MO HOGS "root" of the problem

[TRAP]

I'm starting this thread because I posted some  comments inappropriately on another thread geared towards getting a bunch of guys together to hunt hogs in Missouri.

I'll jump right in with my opinion about feral hogs in Missouri.  I wish we didnt have any.  

My reasons include habitat destruction, disease issues and illegal activity surrounding the propagation of a feral hog population.

The state of Missouri is blessed with alot of public land acres open to hunting.  State Forests, Forest Service Land, Corps of Engineers Land, Military reservations, Conservation Areas all offer public hunting.  That being said, only about 7% of Missouri acres are public land and 93% of all acres are privately owned.  

Missouri is amoung the nation's top states in Cow-Calf production.  Missouri also is also amoung the nation's top states in ag crop production.  If you could poll the Private landowners in Missouri I think you'd find an extremely high percentage of them would be opposed to feral hogs residing on their land and competing with them for bushels of grain and cattle forage.  This in itself is reason enough to oppose feral hogs in Missouri.  The same people that feed free-roaming deer and turkey are feeding feral hogs as well and they arent happy about it.

The feral hog population in Missouri gained a foothold for all the same reasons it did in other states. Hogs are prolific breeders, intelligent and adaptible.  I cant speak for other states, but in Missouri, feral hogs had help getting started.  They were released by folks that enjoyed hunting them.  

The fact that they can be hunted basically year around and without permit and by residents and non residents alike make them an attractive quarry.  

Enter the Commercial Aspect:

In the beginning some crafty hog chasers realized they could guide and sell feral hog hunts behind dogs and over bait and probably other methods as well.  The only thing they needed that they didnt have was a place to start their hog population and a place to conduct their hog hunting activity.  Since they knew they wouldnt be welcome on old Joe's land down the road. What better place than public land?  Huge tracts of land that anyone could use anytime of the year.

I might remind you that the public land being used by them is the same public land that is open to us for hunting native Missouri wildlife.

In the light of day the hogs were purchased from folks that trapped them in other states, and under the cover of darkness they were released on yours and my public land.  

How many feral hogs are in Missouri?  Who knows  Can they be erradicated?  Who knows  What can be done about them?  Hopefully this is where you'll jump in.  Heck I've rambled long enough.

One option is to do nothing and let the population grow.  Another is to adopt them as Missouri wildlife and regulate their harvest. Another option is to allow hunters to hunt them and rely on state and federal agencies to control them where they become a problem.  Still another option and the one I like the most is to ban all recreational hunting of feral hogs in the state of Missouri. I like this option because it removes the commercial incentive for releasing hogs on public lands.  If you cant hunt them then it might be tough to sell hunts or recreationally pursue them.

The problem with the last option is.  What do we do with the hogs we already have?  

If this thread generates enough conversation we can explore alot of other hog issues.  

That's up to you, I welcome your input.  Trap

[Scott J. Williams]

I have hunted hogs throughout the south.  They are tough to get rid of.  Your last option, in my mind is the wrong one.  If you want to keep them in check, maybe you should hunt them. Maybe there should be a ban on "commerical" hunting of Hogs in MO.  

There should, maybe serious enforcement of the laws already in force would be the best choice. Punish those who bring the darn things in.
 
While many people feel as you do about the hogs, they must be managed. Having said that, the Genie is already out of the bottle.  

Bounties on the hogs are an option, that is, if the state is serious.  The introduction of outside species is a real problem in this country.  It has changed the face of many of our lakes and streams.  

This has far reaching complications, if you don't think so, Look up the "SnakeHead" a fish that was introduced in the northeast.

I love hog hunting, I do it as often as I can, and I do it year around.  I hail from IL, and grew up in Michigan. I would hate to see them running through the swamps in Michigan, but if they were there, I damn sure would hunt them.

The only way to take care of hog populations you don't want, is to kill them. It really matters not that people pay to kill them, or do it on their on, they just have to be killed.

