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Author Topic: The disposable mindset and it's effects  (Read 2062 times)

Offline vermonster13

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The disposable mindset and it's effects
« on: March 20, 2007, 07:15:00 AM »
Disposable has become a way of life in America and until we have a fundamental change in the way we think as a society the decay will continue. There isn't very much in America that isn't considered disposable and unfortunately this way of thinking has even creeped over into how land is managed.

How many empty, run down properties do you see where you live? Factories, storefronts, houses etc. Until we change things to make it cheaper to reclaim property than it is to build new, this will continue. It eats away at the wild places everyday. I know most of us would like a place in the country with some land and this has given birth to the suburbs of so many cities.

One or two folks buy some property outside of town for less than what a single home in town would cost then over time the value of their property increases and they start dividing it into smaller parcels so others can get out of town and they make a little money. In a few decades what was once wild is now just the sprawl of the town the first were looking to escape.

As family farms decline this only becomes worse.

How many cars and trucks go into the salvage yards each year that with a little effort could have been on the road still? TVs, vcrs, stereos, computers, etc? All cheaper to buy new than to repair, or obsolesence is built into them.

The American way needs some updating folks. What are your thoughts?
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Offline Jaz

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2007, 01:13:00 PM »
Couldn't agree more!

Online Al Dente

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2007, 04:30:00 PM »
I realized this years ago.  When I was a teenager and went to the auto parts store to get something or another for my first car, a 1968 Mercury Cougar.  I walked out of the store with a bag of plastic junk.  A short while later I was speaking with a machanic who befriended me, and he laid it out plain and simple.  If parts are made to last, then the company doesn't make what it can!!!  

Fast Forward to 3 years ago.  During a winter storm one night, a driver came way too close to my Explorer and broke my driver's side mirror.  I called the dealership to order me a new mirror glass.  They refused, and would only order a full mirror kit, which included the mirror glass and plastic housing.  All to the tune of $350, just for the kit.  I went to a local auto glass business, and within minutes, I had a new mirror in place for $30!!!!!

I love taking old furniture, stripping it down, refinishing it, maybe altering it and using it again.  Why should I pay some fancy catalog company for a piece of new "antiqued", "weathered", or "broken in" furniture?

It's too fast a way of living, and it will catch up to us eventually.  Core values, ethics, and the familial unit are all but gone these days.
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Offline wapiti

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2007, 05:11:00 PM »
I agree 100%. Being in construction I see a vast amount of wasted goods all the time. I am big into using recycled goods and recycle as much as I can. Example, just built a screen door for my entrance instedad of buying one. Built it out of old growth clear heart redwood I salvaged from a remodel job several years back. It was redwoood paneling in a basement and my boss wanted me to take it to the dump. I refused and loaded it and took it home. What can't be used I make into kindling to start the fire that heats my house!.

   My wife thougght I was goofy at first but she sees the light now. You don't always need new stuff to be "new". Ex wife is still bring out the cash and then the trash mind set. Unfortunately some will NEVER learn.
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Offline JStark

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2007, 09:17:00 PM »
The sprawl problem you talk about Vermonster is right on.  Now so many folks want a place out of town, but they want to bring all the stuff from the city out with them.  So little towns get Starbucks and movie houses and chain restaurants and traffic congestion, and pretty soon folks are looking for a way out.  This is excaberbated two ways:
1.  Major construction firms build the same durn three floorplans everywhere, without regard to sunlight, incline, rainfall, etc.  Their economic gain from mass production is paid for by the consumer, who can't use 1/3 of the house due to temperature.  Also, they build a 3,000 sq. ft. house on a 4,000 sq. ft. lot.
2.  Farmers can't make a living, encourage their kids to get into businesses that earn better and less chaotically, and then can't retire unless they sell out to a big housing construction firm.  It's not fair for these folks.  And when folks treat land like a commodity, and a disposable one at that, then we are left with pock-marked, cheap housing, little outside, unpaved space, and a sad shadow of a life.
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Offline Old Ways

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #5 on: March 28, 2007, 10:39:00 AM »
V13- I agree totally. Sometimes I get so frustrated with it all. I could go on and on about how the system promotes wastefullness and overpopulation. Maybe I will write more later about all this.

