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Author Topic: advice on a 59  (Read 928 times)

Offline Abear

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advice on a 59
« on: July 29, 2009, 03:22:00 PM »
Well most of you seen the 59 56" that was on the sight that was listed for 17# later she said it looked like 77# so I thought wow! my kind of bow. well i openened it up and knew i was in trouble .to lite of limbs and a 14 strand string... later inspection reveled it was ,I Think, 47# ,I just sold my shorty at denton , so i would still like a representative of the 56" so my delema ,, should i make an offer ? its dirty but looks in good shape so what do you think i should do? price? please give me an idea i dont want her to think i am taking advantage of her Thanks Chris
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Offline Abear

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2009, 03:25:00 PM »
I paid what i thought was a good price on what i thought was a 77# bow so .....  :knothead:  i feel a little dumb
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Offline Wade Phillips

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #2 on: July 29, 2009, 03:50:00 PM »
Chris my friend... sorry to hear about the mis-hap...

Don't mean to preach, but I tried to tell everyone that it was 47# not 77#... it seemed that some "knew" more...

I was willing to bet, but there were no takers... Ask Trap about my betting record...

I've seen lots of 1959 Kodiaks and many have the numbers partially gone or so faint it is hard to make them out. I've gone over those number hundreds of times trying to make them out.

Why not check with the #2 bidder to see if he wants it?

The bow will likely have to be refinished to be presentable, so start figuring from the price of a refinished 56" 1959 and go from there.
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Offline TRAP

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #3 on: July 29, 2009, 04:02:00 PM »
I'd take a refund and let the seller resell the bow with proper information.

You could always buy it again at a lower price, but the seller wouldnt feel like he/she was being taken advantage of.  

It may be difficult to explain to someone that doesnt follow the vintage bow market, why a "77"# bow just brought double what you are probably going to offer for a 47#er.

My .02  

Trap
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Offline Novaln1975

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #4 on: July 29, 2009, 04:08:00 PM »
That’s too bad.

If it’s any consolation, I would have guessed it was 77# also. The added pics of the script gave the impression it could have been 77# too with that light horizontal line at the top. Now that I look at the pics again, the riser does look kind of skinny for a 77#.

Although the seller obviously did not want to rip anyone off, I would ask if it could be discounted since the ad was kind of misleading to some extent.

Don’t be too hard on yourself and find a way to enjoy the new bow for what it is. With time, it will eventually be worth what you payed for. I remember just a few years ago, bow prices were sky high.

My 2 cents

Simon
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Offline Hoof

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #5 on: July 29, 2009, 05:51:00 PM »
It's an honest mistake by all... there was no deception by anyone... It was all opinions and I too thought the pictures I seen looked "77". From my converstions with the person selling the bow the lady seemed a very honest person. I'm sure it will work out in the end, obviously you too thought it was "77" or your bid wouldnt have made it up that high. I dont see how the ad was misleading the first thing she stated was she didnt know nothing about bows?One thing forsure it wasnt #17 so IMHO is was just a chance eitherway? Honest mistake by all I think...
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Offline Abear

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #6 on: July 29, 2009, 05:55:00 PM »
I will talk to her , it says refund given so,,,think i might get lucky
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Offline Hoof

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #7 on: July 29, 2009, 06:02:00 PM »
And as for betting with Wade... I havent been around here long...but I respect his opinion, value his input and enjoy reading his threads... That there is why there was not bet  ;)  Good point about the string that told more of the story...
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Offline Wade Phillips

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #8 on: July 29, 2009, 07:18:00 PM »
Chris - Trap has the best idea. Ask for a refund and let her sell the bow using an accurate description of 47#.

I'm sure you have inspected the bow pretty well by now. If you have strung it you know if it is straight or not. You can help her and everyone out by telling her the actual condition of the bow and if it is really shootable or not.

If you would rather have a LH 46", I have one that I would part with.

Hopefully, those who thought it was 77#, have learned something about obscure serial numbers on 1959 Kodiaks.

Hoof - On July 23, 2009 08:44 PM, when I posted on...
    http://tradgang.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=14;t=002833    

"It reads 47# @26", look again."

It was not an opinion, it was the experience of having owned, bought, sold, and traded dozens of 1959 Kodiaks and examined their serial numbers over the past half of a century, (only about half of the Kodiaks below are 59s, the others are 60s).

I try to deal in facts, but occasionally get involved in speculation e.g., experimental bows. If I don't know something, I try to seek the best advice possible. Then, I go to the original source documents of the era to confirm that advise. Trust me, I'm smart enough to know better than to bet with Chris about anything he states as fact about the serial numbers on Bear Take Downs.

   
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Offline Migra Bill

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #9 on: July 29, 2009, 08:31:00 PM »
I too said it was a 47. Keep in mind she didn't say it was 77. She said it was 17!!! SO you cant really tell her you paid a premium price for a bow that was 77 and you want a refund because it is only 47 when she advertised it as 17.
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Offline Hoof

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #10 on: July 29, 2009, 08:58:00 PM »
It reads 47# @26", look again.