[TRAP]

thanks for your reply Scott,  

The hog issue is complex and I think it takes some thinking outside the box to find a solution.

We do hunt hogs here in Missouri and have since the beginning.  Heck the entire state is open to hunting by anyone and anytime of year.  The only stipulations are you have to have a valid deer or turkey permit if you are hunting hogs at a time those seasons are open.  Even with basically no regulations on feral hogs and growing hunting pressure Feral hogs continue to thrive.  If the goal is erradication or even control of hogs, hunting is not getting the job done.  

You suggested banning the "commercial" hunting of hogs.  That's an enforcement nightmare.  Who's going to admit they are a commercial hog hunting operation.  If recreational hunting is permitted the commercial operations will instantly transform themselves into "recreational" hunters.  Sure, the Conservation department could put together some undercover operations and arrest some violators but having one activity legal and another illegal muddies the water at best.  I still hold that if all hunting of feral hogs was prohibited the incentive to release them would go away.  Then we'd only be faced with eliminating the ones we have and not those in addition to the new releases.

Let me make it perfectly clear that I do not oppose hunting in anyway.  I dont oppose hog hunting.  I hunt as hard as and love hunting as much as anyone here. I dont consider the folks making illegal releases of hogs as hunters at all.  They are no different than guys that drive around and shoot deer at night with spotlights and then sell antlers.  They are just criminals IMO.  

Not sure I can buy into the bounty system as a legitimate control tactic. The bounty system has been put in place to control many species of animals causing problems.  Counties used to pay bounties on Coyotes here in Missouri.  We still have as many coyotes as we ever did.  There is currently a market for beaver tails in Missouri.  Here's what drives the market.  Missouri trappers sell beaver tails to the middle man for 1 or 2 bucks and the middle man sells the tails to damage control trappers in Mississippi and elsewhere for 3 or 4 bucks and then the trapper turns in the tails for bounty to the timber company or drainage district or whomever offers the bounty.  Just another racket.

In mid April I attended the National Feral Hog Conference in St. Louis.  While there I spoke with a biologist from the Michigan DNR and based on what she told me there's probably some hog hunting opportunities in those Michigan Swamps you speak of.

I suppose they'll be everywhere eventually.  If states are too slow to react when they arrive or arent proactive enough before they come populations of hogs will sprout up everywhere.  

I agree with your assessment that the only way to get rid of hogs is killing them but huntrers have free reign to kill as many as they want in Missouri, State and Federal Agencies are trapping and killing them whenever they are found, Private landowners are shooting them on site but the population continues to grow and new isolated popultions are springing up on a regular basis.

Trap

[fatman]

The State of Kansas has taken the feral hog threat very seriously.

I live four miles from the Missouri state line, about an hour east of Truman reservoir.  Hogs have travelled up the river drainages, and now are being found in many of the surrounding counties.  Hunting feral hogs is illegal in Kansas; and the "management" is not being handled by KDWP, but by the USDA, with helicopters and automatic weapons.

There's been a few articles by the outdoor columnist in our county paper, wondering why hunters are not allowed to chase the hogs and utilize the meat...as you said, Trap, Kansas is a state that relies heavily on agriculture, and the legalization of hunting could (would) open the door to individuals importing populations to "supplement" the herd.  I hunted a small ranch in Texas this spring, and the owner regularly traps pigs and sells them to commercial operations, so the source is certainly there.

The farm lobby is very strong in Kansas, and KDWP protects its deer herd like a crown jewel...gamebirds and turkeys are also a big draw...I predict that it will be a long time before hog hunting is allowed in Kansas...

I was watching the Missouri hunt thread, and, as a hunter, it's easy to be mesmerized by all the hog hunting we see on this site, especially when we have no open "big game" seasons...but I'll take the small game (year-round rabbits) and happily travel down south (or to Missouri) when I want to chase hogs....

Kevin

[TRAP]

Hog hunting is a big draw Kevin, and heading down to Lake Wappapello and chasing hogs and squirrells and catching a few crappie with a big bunch of Traditional Bowhunters sounds like an absolute blast. Might even result in some roasted ribs.  They are delicious.