Wapiti- My story is the same as yours. Years ago when my wife and I started our homestead I told her there will be no garbage service. At first she thought I was being impractical. We learned to be carfull about what we purchase. The first step was to REDUCE consumption. We located the local recycling center and goodwill. If we found we had something we no longer needed it but was still usefull it was either sold or went to Goodwill to be REUSED. If it was no longer any good it was RECYCLED. This included paper, metal, glass, and plastics. Wood became fuel. Organic matter went into the compost bin for the garden. Still we found that we would have about 1 bag of trash every eight weeks or so because of the styrofoam and other packaging materials that are associated with store bought items. Guess we have to stop getting anything from the store to be 100% free of trash.

I also work construction. The waste in that line of work is unreal and no one seems to care. Dumpsters are filled at every job. Like you I try to recycle what I can. My newest vehicle is 11 years old and I hope it lasts alot longer. If it doesn't it will be recycled and I will get an older diesel and run it on WVO or BioDiesel.
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Offline Beau

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #6 on: May 22, 2007, 04:27:00 PM »
Reverence!!!
Once we trash the planet not much else will matter
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Offline vermonster13

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2008, 10:01:00 AM »
A good one to bring back.
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Offline brettlandon

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2008, 09:47:00 PM »
My grandmother tells me about the days when people would buy ten acres of timberground from the county, cut down all the firewood they would want, and then let the land go back to the county by not paying taxes on it.  "Everyone did it", she told me.

We live in the greatest country in the world.  This is a land of plenty and has been so for as long as we 'invaders' have called it home.  Our attitude has always been that there is more if we just work harder or smarter or both.  This attitude is soundly backed by experience.  Sure, some have it rough, but most of us whine about our good life as though the rope ain't new enough.  I will be the first to raise my hand.  It's easy to gripe about the little burrs under our saddle instead of thanking the good Lord we have a saddle and are horseback and not afoot!

I too work in the construction field and have seen the family farms dissappearing, the fields and forest becoming the newest mall (but at least they have a Scheel's), complete with enough McD's and Wal-M**t's to make sure every dime is spent.  I have seen our homes taking over the homes of the wild creatures and the new developments gobbling up all the timberland in the area.  I make my living by this urban invasion and yet it makes me sad.

I still live in my hometown of 350 people in the middle of a farming community.  Most of us who grew up on those farms are doing something else now, though many of us still have strong roots to the land.  My dad still farms the family ground that my great-great-grandfather farmed over one hundred years ago, but it will be farmed by some giant corporation when he is done.  I've seen the changes occour as the cities (des moines, in my case) continue to grow and expand their concrete tenticles in our direction.

We have these city folks moving out here to the country for the good life.  Unfortunately, their idea of the good life and ours sometimes differ enormously.  Someone will move out onto an acerage and suddenly will discover a hog confinement is in their area.  Now this is very different from what they are used to (they never had these in the human confinement [city] areas they are from) and they sometimes smell bad.  Next thing you know the family farm, which has existed for a full century, is assulted by the DINK with a NIMBY lawsuit.  Okay, I don't like the smell of a hog confinement area either, but it used to be everyone out this way had a few pigs.  You think it smelled better then???  Nobody invited them but now that they are here it is their back yard.  And the worst of it is, as soon as they bankrupt the family farm by slapping a lawsuit on them, they sell their house because they've lived in it for five to seven years and the area just isn't chic enough for them anymore.

I blame the architects.  Nobody builds houses with front porches anymore.  Instead, everyone has a back deck (usually surrounded by a privacy fence).  Front porches were necessary places for greeting your neighbors and saying 'howdy' to folks as they passed by.  They were a place where you could get out of the elements and 'set a spell.'  Nowadays, everyone has a back deck for 'private gatherings,' barbecues, pool parties and the like.  We're losing the fight cause we don't even know each other anymore.