77# @ 26" Kodiak is possible.

100# @ 27" Kodiak is on the wall here.

Wade I reread your post and yes you were trying to point out something you seen that others didnt.
  You also stated it was possible, so that could be construed as some doubt also...But I guess you were being repectful knowing our limited exposure to bows of this catagory. As for the #100 would you mine sharing pics and closeup of the limbs to show the diferences? I'm all eyes and ears to learn more about the history of these ole Bear Bows... thank you again for your insight.
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Offline jcar315

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #11 on: July 29, 2009, 09:00:00 PM »
I too am always all eyes and ears when Wade is sharing knowledge so I agree with Hoof on that. Looked like a 47 to me though when it came up on here. **** can be a crap shoot like that. I don't have any advice on what to do except to follow what your gut says would be the right thing to do for both you and the seller.
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Offline Wade Phillips

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #12 on: July 29, 2009, 10:36:00 PM »
When I posted the sentences...

It reads 47# @26", look again.

77# @ 26" Kodiak is possible.

100# @ 27" Kodiak is on the wall here.

For clarity, I should have been more precise in my intended meaning in the last two sentences and said...

Yes, it is possible to have a Kodiak marked 77# @ 26".

I have a Kodiak marked 100# @ 27".

Please re-read the last sentence of the person who posted the question...

"What are the chances of a 77#@26" bow?"

My sentence...

"77# @ 26" Kodiak is possible."

This is a direct answer to that question, simply because it is possible... that a Kodiak could be marked 77# @ 26".

No way did I ever intend to imply that the bow in the auction may have been marked 77#. It was obviously marked 47#, I knew it, why else would I offer to bet a 56" Kodiak? ... and there were no takers, not even for a soda... Anyone who knows me, knows that I never bet unless it is a sure thing.

If I gave anyone the impression that I thought it might be marked 77#, I sincerely and truly apologize for my poor communication skills, limited vocabulary, tendency to reuse words, and very poor choice of words.

In the future, I will attempt to be much more precise.

Hoof - For the comparison you requested, this is as close as I could get to the weights in 1959 Kodiaks, 47# and 77#, These are 48# and 80# in  64" length, which will give you a size difference comparison but remember, 56" bows will of course have much thinner laminations. Also the 100# @ 27" marking is on a 68" 1954 Kodiak (II). It has the thickest limbs of any Kodiak that I have documented, although it is possible that some of the heavier 64" Kodiaks have thicker limbs.

   


80# at top, 48# at bottom...
   
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Offline Wade Phillips

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #13 on: July 29, 2009, 10:45:00 PM »
With two samples of a "7" and one intact sample of a "4", it seemed very easy to figure this one out just by using the gold lettering that was still visible on the bow. As was stated..

It reads 47# @26", look again.

If it is not obvious, there are handwriting analysis courses.  http://www.handwriting.org/main/hwaschls.html

 
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"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

"Everybody is ignorant, only on different subjects." - Will Rogers

Offline seboomook

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #14 on: July 29, 2009, 11:39:00 PM »
Wade,
You have the eye of a museum curator.
Thanks for sharing how to look for the details in all these collectable items. It's raised the bar for all, and is the perfect example of "paying it forward"
Whatever the outcome of Abear's purchase, it's a
learning experience.
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Offline Hoof

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #15 on: July 30, 2009, 04:57:00 AM »
Absolutely awesome Wade thanks for taking the time to post, and for allowing me the oppourtunity to learn by sharing your experiences and knowledge. I'm good for a soda or the beverage of your choice if I ever have the good fortune to meet you one day. I dont get up to Nebraska much but maybe one day if I ever do run into you I will make good on it. Thanks Hoof
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Offline 4runr

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #16 on: July 30, 2009, 06:33:00 AM »
Hoof,
I'll buy Wade a beer at Comptons next year for you. How's that?
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Offline jcar315

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #17 on: July 30, 2009, 07:17:00 AM »
Thanks Wade!!! Super pics but even better knowledge.
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Proud Dad to two awesome Kids and a very passionate pig hunter.

Right handed but left eye dominant.

Proud to be a Native TEXAN!!!!!

"TGMM  Family of the Bow"

Offline Abear

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #18 on: July 30, 2009, 10:25:00 AM »
Bow is on its way back thanks guys, Wade i was at denton  hill all week and had to make a decision before i left didnt get a chance to read your post, I was hopeinng... anyway all is good and Wade thank you so much for the compliment it means a lot, take care everyone Chris
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Offline Hoof

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Re: advice on a 59
« Reply #19 on: July 30, 2009, 07:51:00 PM »
Thanks Kenny make sure it good and cold!  :)  

Chris it all worked out well then? Great... In your opinion was it a shootable bow?What were it's biggest flaws? Did it string up okay?
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