As hunters, I hope we can excersise caution when we talk about hogs and hog hunting in public.  Most landowners would say, "kill em all, I don't care"  But mention that you'd like to have a bunch more to hunt for recreation in front of that same landowner and you've just made an enemy for hunting.

Hunting sportsmen are not the problem,  it's the folks that are releasing them for their own financial gain that are. I will not give them credit by calling them hunters.  The title of Poachers fit them better.

I think the farm lobby in Kansas lobbied for a Federal appropriation to address the hog issue in KS.  Or maybe the KDWP is just paying the contract costs of having USDA WS do the hog control.  In any case it's big dollars to take on a full blown erradication effort.  I commend Ks for thinking outside the box and at least giving it an honest effort.  

Sadly the people that used to release them on your Corps lakes are now just driving a little farther to release them around ours.  LOL as long as they have a place they'll stay in business.

It will be interesting to see where we are 5 years from now.  

Thanks for your reply, Trap

[Curtis Haden]

Daryl,

I appreciate your insight and candor.  Let me begin by saying, I obviously don't   know nearly as much as you do about feral hogs.  My interest and knowledge of them is limited to what I've been able to learn since finding out we had several close to where I live.  I don't condone how they got here, but they are undeniably here.

I'd also like to say publicly, that I appreciate your willingness to bring your thoughts here, instead of the "hunting" thread.

Here's the part of your initial post I'd like to discuss:

 

Originally posted by TRAP:
Still another option and the one I like the most is to ban all recreational hunting of feral hogs in the state of Missouri. I like this option because it removes the commercial incentive for releasing hogs on public lands.  If you cant hunt them then it might be tough to sell hunts or recreationally pursue them.
 

I don't know much about a lot...       ...but one thing I do know a bit about is people who intentionally misbehave.  The folks who would illegally release pigs on private -or- public land, are people of low moral character.    They are crooks and thugs.    They do not care about laws.  They're the same folks who would shine a deer and shoot it, or steal your treestand.  They are also the   same people  who would continue to sell hunts if it was illegal to do so.  It might discourage some potential clients, but let's face it, there are enough turds out there, who like to kill stuff, that the "guides" would still have a market.

I won't debate the negative aspects of our piggy population with you, because I believe you're right.  As I've previously stated, "they're here, we're probably not going to eradicate them, so let's hunt them."  As far as eradication goes, I simply don't believe that the folks who control the purse strings will ever spend enough money to do it.

If I didn't make it clear enough in the first paragraph or two, I'm not posting this to be argumentative, and I welcome your feedback.

[TRAP]

Thanks for posting Curtis,

I agree with everything you've posted.  I'm not trying to stir up an argument either but challenge people to be part of a solution instead of complacent and therefore part of the problem.  

Since the current regulations are what they are, I encourage every hunter in the state to kill every hog they can and have fun doing it. I encourage them to get involved in the hog hunting culture and learn as much as they can about it. When hunters get involved, good things happen.  Hunting and fishing sportsmen turn in more poachers and poaching activity than anybody else.  If we as hunters really get involved the criminals will be exposed.  When you see an add about a guided feral hog hunt in Missouri, make an inquiry, ask some questions and snoop around.  Ask pointed questions like "how do you know we'll find hogs"  and "where will we be hunting"  If you get a lead, report it through Operation Game Thief or directly to your local conservation agent.

I'd like to see some Kansas folks weigh in and report whether or not they feel the ban on hog hunting has led to less illegal activity.  What they did was bold and risky at best.  They are the proverbial "Guinea Pig" in the fight against feral hogs in the Midwest.

You hit the nail on the head when you mentioned the "purse strings".  It would take an incredible amount of monetary resourses to erradicate hogs in Missouri or anywhere else for that matter.  The committment  would have to come from federal, state and private entities which are all stakeholders in the issue.  