Sorry to drone on about this, I'm just a country boy with a mountain man's heart and, as the saying goes, I was born a hundred years too late.

-Brett

P.S.  I'll just go curl up with my blankey and Norman Rockwell picture book for a couple of hours and I'll be okay again.
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Online McDave

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2008, 11:45:00 PM »
"TVs, vcrs, stereos, computers, etc? All cheaper to buy new than to repair, or obsolesence is built into them."

This, in my opinion, is one of the most insidious changes in our culture since the formation of the USA.  What really happens when we buy a cheap TV or computer that was made in China?

1.  We lose the technological and industrial knowledge and infrastructure to build it in the USA.

2.  Money flows to China, which has accumulated to the point that they have a strong leverage over our economy, depending on what they decide to do with the US bonds they hold.

3.  China builds more factories, which gains them what we lose in #1 above.  More importantly, these factories can easily be converted into the production of weapons, just like ours were in WWII.

4.  We are subsidizing what is essentially slave labor.  People who are starving due to gross over-population are drafted to work in factories under conditions that have not existed in this country since the late 1800's.

5.  We are converting our economy from a producing economy to a service economy.  After we have been bled dry, I guess we can support each other by shining each other's shoes.

6.  We are eliminating the middle class in this country.  We are fast becomming a two-tier society: the well to do, educated, technologists and professionals on the one hand, and the minimum wage gofers in the service businesses, hotels, restaurants, call centers, billing factories, Walmart greeters, etc., on the other.

7.  We are undermining all we have tried to accomplish in improving worker safety, child labor laws, employment levels, and environmental polution.  Since companies are restricted from doing these things in the USA anymore, they just move their operations overseas where they can exploit workers, ignore safety standards, and pollute to their heart's content.

All of which is why I am happy and proud to pay $1,000 for a bow that is handmade in the USA, and I know that each dollar will end up in the pockets of a US worker, owner, or supplier, who will turn right around and spend it on something they want or need, which will improve our economy (unless they spend it on a cheap imported TV, of course!).

Are we really better off than we were in the '50's, before all this started happening?  In the 1950's, we did not have cheap TV's, or cars, or clothes, or any cellphones or computers to speak of at all.  In the 1950's when I was growing up, I think I had one pair of shoes at a time, and they weren't $100+ Nikes with fancy swooshes on them, either.  If I wanted to entertain myself, I went out and shot baskets or played catch with someone.  My mother didn't work outside the home.  My family bought our first house because there was no down payment under the GI bill and the monthly payments were no different than what we were already paying in rent.  Nobody had a credit card.  In the 1950's, we had a steel industry, American cars were the best in the world, and all technology was not only designed, but manufactured here in the USA.   So there were jobs not only for the college grad engineers, but for those who wanted to make a living with their hands, also.  The price we paid for that was smaller houses, and we had to work more hours to get that TV or car, since the workers who made them were well paid.

We gave that up for two reasons: our desire for cheaper goods, and the general belief, promoted by internationalists, that the change was inevitable and we could no more stop it than sweep back the sea.

Well, maybe we will be done in by our desire for cheap goods.  But I can assure you that the change is NOT inevitable.  We can actually control our own destiny, because we are the ones paying for it!  We have enormous power because of that, which we don't realize.  Because we are the ones paying the bill, we could demand that all goods imported into the United States be manufactured under the same worker safety and pollution laws that companies face here.  My feeling is that if US companies were allowed to compete on a level playing field, they could produce products at the same cost as foreign competitors.  And, we would have the advantage of lower shipping costs, which will become an ever increasing factor as fuel costs continue to rise.  The cost of goods as a whole would rise in the US, since manufacturing costs would increase, but the upside would be the rebirth of the blue collar middle class worker.

Sorry, didn't mean to rant this long.
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Offline Bonebuster

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #10 on: February 23, 2008, 08:52:00 AM »
When government officials have direct ties to corporate management they manipulate situations to benefit themselves at the expense of you and me.

