom use them when hunting my own place. However, I know terrain features, etc. like the back of my hand. They do become important elsewhere, though.
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I've got a good pair of Zeiss Compact and Steiner that I used to carry and depend on when hunting open terrain and I really have tried many times to use the compact Zeiss hunting with my recurves.
I hunt thick stuff and know they would help pick out game through the foliage, etc., but I always have my bow in my left hand..don't hang it because deer pop out on me close and can't hold the bino's steady with one hand.
I have rigged a way to hang my bow from my safety harness waist, but haven't perfected it to where I feel good with my left hand too far from the string.
I did buy a Vortex Monocular a wk ago, but not sure how well I can hold it steady with one hand...I'm not near as steady as I use to be in younger days.
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I take a minimalistic approach, I happily hunt w/o binocs...more stuff to carry, more movement using, something for my bowstring to get hung-up on, etc. It wouldn't change anything I do hunting from a tree in Wisconsin. I very much prefer the panoramic view my own eyes provide. Binos do not bring deer past your stand or make you scentless.
The scenario I dread is when the tree stand hunter is focused (distracted) on the doe & fawn at 100 yards with his binos and he doesn't see or sense the 10 pointer walking up behind him @ 14 yds... The binos come down, the buck sees the movement....game over! Hands go from binos to bow...scramble, panic, confusion, frustration!
A few times I might have wanted to look at bucks at a distance out of curiosity...but that's about it.
Out west elk and other hunting is completely different and I use them then!
Kris
ps - My 3 brothers and I have conservatively killed over 100 bow deer here in Wisconsin w/o ever using binos once. Anecdotal but you can shoot deer w/o binos. I don't use trail cams, scents or cover sprays either. Keep it simple & honest.
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All interesting comments on different aspects of bowhunting with binocs.. My vision is not like binocs ,but at 49 years old I've been blessed to hold onto my 20\\15 vision and my ears are still woods savvy. My tree stands are set in thick foliage with discrete shooting holes. My bow never hangs and my hand is always on the handle. I have been able to take many deer with just moments to assess and shoot. I hate the possibility of a "screw up "due to not being ready.
I should bring my binocs on stand just to experience it, maybe I would like it????
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They sure help to distinguish between the real bucks and the mesquite bucks.
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quote:
Originally posted by Tim:
I'm also with Dan on this.
I wouldn't think of hunting whitetails without them. Mine are setup with bino buddies so they don't move around. The straps also keep my clothes back out of the way of my bowstring. I don't scan the woods with them....too much movement but I will use them to verify size of deer, sex (button bucks)and shot placement. Clarifying where my arrow hit and studying the deers body language after the shot is huge and will help determine when to take up the trail. I also use them to study the deer before I approach them. With whitetails I take nothing for granted and verify everything.
I will also use them to scout alternative tree stand locations from the stand I'm in. Also, did you know that if you flip them upside down they can be used as a magnifier. :thumbsup:
But Rob, if you're not missing them, then you made the right choice....
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7 or 8 years ago I finally bit the bullet and bought a pair of Leica 8x32's. It was one of the best hunting investments I have ever made. I put them on a good harness deal and now I NEVER step foot in the woods without them. It doesnt matter if I am hunting, scouting, checking trail cameras etc. They are always on me. I know in a typical hunting season I use them a lot more than my bow! I've walked all the way to my treestand...climbed up and realized I forgot them in the truck, climbed back down and went all the way back to get them. I can't stand to be without them in the woods.
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I should also add, that cheap pairs of binos always spent more time sitting on the dash of my truck than on me. Always fogged up, poor light gathering etc. Get a good pair and you will use the heck out of them.
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I dont carry binos with me now but this year I will with the antler restrictions here in PA I dont want to shoot something I thought had three points to a side. Im no trophy hunter but sometimes its hard to tell with the naked eye if the buck is legal or not. Im looking at the vortex viper hd 6X32. Perfect for bowhunting in the Pennsylvania hardwoods and not heavy. I have 10X bushnells but there too bulky and too much power for bowhunting.
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I had one year that I kept busting deer right where I was planning to sit and I sat somewhere different everytime. so, I decided once to take a closer look before I charged in to set up. Wouldn't you just know there was a piece of a deer antler, then a whole deer. I would like to say that I got that deer, but it spooked anyway. My binos really came in handy at the BWCA on a canoe trip, there was a gorgeous young lady skinny dipping on an island. My buddy was too worried about our food supply and would not look or believe me. On our trip out, four days later, we got blown to shore at her campsite. They were out of coffee and offered a cigarette exchange. The lady was fully clothed that day, she had been married four times and owned four mansions in various fancy places. After our smoke and coffee we headed on our way, as soon as the wind died down. She thought that I was a rich song writer, even though I told her that I was not, and wanted to keep in touch. See what trouble good binos can get you into. Never leave home without them.
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They enhance my vision. I enjoy the magnification when looking at all things in the woods. Details. They are worth the weight.
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For me it's the "loose leaf" eliminator it seems no matter what kind of hunting I'm doing I have a loose leaf,branch, twig,etc. that is a ways off that I can't be sure about and moves with the slightest bit of wind once I glass it and eliminate it as a target animal I can forget about it and not waste time and energy trying to figure out if it's going to walk up on me before I'm ready.Personally I carry an 8 power monocular that fits in a shirt pocket.And I have worn glasses since the 5th grade so I don't have great eyes anyway.
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My bino's are very important for me in all types of hunting. Even in thick foliage they can really help pick out a deer or other animal if I've seen movement or a shape that shouldn't be there otherwise. I have 20/20 vision and am still a youngster, but I still find the enhanced vision a big plus for picking out animals a ways out.