Untill those committments are made and regulations changed we may as well be part of the current "solution".  Hunt em hard, learn what you can and expose those that are trying to grow a hog population.

Again, thanks for your post, Daryl


Daryl

[fatman]

Daryl, I know I've already posted, but...

Since I live here, I don't really pay much attention to commercial hunting in Kansas;  but, I don't know that I've ever seen an add for commercial pig hunting in the state.  I am aware of an instance where some individuals brought in some ferals and released them along a river with the INTENTION of starting an operation;  however, the Department of Ag caught wind and told the owner that they had X number of days to hunt down and kill every single pig, or they'd be fined.  This was probably 10 years or so past.  Swine are HIGHLY REGULATED by the Kansas Department of Ag, and any animal transported into the state needs to have documentation that they are disease-free.  My guess is that this restriction makes commercial hunting difficult to justify financially. And actively advertising the hunt would bring the troops in quickly. As I said before, the Farm Lobby carries a lot of weight in Kansas;  if they complain of depredation, politicians listen, or they don't get re-elected.  So, I think that the Ag Community is doing much more to stem the tide of hog expansion than anything else.  Remember, we don't have the large expanses of State and National Forest that you have; riparian habitat affords the bulk of our "woods", at least in the western 3/4 of the state.  West Texas has much more "brush" like mesquite and scrub oak.  The expansion we're seeing tends to be up the waterways leading out of Missouri (sorry) and Oklahoma.  And Wildlife and Parks has teamed with the Department of Ag to do all they can to try to nip it in the bud.
Eventually, they may lose out, and there may be an actual "population" in the state....but they're not gonna sit back and "let" it happen.  This is the very reason that they DO NOT allow hunting of the feral hogs....

[Scott J. Williams]

While I commend Kansas for it's effort, I am affraid that it is doomed to fail before it starts.  I am sure there are laws on the books to hammer people who import any exotic without going through proper channels.

I am a Law Enforcement Officer, here in Texas, and can tell you that this is not unlike many other crimes.  

When you have a hog problem, you are not going to get rid of it totally, but you can control it.  Professional hunting is too costly, and won't get it done alone.  Turn hunters loose, have them pay for the privilege to hunt them, and us that money to manage the herd, and step up law enforcement efforts. The more guns, and bows you haver taking them out, the more likely you will reach a managed  level.

The darn things are such a big problem, that in area where they have become a pest, landowners beg people to shoot them.  One might consider a law that says, you may allow hunting on your property for hogs, but you cannot profit from it beyond the  hunters eradication of the hogs.  

I still say bounties work, it is proven. This way, you have allowed those who wish to hunt, the opportunity. You would also have prevented those who would be incline to import them for a profit, from profiting, increased the monies for management/law enforcement, and therefore move in a positive direction toward the control of the beast.

Besides, the truth is,  they have moved as far north as IL, and Indiana through natural progression.  If they are found in a neighboring state, you will soon have them too. Best learn to get on those populations early, and lean on them hard. I must again refer to the example of the "Snake Head" a fish from South East Asia, do a google.  This is serious business.  I love hunting hogs, but I would not wish them on anyone who didn't already have them...........They can and do adversely affect deer and other game populations...IMO

[BobT]

Daryl,

You make an interesting point! I must say that I had not thought of banning hog hunting. I don't think that we can ever completely eradicate the hogs in this area. I have a friend with a good sized cow/calf operation who suffered a lot of damage from hogs that were released by one of those people you mention who thought they would make a little money selling hog hunts. He has been killing every hog he is able to for the last several years. I think his problems started in '93 or '94, he has personally killed over 200 hogs mostly by shooting on sight every one he saw, some were trapped but they got wise to the traps pretty quickly, a few were shot with spotlights, some were taken by tracking them up in fresh snow, bayed with hounds etc..    The guy who released them advertised free ranging hunts in a national publication. Everyone around here knows who he is and he didn't gain any popularity but to my knowledge was never charged with any crime. My farmer friend had a couple of biologists come and camp a few days and set some traps. They caught a hog in a snare (I think) for DNA studies. I never heard any outcome. I ramble too much! Getting back to my original point, despite the best efforts of several people the hogs were never eradicated, when the pressure got too intense they simply moved to an area with less pressure. Just a couple of weeks ago a fellow killed a sow on the ridge above my friends barn with a belly full of pigs! I think we are stuck with them. I wish there were some way to get rid of them completely but they are too intelligent and too adaptable I think to make this a reality! If the hogs weren't enough now we have Armadillos too, as if the Turkeys and Quail needed another nest predator! Just my humble opinion!

