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Author Topic: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?  (Read 2076 times)

Offline John3

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New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« on: February 22, 2007, 10:17:00 PM »
Has anyone seen this?  Should I worry about going this July?

John III

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Offline S Meyer

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Re: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2007, 07:09:00 AM »
It’s difficult to say. I am, but for other reasons. It is an issue of politics just as much, if not more than actual conservation. I would be less worried if it wasn’t Kortbroek who made the announcement. I don’t think this is the last we’ll hear of this but that is only my opinion. We can’t do much but wait and see. Some of the new regulations, like not hunting from vehicles are not all that severe as many hunters look down on this practice anyway. What worries me is this second stage they speak of.

I am sure that everyone here has a grim view of canned hunting and would never take part in such a venture. All in all I don’t think that hunters who are hold themselves to an ethical code would be affected too severely. Hunters who want to hunt the big five with a bow might not like these new regulations though. I read an article some time ago which stated that the hunting industry was worth between 100 million and a billion SA rand a year. If money talks, money of that kind will have a fairly large voice.    

Stefan

Offline katman

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Re: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« Reply #2 on: February 24, 2007, 08:43:00 AM »
I agree that the current change, if I understand it, doesn't have a broad sweeping effect on bow hunting all game in RSA, just the few listed. However I fear this may the tip of the iceberg, with economics on our side maybe this won't go to far. Hopefully they (the majority) are just trying to clean it up.
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Offline justin snyder

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Re: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2007, 12:28:00 AM »
I hate to see this anywere.  It just goes to show you that we as hunters need to not ignore, but turn in people who are participating in activities like canned hunts or drugging animals.  If we dont throw them under the bus, we will be thrown under the bus with them, guilty by association.  Justin

Offline Neil Summers

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Re: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2007, 12:31:00 PM »
Here is a response to the new laws from Stewart Dorrington from South Africa. Stewart is a bowhunting outfitter ( MELORANI ) and is also the president of PHASA ( Professional Hunters Association of South Africa) He was also appointed to the advisory board for the new changes and was on that comittee working with government for tha last two years.

"  Nearly all hunting in South Africa takes place on private land. Over the past 30 years, the game industry grew at such a pace that the old Nature Conservation Ordinances that governed our fauna and flora soon found themselves outdated. The game ranchers and reserves also found them an impediment to the growth of the industry. The national government decided it was time for an overhaul of all the old legislation and that it needed to regulate the hunting industry more than in the past. In addition there were certain practices which needed to be addressed, such as the shooting of canned lions, unethical put and take practices and the need to address empowerment within the industry to make it more representative and beneficial to a broader spectrum of the population, especially rural communities.
 

Early in 2005, the Minister of the Department of Environmental Affairs and Tourism appointed a “panel of experts” to make recommendations to him as to what measures needed to be taken to protect the integrity of the hunting industry, which was continuing to receive widespread negative press, especially with regard to canned lions. Political issues were also arising out of white operators hunting in areas adjacent to national parks where the adjacent communities view the animals as belonging to the park, which was a state asset. The communities felt that they too should be benefiting from these animals and the hunting or alternatively nobody should be allowed to hunt them! The mandate to the panel was to make recommendations to the minister that would protect the integrity of the hunting industry, something the government was not able to do considering many of the unacceptable practices evolving in the industry.

 

By late 2005 the recommendations of the panel were put into draft form and presented to the public and industry for comment. For more than a year the drafts have been commented on, debated, criticized, praised and condemned.

 

Finally the new legislation has just been released and will soon be common knowledge amongst outfitters and game ranchers in the country.

 

The main issue of public interest is that of the lions. Canned lion shooting will now be stopped. A lion will have to be free ranging for 2 years before it may be hunted. This time frame makes it uneconomical for lion breeders to continue to breed lions. The banning of shooting captive bred lions has been widely welcomed, including by all the recognized hunting associations in South Africa. The consequences of this ban will, however, demonstrate what will happen to a species if its monetary value is taken away. The lion breeders are threatening to euthenase 5000 lions, a very real probability as they now have no value and are just costing money to keep. It is sad, but this situation should never have been allowed to grow to this extent in the first place. Let this also be a warning to the anti-hunting lobby as to what will happen to species in private hands if they are not allowed to be hunted.

 

Bow hunting, which many thought was going to be banned, will continue to operate at the discretion of the provincial authorities but the hunting of elephants, rhino, crocodiles and large predators will be illegal. The Panel of Experts wanted bow hunting banned as it was regarded as inhumane. Contrary to Pat Lefimine accusations, I was the only one on the Panel who fought to have it kept legal and managed to keep the staus quo in the recommendations finally put forward to the minister

At the Wildlife Forum meetings (government, hunter and wildlife ranchers) the message again came to us that the Minister wanted the Forum to agree to ban bowhunting.

