Advice: Bow arm position and string slap.

[Longbow rookie]

Hey guys...I was hoping you could help me identify what it is I'm doing wrong.  I was out shooting yesterday and the string was consistently hitting the upper part of my forearm.

The part of my forearm that is even with my elbow  but obviously on the other side(muscle).  I noticed this was happening when my left arm(bow arm) was completely straight and my bow was only slightly canted.

Question:

1) Does my bow arm have to be completely locked(straight) to have consistent form?

2) How much should I cant the bow?  I know in a hunting situation this will change but I wondering about practice.  Is this personal preference?

3) I noticed that when my left arm is fully extended that the muscle jutts out and gets in the way of my string.  I think it's just the way my arm is shaped.  Almost looks like a double jointed effect.

4) I have shot in the past with a slightly bent elbow and have not had the string hit the bow arm.

5) Any advice would be greatly appreciated.  I hope this was not to confusing.  If so, I'll re-write.

Basically, I wrote a whole lot of words to say the "string is hitting my bow arm."  I'm using an arm guard and the string was hitting it pretty hard.

Any thoughts?  Thanks.

CJ

[dan ferguson]

Going by your handle I asume your talking longbow, might help to open your stance, unlock the elbow and might rotate it up, also the way your bowhand is positioned is important also, that elbow needs to act as a shock asorber, hope this helped

[Longbow rookie]

Thanks Dan.....yes - it definitely helps.  I'm shooting a longbow. 60" 45# @28.

So, when I rotate the elbow up my grip will turn clockwise.  Correct?  This will cause the bow to cant and create space between the string and my elbow?  Sound right?  I was experimenting as I read trying to picture the elbow rotating up.

So, I shouldn't get hung up on having my bow arm completely straight?

[BRITTMAN]

I got this tip fom a fellow tradganger , grip your bow as if picking up a suit case (from the side ) , hold the bow out in front of you like you would if you were going to shoot it , bring the bow back to your chest touching your fist to your chest while keeping the elbow pointed toward your target , now bring your bow back to the origanal shooting position . This put your elbow in the right position , not pointed down but pointed outward to the side . I hope I explained this well enoungh .

Mike

[dan ferguson]

Do you know what kind of grip the bow has, straight, dished, locator, etc. Send some pics of your grip then guys could help more.

[Longbow rookie]

Thanks guys...Mike I will try that today.

Dan....It's a Turkey Creek longbow. I'm embarassed to say I don't know the exact name of the grip.  Maybe someone who know T-Creeks can jump in.  But I will try and post a pic.

I'd like to set-up the camera soon and post a vid.  This way you guys can break things down for me.

Thanks again for your help.

[twig]

What you are experienceing is common to many that shot compounds or are overbowed. If, when you line up to shoot at a target, you look down at your feet and move your right foot forward 6 to7 inches this will open up your stance and you will never contact your arm again.
Try this... Stand with your bow arm out and positoned to shoot at an object. without drawing. Look at where the bowstring lies compared to your arm. I bet it is very close--isn't it? now without changing anything but moving your right foot forwand a little--look at the target and where your string is in relation to the elbow... Howard Hill called the resulting angle created between the arrow and the bow arm elbow the "magic angle" It gave Hill who was tall a shorter draw length and a better two eye perspective (depth vision) at what he was shooting at.

[dan ferguson]

No worries, when you pick up the bow, try to line up the major bones in your arm, should come together in the meaty part of your thumb, if you get to far in towards your palm your wrist will want to break and this will lead to severe string slap, Turkey creeks are good bows from what I hear. and it probably has a locator grip, also the big knuckle on your thumb should be lined up close to the center of the grip, Hard for me to explain and I hope this is not confusing to you, the grip is very important and it took me a long time to get it right. I shot a high wrist recurve for quite a few years and still have to work on this. just keep at it

[McDave]

twig stated: "Stand with your bow arm out and positoned to shoot at an object. without drawing. Look at where the bowstring lies compared to your arm. I bet it is very close--isn't it? now without changing anything but moving your right foot forwand a little--look at the target and where your string is in relation to the elbow... Howard Hill called the resulting angle created between the arrow and the bow arm elbow the "magic angle"

I'm trying to reconcile this with other posts on this forum about proper allignment, using Terry's clock as the model.  It would appear that the Terry's clock model would have your shoulders as square to the target as possible.  The open stance has your shoulders pointing to the left of the target, unless you rotate at the waist to square your shoulders with the target, in which case you might as well be standing square to the target, as far as your upper body is concerned.

How do we reconcile Hill's magic angle with Terry's clock?  Or are they two different stances entirely?  Or should the goal be to minimize the magic angle to the extent possible without getting string slap?

[twig]

McDave, I'm not familiar with Terrys Clock, but by putting your right foot forward(right handed shooter), you are rotating the hips and...shoulders toward the target, but not much,thus,creating a gap of three or four inches between the path of the string and the bow arm elbow. Hill also used a broken bow arm(not stiff)
Taht may be the same as Terrys Clock--I dont know.

[McDave]

Terry's clock:

 

[twig]

While Terry Clock and Hills style are similiar, Hill rotated the shoulder more and created a greater gap between the bow arm and the string. Try both and see which works for you. Bob Wesley taught me the Hill method and I have never had a problem with string slap.
One other minor point--check and make sure that your brace height is not too low and dont torque the bow with a death grip.

[Longbow rookie]

First I have to say thanks to both Mike and Dan because I read your replys, left work and went out to shoot.  What a difference!  I shot so much better today and the slap was gone.  The suitcase method really worked and lowering my elbow worked as well... thanks guys.  Big improvement but still a ways to go.  Obviously.

I just read all the other replies and they're great.  I'll re-read them and work on more tomorrow.  It was good to go out today and have some success.  I was getting a bit discouraged yesterday.

I really like the clock photo.  It clearly shows the proper alignment.  I will take that and the Hill and work both.

Can't say enough about this site.  I hope I can return the favor to you all someday.  With what I'm learning each day hopefully I'll be able to help people out at some point.

Appreciate all the help!  Am I correct in starting with "Masters of the Barebow 1&2" for my first DVD's?

CJ

[doeboy]

open up your stance, more like a boxer and "roll" your bow arm at the shoulder into the string.

[Longbow rookie]

Thanks...doeboy.  That makes sense!  I'll be working on all this stuff in about two hours.  Wish I could push this clock forward.

CJ

[jacobsladder]

longbow rookie...another thing to watch..your string may have stretched and your braceheight might be lower.... that will cause armslap too.

[Bowferd]

I agree with jacobsladder. I have 8 nice bows and the only one with slap problems is a Jay St. Charles L/B. I emailed Jay,requesting brace height and never rec;d an answer. So I took it from 6 1/2 to 7 1/2 and the problem seems to be eliminated. Thinking of going up to 8" or 8 1/4 but no answer from the factory after 30 days.Seems like some of the manufacturers don't care about the 2nd guy down the line. And just to put the record straight, I also emailed Ron L'Clair at Shrew bows about brace ht.on an older model about 30 days ago. Message has been read, no response.
Fred