I remember Ross Perot, and his statement about how the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA) was going to create a sucking sound once it was into effect. That sucking sound is our jobs and our money leaving this country.

Levis blue jeans are made in Mexico. I found that out when I bought a pair, and one leg was longer than the other. They weren`t cheaper, they were just more profitable for Levis corp.
Guess how many companies make blue jeans here in the U.S.. NONE! Not even Carharts work clothes are made domestically.

Why don`t our politicians vote to get import taxes put on these goods? It`s what the people want, so why don`t we do it?

I bought a new clothes dryer five years ago. It had a three yr warranty, unless I bought an extended one to take it to five years. Surely it will last five years, right? A computer circuit board, went out in it. The dryer was $400.00 new.
The new circuit board was 40.00 cheaper than what I paid for the dryer. I fixed it myself, as "saved" forty dollars. The circuit board was made in China. When I was a kid, the dryer my mother had went twenty years ,and was replaced only because the hose broke on the washer, and flooded the laundry room. The dryer was made in Indiana, but the hose was made in China.

Offline Mrs Stickman

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2008, 11:21:00 AM »
There are several misconceptions about overseas manufacture of goods.  One of them is that there is no regulation on quality or labor standards.  In most cases (I am not so ignorant to say all of them) companies who have a name to protect, such as Levi's, Carhart, Addidas, Nike, Disney etc, work within a system to try to insure the quality and good name of their products.  This includes being associated with the Fair Labor Association, a WORLD WIDE governing body that contracts with factories and companies to make sure that labor standards are met, as well as quality standards.  This organization loses at least one person a year, sometimes more than that, to "bootleggers" that are paid by our grand old AMERICAN economy.  I am talking about a person or persons being killed because they found out that John Doe american business man has requested to have the NASCAR logo on thier products but doesn't want to pay NASCAR for the right - so they booleg it and try to pass it off as the real deal.  How stupid is that!!!

I love my country, I am proud to live here and I would like to buy products that are made in the USA.  But I also work here, and I will never make the kind of money neccessary to afford everything being made here.
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Offline laddy

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #12 on: February 25, 2008, 03:42:00 AM »
I think the majority of Americans are brain washed, it is done through media, advertising, and even government.  We are victims of short phrases and short attention spans.  while we squabble over slight differences we loose our rights, we loose our financial integrity, check what is happening to the value of our not so almighty dollar, and worst of all we loose our identities to systemic marketing ploys that is designed to sound good and suck every possible dollar out of the working class.  We are victims of a corperacy, they buy our law makers with our money.

Online Terry Green

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2008, 11:18:00 AM »
This is suppose to be an issue forum for Trad Bowhunting....and Not a 'community forum'.

We sure don't want this to turn into a community forum.!!!  :scared:
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Offline vermonster13

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #14 on: February 25, 2008, 11:48:00 AM »
True Terry, I was thinking on how this has moved into hunting and how it affects hunting as a whole. Loss of hunting lands, increased loss of opportunity because of trash and such. My bad on letting it spread to other areas in the thread.
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Offline Tom Leemans

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #15 on: February 25, 2008, 11:51:00 AM »
Exactly!
The town I grew up in, actually has been trying to revitalize down town. However, right accross the river, are two cities who'd rather expand outward and build new, than reclaim the old run down, crime infested down town area. (that is except for the area right near the gambling boats) I've emailed their city councils on many occasions to express my disgust that they aren't tearing down old condemned properties and fixing the infrastructure, so the area can be revitalized. My messages have fallen on deaf ears.

No, instead, they'd rather bulldoze trees and tillable land and put up new buildings and neighborhoods on the outskirts of town. All in the name of $$$  Greed is a horrible thing. Waste is just another bad byproduct of it.
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Offline vermonster13

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Re: The disposable mindset and it's effects
« Reply #16 on: February 25, 2008, 11:56:00 AM »
My fault folks in not keeping the thread on point. It was fun but out of the scope allowed in the forum. My apologies to all.
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