At the beginning of the consultation process with government, I realised that the industry needed top legal advice otherwise the government could manipulate the negotiation processes to get what they wanted. I started the PHASA legal fund and asked the industry to contribute to this fund. Dallas Safari Club contributed $10000 and some of the stalwarts of the PH industry contibuted enough to employ an acting judge, Adv Matthee SC whose speciality is constitutional affairs of the country, to guide us through the negotiation processes. It was this action that saved all bowhunting in that the government was challenged as to what criteria and principles its decisions were made upon. They had no answers and later PHASA was charged with drawing up the principles for the establishment of the norms and standards. Adv Matthee and myself collated input from ALL sectors of the hunting fraternity, local hunters, wingshooters, game ranchers and professional hunters and presented the government with these guidelines.

The relationship with government and the industry was one of confrontation and distrust, until PHASA brought our legal counsel to the party. This put all parties in line and from that moment on, the industry has achieved what 6 months ago, everybody thought was impossible.There is now a good relationship bewteen the department and the industry and there is now ongoing consultation bewteen us at the highest levels.

So what has bow hunting lost now. The shooting of elephant and rhino has always been illegal in SA. The Minister used his discretion and added lion and leopard to the list. Most lions hunted in SA have been captive bred or canned. Only about a dozen hunted lions a year are genuinely free roaming. Many hunters have shot captive bred lions believing them to be free ranging. In my opinion we have lost hunting leopard with bow. This is a loss we did not expect and one we all lament but what we do now have is an an ongoing cosultative process with government and with time, we may be able to bring about amendments to the legislation.

 

What most people underestimate is the real threat that ALL hunting faced in South Africa. It is owned and practiced by a few wealthy whites for the pleasure of a predominantly wealthy foreign clientele. Black people in South Africa have no love for game reserves and hunting and the majority of urbanites would aslo welcome a ban on hunting. Economics alone will not save the industry, it must be socially sustainable too....a point that seems to slip past many hunters. The only reason canned lions have been banned is that it is not socially sustainable. If we are going to continue to promote socially unacceptable practices, you are inviting the end of hunting sooner rather that later.

 

Shooting from the back of an open vehicle has been banned. Most countries have this is legislation in Southern Africa but the question will remain as to how to enforce it. It does allow for shooting from a vehicle if handicapped or following wounded game. It does not specify what constitutes a handicap, nor how far one has to be from a vehicle, nor how long since the viicle passes. This is not a unique situation. It is however, impossible to enforce.

 

On the good side

 

There are also now requirements on outfitters and professional hunters to belong to hunting associations, which in turn will have channels of communication to the relevant authorities. The reason for this is that many outfitters do not belong to any association and contribute nothing to the industry nor do they bind themselves to any ethical codes of conduct. For example canned shooting of lions has not been illegal but organizations like PHASA (Professional Hunters Association of South Africa) has had a strict policy against any of its members participating in such an activity. In addition this process helps centralize data and service delivery that all interested parties can collect more relevant information on the scope and nature of the industry.

 

Service delivery will be much improved. Landowners will be able to continue to issue hunting permits if they have exemption on their farms in terms of the provincial legislation. For threatened and protected species, farmers can apply to the national department for a standing permit so that they can manage their game on their properties. Game dealers can also now register with the department and issue permits for the movement of most game species. A pre-requisite to all this is that they submit this information to the authorities for statistical purposes.All this was virtually impossible beforehand and permitting was a continual headache for the industry.

 

With the new legislation coming into effect on the 1st June 2007, the government will be in a better position to defend hunting in South Africa. Economic value alone is not enough to defend a minority activity and the legislation goes a long way to making hunting more acceptable to the public as well as attempting to get a broader spectrum of the population to benefit from hunting. Whatever the feeling out there, the long wait of uncertainty is over, the lines have been drawn and we can get on again with our ranching and hunting.

 

We are now going into the second phase of consultation with government on the Alien Invasive Species Act and the Translocation Act. These two sets of legislation hold far more threat to game ranching than the hunting regulations, however I am confident that common sense will prevail and that we will overcome these too.

 

If you are planning a safari in South Africa it is advisable that you book with a PHASA member. PHASA is the largest professional hunting association in the world and is the mouthpiece for the professional hunting industry in South Africa. Besides having a constitution that emphasizes professionalism and fair chase, it also has a strict disciplinary process in place to address complaints quickly and fairly.  PHASA has also established its “Conservation and Empowerment Fund” to invest in worthwhile conservation projects and to address Black Economic Empowerment within the industry…a crucial issue if we want to keep hunting alive in South Africa. Every hunter is encouraged to give $10 per trophy taken to this fund as it is used to defend and promote the hunting and conservation industry in South Africa, like the costs of engaging and lobbying government too."

