BARESHAFT TUNING QUESTION

[Shawn Leonard]

Try this, take one that is 28"s and get 160-180 grains up front and shoot it fletrched up and watch the flight, if all ya see is a ball of feathers going at the targhet you will be right there.

[flatlander37]

I will try that in the next couple of days Shawn.  Thanks for your help.

[flatlander37]

OK.  I couldn't wait so I tried that before I head out to work today.  The best I could do was some 145 grain points, and I put them on all 3 fletched shafts.  Arrow flight was much better and they grouped in a 5 inch group just left of center at a little over 15 yards, which I think should mean they are a little overspined with these points.  If that is correct then I should still be underspined with the 200 grain points, correct?  If that is correct then I should probably start by cutting them from 28" to 27 1/2", right?  Please correct me if I'm wrong!

[SteveB]

From the CX website, the spine deflection of the 4560 Rebel Hunters is .397 - definately a heavier spine.
 http://www.carbonexpressarrows.com/pdf/hunting_cx_2007_arrow_guide.pdf

Steve

[twotimer]

i will jump in here now.at this point taking 1/2" off or down to 27 1/2 might be to big a jump.try 1/4 now.you seem to be close.and when you get close it don't take near as much length cut off to make drastic results,i know from just doing it myself.good luck and remember,you can take it off 1/16 or 1/8 at a time but its hard to get those little connecters glued back on.regards,robert  

[flatlander37]

I will cut them to 27 3/4" tomorrow, and try that.  I am trying to understand spine deflection, and how it matters to what is going on so that it makes sense to me.  Can anyone explain?

[SteveB]

The lower the number, the stiffer the shaft is.
Example: A .400 is stiffer then a .500 shaft.
cutting the shaft will make it stiffer.
Heavier points will lighten it.

Steve

[SL]

Sometimes when I bare shaft my release shows left because I peek or my relaese is not consistant. I would fletch a couple and try them with some broadheads.If they are over or under spined the broadheads will show it, compared to you're field points. Bare shafting is great if you have perfect form. I use it to get in the ball park then go to some big bladed BH's for the final tune. Compare the BH group to the FP group and it tells you the samething as bare shafting does without all the varibles.
SL

[BLACK WOLF]

Great advice SL.

Ray  

[Ray Johnson]

You are too stiff,bottom line.Cutting the shaft will only make it worse.To confirm this,if cutting the bareshafts does not help then you are going in the wrong direction.Point weight on carbon does not affect spine near as much as arrow length.This is my own experience.I've only shot carbons out of my recurve since I began 5 years ago and have been through every tuning problem imaginable.I always start out with a full length shaft and usually end up with a long(31"-32") arrow because of the low draw weights I shoot.If your only pulling 26",that will have a big impact on spine.I would try to the next lower spine down with a 175gr point.Just my opinion.If you already have the wrong spine,it's hard to make them work with carbons.I do have to share this though.I have a friend who has been shooting traditional about a year.He just bought some new shafts and they are obviously too stiff with bareshafting and paper tuning.I told him that his broadheads probably wouldn't fly well.I was wrong.I watched him hit a 3" spot several times with a 160gr Simmons Landshark and the arrow flew like a dart.I told him not to change a thing.If the broadheads fly true,that is the goal for most of us.I want a good bareshaft tune but stiff arrows will work for some with big fletching and a good release.

[Van/TX]

I cut down the carbons again this morning, and nothing has seemed to help. These things don't group consistently at all. I marked the arrows by number and the same ones group to the left and right no matter what I do, fletched and unfletched. Is it possible to get a bad batch of carbons?  

You are wasting your time trying to tune a set of arrows that are not matched to each other.  If you marked them like you said and they are grouping like you said then you answered your own question.  You got a bad set of shafts. It's impossible and wasted time to even begin to try and tune a set of arrows to a bow unless the arrows are consistent in spine and weight.  It can't be done......Van

[Ray Johnson]

They don't group because you are way too stiff.Some are bouncing off the riser,depending on your release.Try some full length shafts of the same spine you are shooting and I bet things improve.

[Van/TX]

Ray, if he numbered his shafts and the same ones are grouping together then his release is the same with each shot.  The arrows maybe too stiff or too weak.  Who knows.  But it's obvious that they are not matched to each other...Van

[Van/TX]

The 45/60's with 200 grain points @ 29" would be grossly underspined for his setup IMO...Van

[Tom A]

If you want to know if your under or over spined. Stand back and shoot a bare shaft at 30 or 40 yards if your arrow   point  goes left your over spined. Goes right under spined. Make sure you shoot at something with a soft backstop/frame or you will probably break an arrow.

[Ray Johnson]

Van,I'm certainly no expert but in my limited experience,the spine ratings on carbons are really not accurate.For instance,a Gold Tip 35/55 will be way overspined for bows up to probably 45lbs and even on a 45lb bow,the shaft would probably have to be full length with heavy point weight.I've only shot Black Widow recurves so I may not be the one to give anybody advice.I just know that it seems that everytime I tune a new shaft or bow,if I erred in spine,it was too stiff.I either cut too much off or began with too stiff spine in the first place.He is shooting 56#,so the shaft he has should work,but it's cut to 29" and I think he's only pulling 26" so the lack of powerstroke could be  why the arrows are acting stiff.I certainly could be wrong and it';s hard to tell without being there.I've seen a way stiff shaft hit to the right(false weak) but I've never seen a way weak shaft hit to the left.This is for a r/h person.I would try a full length 45/60 just for grins.I just don't see that shaft being too weak but like I said earlier,I could be wrong.

[Van/TX]

Ray, I'm certainly no expert with carbon either.  But in my limited experience with them they need to be much stiffer than my wood or aluminum spine to not shoot weak.  To tell you the truth I just can't shoot the dang things worth a durn.  I've tried.  Wish I could cause I sure break lots of wood and bend lots of aluminum     .....Van