New Guy with Carbon Problems

[Mitch Edwards]

Hello Everyone Im new here. Ive done alot of research here for a long time but until now I never really thought to join. Anyway like I said Ive been having some problems with carbon arrows. For the last few years Ive only shot wood (Doug Fir) and this year I decided to give carbons a shot. Ive switched bows and Im now shooting my Bear Super Kodiak 60# @ 28 Drawn to 28.5. Ive built up from low 50s and feel comfortable and 61-62# whatever I actually draw on the SK. Using the factory D-97 string I think its 14-16 strand and I have 2 sets of cat whiskers on it. 8.25" BH. I shoot split fingers. OK now that you all know the setup here is the problem. I bought a half dozen Gold tip 400 spine Blems from Big Jim. Ive got 100gr brass inserts in them and I had Jim cut them to 30". Ive tried point weight from 125-235gr and no matter what they seem to fly weak. Ive built out the strike plate with a piece of buck skin and still weak. Ive under drawn to about 26" still weak. So I thought well maybe its a false weak so I over drew to about 30" still shows weak. I should have said this is bare shafting. When I fletch them they fly pretty good with any point weight. The bare shafts impact with fletched arrows but the nock is way left. Someone please tell me if any of this points to one direction cause Im loosing my mind tuning every night with no progress. Ive got a carbon shaft test kit coming from 3 rivers and a 10 strand SBD string coming soon as well. I know the string will change the spine a little but Im not even close to satisfied with the flight I have now. Sorry for the long post but i wanted to give plenty of info.

[Mitch Edwards]

Forgot to mention I want to stay at 10gpp minimum so I would like the cure to meet that criteria. Thanks

[katman]

If your truly weak start cutting 1/8" at a time from the nock end. My guess is you will need 340 spine.

[Possum Head]

You ought to be close. Like katman said take one down real slow.

[creekwood]

What katman said.  Carbons will oftentimes show the correct stiffness quite suddenly when shortening the shaft.

[Mitch Edwards]

Thanks guys. I took the 3 bare shafts to work and took 1/4" off in the lathe and it didn't seem to effect them much maybe I should take another 1/8 and see what happens. Is there a good way to tell a true weak from a false weak?

[Orion]

I think you need .340s.

[ChuckC]

I do too, unless maybe you yank those 100 grain inserts and replace them with the aluminum ones that come with the shafts and try some more.  That kinda messed with your 10 gpp desire, but it might at least answer your questions.

[Stump73]

Welcome!

[elkhunter45]

I'm no expert on carbons as I have been a wood guy myself until recently. I shoot 400's cut 29" with standard inserts and 300 up front out of a dacron stringed 50# Kodiak Hunter drawn to 28" and braced at 8.5". I would say that you are considerably weak with your set up. As mentioned earlier I bet you end up with 340's especially with the SBD string. WELCOME to the Gang!

[Mitch Edwards]

Thanks for your input everyone and think you shed hunter and elkheart for the warm welcome. I had thought about going with 340s but I read some posts about how alot of people go "way over spined" on carbons. I guess this is what I get for not trusting my gut lol. Anyway that shaft test kit I ordered should be here any day so Ill start with a full length 340 and see how it goes. Ill report back soon as I test the theory. Thanks again

[Mitch Edwards]

Oops sorry elkhunter

[Friend]

How are you determining weak fight?

Shaft is likely far too weak per own experience based on information provided.

[Mitch Edwards]

Friend Ill shoot a bare shaft at a hay bale at probably 30 yards and watch the shaft. I dont pay that close of attention to the orientation of the shaft in the bale because arrows tend to follow a layer in the hay but in flight it seems to kick nock left really bad and also a bit nock high but thats a problem I always have. Last night I worked on the nock high problem and got it as good as i can with nock point set and 1/2" high. If Im all backwords on something please tell me. I just wanna get the best flying 10gpp+ arrow I can get. Not real picky on how i arrive there. Thanks again

[nhbuck1]

you most likely need a 340 spine

[Friend]

For me...The fletched BH tipped arrow mark match to the fletched field tipped arrow mark from 5 yards to at least 5 yards beyond my effective hunting range is the bottom line.

I only utilize quill cut bare shaft nock orientation at close range in order to rule out an initial badly misjudged arrow setup. Beyond that, I only focus on the actual quill cut bare shaft arrow impact vs. the fletched field point arrow impact mark. Will typically run bare shaft tuning at least to 35 yards. Strive for bare shaft mark to be center to slightly right and slightly low. Do know all of my BH's fly true when bare shaft tuned to 40 yards. Am certain others have similar results at shorter bare shaft tuned distances. Just has been a proven formula for me.

Often foregoe bare shaft tune and tune from field tips to broadheads.

[Mitch Edwards]

Friend, this seems odd to me because with woods I would get bare shafts flying pretty straight (slightly weak) before I fletched then I knew bhs would fly good but I can see carbons are a different ball game all together. I' haven't shot any broadhead with the 400s I have fletched but I will give it a shot. Thanks so much to all for your thoughts