Offline Joseph

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Re: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« Reply #5 on: March 05, 2007, 09:08:00 PM »
That makes a lot more sense than some of the almost hysterical reactions that I have read on the net.  Also another reason to not put off doing things you want.  There are no guarentees in life folks.  Joseph
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Offline doctorbrady

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Re: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2007, 09:26:00 AM »
Neil,
Thanks for the post.  It is good to get factual information rather than just hysteria.  
Folks, this shows just how important it is to practice good hunting ethics and support organizations that lobby for your hunting rights.
It will be a great loss if our children or grandchildren do not have the same opportunities to hunt Africa that we now  have.  Worse yet, a similar thing can (and probably will) happen in this country if we are not diligent.
It is a shame that bowhunting leopards was lost in South Africa, nor does it exist in Namibia.  I am hopeful that over time we, as bowhunters, can once again change the minds of the people and get this reinstated.  
This is a critical time, and we have the opportunity to be pioneers to bowhunting in Africa.  It took a few good folks to get bowhunting legalized in Africa.  It will take many more to keep it so.

Offline nine

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Re: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2007, 01:55:00 PM »
...................this shows just how important it is to practice good hunting ethics and support organizations that lobby for your hunting rights.
It will be a great loss if our children or grandchildren do not have the same opportunities to hunt Africa   :confused:    :confused:  
.....................................................
I start hunting as a kid at age 12, when received my first rifle. 45 years later I’m still in love with hunting witch is one of the main parts of my life. This pleasure is to day more important  as I left rifle 18 years ago when I bought my first bow. I shoot everyday I travel any time possible to meet news games new countries and so new pleasures and new friends

I went in South Africa,  visited some ‘’hunting territories’’ and left my bow in my hotel.
There is not hunting, only  masquerade, hunting parody,  organized so that ' the carrier of weapon '' I cant say hunter,  imagines he’s the big white hunter .And more he pays harder he  trust…..

USA gives you plenty opportunities to hunt in fair conditions. If you dream of Africa there are some countries where you can find real game, born there, not arrived by Truck .
Tanzania, Botswana, Gambia, Gabon, Burkina Fasso , are still real places for real hunters and you would never see fences there.

I hope for my children and grand children they can hunt Africa, but I will never confuse real chase and canned hunt, South Africa and Africa.
Let me add that I’m not aggressive, only sad; because I know South Africa (and Namibia) such countries should be banished.
Real hunters deserve real hunt.  :thumbsup:  

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Offline Terry Green

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Re: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« Reply #8 on: June 04, 2007, 06:48:00 PM »
Easy guys.
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Offline doctorbrady

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Re: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« Reply #9 on: June 05, 2007, 08:14:00 AM »
Holding tongue.... :)   :)   :)

Offline artistryinnature

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Re: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« Reply #10 on: June 05, 2007, 10:04:00 AM »
Let me just say this: There is fair chase hunting in South Africa, you just have to have the right outfitter. Last year I hunted a macadamia orchard in the Soutpansberg Mountains, no fences. We also hunted outside the border fence (but still inside the border) along the Limpopo River across from Botswana. We saw wild elephants and tons of game (much of which escaped into Botswana). So, while most hunting in S.A. is fenced there is still some wild game hunting to be had.
Mickey Wright

Offline tradtusker

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Re: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« Reply #11 on: June 09, 2007, 02:14:00 AM »
i was born in south africa and lived there for 13years, im still young so recent changes in laws and hunting regulations are important to me as well as many other young hunters today as they will effect what we can do in the future.

for those that are from africa and those that have hunted there, you will know what an amazing place it is, i can't put into words what effect the place has on you, everything from the amazing deep orange sunsets fallng through the acacia trees, the new world of sounds that come alive at night to the thrill of stalking amoungst herds of wildebeast, zebra and other beasts...

the family cattle farm was converted to a game farm 8 years ago, the property was fenced and is 3500 hectares, iv hunted game on that place that i believe was as challanging as if i had hunted them on a property 30,000 hectares is size.

i agree with Stefan that cleaning up the canned hunts and hunting from vehicles etc is a good thing and will not effect the ethical hunters, im sad that bowhunting for some of the bigger species are now beeing banned, as i feel with the right equipment they can be harvested cleanly! if i did not belive this was the case i would not choose the bow and arrows as a hunting weapon.

i appritiate that everyone has there own opinions and that is a good thing as with an open mind everyone stands to gain from looking at things from a diffirent point of view,

i hope that we will be free to bowhunt South Africa and the rest of the world for that matter in the future and i will do my best to help in every way i can! and knowing the good people her on tradgang im sure there are many that are doing the same.
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Andy Ivy

Offline tradtusker

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Re: New South Africa regulations. Should we worry?
« Reply #12 on: June 09, 2007, 02:25:00 AM »
sorry John
if you are planing on goin out to hunt plains game, i would not worrie for a second.
 please Do Not miss the opertunity to get out there and hunt you will never regret it!
best of luck
Andy
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Andy Ivy

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