? on gap shooting

[SBBOW]

Do you focus on the tip or the target? As you can tell i'm new at this.My buddy tells me to just focus on a spot and shoot but being a compound shooter for almost 30 yrs things are a little different. thanks for any and all help.

[tpanic41]

Both for me. Out to about 50 yards I reference the tip then focus on the spot. From 50 and out I use the tip as a sight. If its beyond 50 I figure where I need to hold and shoot point on my reference spot.
Good luck with the change, give it some time and you will love it!

[Tuttu]

I use the arrow as a sight.  The tip is my sight and I set the sight on the target.  I change my sight at different distances to accommodate for shorter/longer yardage.  For example, 20 yards my tip is on bottom of the belly, 30 yards, my tip is dead on target, and 40 yards my tip is on the back of deer.  I hope this helps.  Best of luck and try different things until you mold them to your style.

[McDave]

I shoot gap from about 30 yards out, and instinctive at closer distances.  In either case, my focus is on the spot I want to hit.  When I'm shooting gap, the arrow point is out of focus in my peripheral vision.

I think you could probably learn to shoot with your focus either on the arrow point or on the spot you want to hit, but if your focus shifts from one to the other, or someplace in between, it will ruin your accuracy.

[snakebit40]

Another option it string walking. I to was a compound shooter (but only for 15 years) I just recently switch to string walking because you always put the tip of the arrow on what you want to hit. To answer the focus question, you want to have both the target and the tip in focus. String walking has improved my shooting greatly. Just find what suits you best.

[Stumpkiller]

Originally posted by SBBOW:
Do you focus on the tip or the target? As you can tell i'm new at this.My buddy tells me to just focus on a spot and shoot but being a compound shooter for almost 30 yrs things are a little different. thanks for any and all help.

I focus on the target but am aware of the tip in my left-eye's vision.  This may be what Hill was getting at in the "split-vision" method he either attempted to discribe or cloud up in Hunting the Hard Way; I could never tell which.  If you focus on something 50 ft away and then lift your right hand at arm's length in front of the object, keeping the focus on that object, you still see the object with your left eye.  Now instead of the hole hand try one finger.  Now instead of one finger try the arrow tip.  

With my split finger grip I can put the arrow point on a deer's hoof at 40 yards and hit the heart.  At 50 yards the deer's knee.  At 65 yards where the arrow point appears "split-vision" is where it wil strike.  It's not perfect, but good enough to impress most true & only instinctive shooters.  At 80 yards I imagined two men standing on the target and aimed at that imaginart spot 12' above it and often enough hit the 3' target face.


BE WARNED - if you try and mix styles it will screw up your instinctive shooting.  When it comes close to hunting season I stick to instinctive 25 yards and under in my practice and stump shooting, and EVERY time out I shoot at least two blunts before the end of the day just to keep my eye calibrated.

[KarpKillaz]

I believe that practicing gap shooting makes you better at instinctive shooting.  This is the case because every instinctive shooter is using the gap method, but just using it subconsciously.

For example, if you practice gap shooting at set target distances, your gap acquisition gets extremely fast.  Your brain just starts putting the point down X inches on the target.  I honestly use both methods.  I switch back and forth between gap shooting and instinctive shooting at all distances, so that I can acquire sight pictures faster than consciously finding the correct gap at each distance.  Maybe switching back and forth messes some people's instinctive shooting up, but it has only served to improve mine.

Just to add to the discussion, I also print out a small gap table and tape it to the inside top limb of my bow.  I can then mentally range the target, glance at the table and get the exact gap I need at that range.  [If you know two distances in gap shooting, the point on & max gap, you can calculate the rest of the table using a parabola equation.]  

Since I have the gap table on the bow, I can then reverse the process to double check my 'instinctive shooting'.  First, I pick a target X yards out, then instinctively draw on it, look at the point in relation to the target and estimate the gap.  Then I double check my gap table without ever shooting an arrow.  Draw again, get the correct sight picture using the gap method, then let the bow down again.  For the actual shot, I will draw and release using 'instinctive shooting', now that my mind is fine tuned for the sight picture at that distance.  Done over and over, you automatically gap your shots without thinking about it.

[njloco]

"I believe that practicing gap shooting makes you better at instinctive shooting. This is the case because every instinctive shooter is using the gap method, but just using it subconsciously."

I hope I don't get hate mail, but I agree with KarpKillaz.

I have been shooting very well lately and I have been able to break down most movements and actions. I notice what Charlie Stumpkiller says as I am holding at full draw, I am seeing the tip of the arrow in my peripheral vision though not really paying attention to it. This only happens if I take the time to shoot and after drawing I hold at full draw and let everything settle down.

Hope this helps in some way.

P.S. Almost forgot, I am an instinctive shooter.

[Javi]

I focus on my target, of couse I see the point it's sticking out an inch and a half in front of the shelf but it is just a blurry object and I do not reference it in relation to anything. In fact I rarely notice if I'm shooting well and generally miss if I do look at it.

[Jim Wright]

The only "instictive" shot any of us get is our 1st one, after that we are learning and perfecting shooting form. When I began shooting I was initially conscious of the arrow and point in the shot picture (gap) along with the target. As I have shot more and more they have slipped into my sub-conscious during the act of shooting as I now see only the "spot" on the target I desire to hit at the point of release. The arrow has not become invisible and I am quite certain my eyes see it, my brain has simply come to depend on consistent form taking care of proper alignment of the arrow in relation to the target at release. I meet the description of an "instinctive" taditional archer as I understand it but to me there is nothing instinctive about it, it is a learned process and maintained and hopefully perfected by practice.

[Bowmania]

Think about this.  If you anchored like an olympic shooter - under you chin, you could definitly see the tip of the arrow.  As your anchor move up your face the less chance you have of seeing the tip.  So depending on the shape of your face and where you anchor you may be just seeing what you perceve to be the tip of the arrow.  That's good enough, you don't really look at it anyway.  You just see it under the target your focusing on.

Once you can shot a good group at 15 yards it's very easy to set the gap for 10 and 20 yards.  Without blind or blank bailing a newbie will not realize what a small part of the shot aiming is.  With BB you can separate form from aiming, but you can never separate aiming from form.

Bowmania

[zetabow]

Krpkillaz is correct, we're all doing pretty much doing the same thing just got to that point from different directions.


Once mastered Gap you can focus just on the spot, the gap isn't visual anymore it's more about 'Spatial Awareness' much the same as instinctive method, just that the visual learning process of gap helps many archers get to that higher aiming level faster\\easier than learing the instinctive path, none is better than the other it's just what you feel more comfy with.

Even Olympic archers shoot instinctively to a degree, they have to focus on the Gold and let the sight free float and the subconscious will decide when the shot is good, you would need to be superhuman to hold a sightpin rock steady on the Gold ay 90m.

[Bowmania]

"visual learning process of gap helps many archers get to that higher aiming level faster\\easier than learing the instinctive path".  I totally agree with the faster/easier, and I mean by years.  Which make the rest of your statement false - none is better than the other it's just what you feel more comfy with.

Bowmania

[zetabow]

Bowmania I mean once you get to that end result of good form\\aiming.

On an unmarked 3D course, two guys one Instinct and other Gap, if both are masters of their craft then it could go any way, just depends on who the gods are smiling on that day.

It's a different story on a marked field course as it's 4 arrows per target and the gap shooter can learn and fine tune his shot each time, where the instinctive shooter it's new\\unknown shot to him every time he draws the bow.