? about spine

[c_lantz]

I resently purchased a Fred Bear Super Kodiak 50 at 28", the arrows I purchased are cs heritage 150s. I took them to my local archery shop and we set it up and he recommended shooting it through paper. He said that the tear was indicative of the spine being to light. The arrow are cut to 30.5 inches and my draw is 26.5. Any recommendations or ideas would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Joey

[c_lantz]

Also, we had 125 grain tips on the arrows.

[c_lantz]

Would cutting the arrow down to 28" provide the extra spine I need. Also, does a paper tear on a traditional bow provide any real information on  the spine of an arrow?

[Richie Nell]

I suggest cutting the arrow about 1/2 inch at a time until the spine gets too stiff (overspined)or tears the paper to the right.  You have about 3 inches to work with.  Then add weight up front by using heavy broadheads and/or heavy adapters until the spine straightens out the arrow.  I wouldn't think about using any broadhead less than 150 grains.

[c_lantz]

Does a tear to the right look like the arrow hit more to the left. And a tear the the left look like the arrow hit to right?

[c_lantz]

Thanks for the response Richie Nell.

[Curtis Haden]

Hi Joey,

I'm a relative novice compared to a lot of folks here, but I can give you some observations I've had with a similar weight/spine issue using CX 150's.

If your bow is 50# @ 28" and your drawing 26.5" I would expect the CX 150's to be a little stiff, even cut 30.5" with a 125g point.  I'm shooting a 52# @ 28" Griffin longbow (pronounced r/d design - not quite cut to center), and drawing the full 28" I can get good flight from a 30" CX 150 with 200 grains up front.  I shoot up to 250 grain point/insert combinations with a 29.5" arrow.

Now I'm assuming your Super Kodiak riser is cut to center, which will let you shoot a little stiffer arrow than I can with my longbow, BUT, if you're only drawing 26.5" then you're actually only pulling about 46# to 47#(?) with a 50# @ 28" bow.

I CAN tell you from experience, that a poor release and/or shelf/quill contact can give you a false reading when bare shaft testing.  I don't know much of anything about paper tuning, but it seems to me that both methods would be susceptible to the same types of errors.

As I stated from the beginning, I'm no expert, but I hope my observations can save some time and arrow woes.  Getting good flight from a well-tuned bow/arrow combination has been quite a journey for me, but I found after much trial and error that my shooting was to blame for some early headaches I suffered through.

Good luck!
Curtis

[Shawn Leonard]

Chris the 150s are way stiff, ya cannot shoot through paper and get an accurate result unless you have the cleanest release in the world. I shoot the 150s out of a 54# RER Arroyo a very high performance recurve and mine are cut to 29.5"s and I have a 50 grain brass insert installed and a 125 grain head for 175 grains of point weight. If ya only draw 26.5"s that means the bow is about 45#s at your draw or a tad more. I would leave them long and shoot at least 275 grains of point weight, but you would be better off getting new arrows like the new CX 90's that Sipsey sells, check out the sponsored classified. The 150's are really too stiff for that bow, no doubt about it. Even if ya drew it to 28"s thye would still need a lot of weight up front for good flight. Shawn

[c_lantz]

Well now I'm confused my pro shop is telling me they arnt stiff enough, carbon express says they are perfect, and you guys are saying they are too stiff. We switched to a stiffer arrow last night and the tear switched to a right tear?

[c_lantz]

Why are traditional bow harder to get the correct spine than a compound bow. I have never had this problem before. I guess I should have stated in my first post that I am a novice to traditional equipment.

[Apex Predator]

I'm with Shawn.  I have shot virtually the same bow setup with those arrows.  Mine had to be 31" long with 250 grains up front.  You need to bare shaft tune.  Those wheelie pro shops don't know traditional equipment, and neither do the arrow manufacturers.

[c_lantz]

So you would recommend for EX: leaving the arrows the same length and getting 100grain points and 125 grain points or broadheads.

[c_lantz]

*100 grain inserts and 125 grain points

[Orion]

It's more difficult to match arrow spine to trad bows because most aren't cut past center like compounds.  You can shoot almost anything through a cut past center compound as long as it's overspined.  Most trad bows aren't shot off of elevated rests as compounds are, the latter providing better arrow clearance by the riser.  And finally, you're using your fingers rather than a trigger to release the string, making for a much less clean and in-line release.  There are additional reasons, but those are the big three.

[Shawn Leonard]

Y aneed more point weight than the 225. The problem is traditional guys spine their arrow based on 13" centers and compound guys based on 14" center, so when ya look at a modern spine chart and it says 45-50# bows, that is for compound guys the actual spine for Trad shooters is more like 65-75#s. Shawn