Bob

[TRAP]

I agree Bob,

I'm not sure what the answer is.  Even if we could completely erradicate them our neighboring states harbour enough  hogs to quickly repopulate our state via dispersal.

Their tendancy to pack up and move makes them a difficult critter to deal with for sure.

Trap

[Hogtamer]

I've been in the woods along the Savannah River for 45 yrs (I'm 55).  For at least that long there have been feral hogs.  Heck, I guess it's fair to say that since DeSoto came up the river there have been feral hogs....They may not be able to be eliminated (I hope not!) but they can be contained...If they frequent agricultural areas the local farmers do whatever it takes to kill them off so the population waxes and wanes.  They've been here so long that I believe they're part of the "natural" environment now.  Yes, they can be terribly destructive if the population is unchecked and as my handle might indicate I do my part to keep the population under control.  My advice is to make some new friends that own property that holds hogs and keep 'em in sausage and bar-b-que.  I took a landowner 5 lbs of andouille just yesterday I made from a couple of pigs we killed on his place July 5th....got permission to go back, too.  I guess if you gotta have a problem, a huntable population of porkers is a good one to have....

[Scott J. Williams]

Hogtamer,

     I must agree, lead me to them "Poke Chops"!

[Steel]

You can't control hogs without hunters. Chopper flyovers alone are a joke several weeks back they did a fly/shot on the Ranch next to one of my leases and Never shot a hog. Same week two of my trail cams had pictures of dozens of hogs in one picture alone. Heck there are always hogs in that area and have been for 20 years. I hate to say once you have hogs get use to it near impossiable to get ride of all of them your best bet is to control numbers and that includes trapping,hunting,flyovers, and thing else you can throw into the mix. You can ban commerical hunting but most commerical hunting folks are legal and obey the laws and if they pay to trap hogs move them to a fenced area they are killing hundreds to thousands of the hogs that could be breeding in your state every year. The best Hope I can see to control the numbers is delcare open season and Make the laws on moving wild hogs into the state so strong you would be looking at certain extend jail time for doing so and offer public rewards on tips for people doing so.

[TRAP]

Thanks for your contribution Cody and I agree with many of your points.  

The commercial operationms in Missouri are not trapping hogs and releasing them in pens.  They are buying hogs from out of state and locally and releasing them on public land so they are not killing hundreds or thousands of hogs. They instead are cultivating a feral hog population.

Our state agency is  currently trapping hogs, using judas pigs, snaring, contracting with dog hunters, using helicopters and there are stiff penalties for illegal transport and release of feral hogs.  We also have a very successful Operation Game Theif program in which rewards are paid to citizens that tip our agents off to ilegal activity.

You say most of the commercial guys are law obiding folks and this is where I disagree.  The mere fact they can hunt hogs and sell hunts commercially is incentive to covertly break the law.  As long as there is hog hunting there will be illegal activity in the form of illegal releases, just like as long as we have Big Bucks, wel'll have poachers and as long as turkeys taste as good as they do there will be those that take too many.  Historically, hunters have not "controlled" hog populations anywhere they exist.  They've killed a few sure, but not "controlled" a population.

You and others have said, "once you have em get used to em"  I'd have to agree that if we conduct business like Al, Ga, La, Ms, Tx, Ok and others we might as well "get used to em"  I'm still holding out hope that we'll overcome complacency and fight em untill there's no way we can win.  

I think Kansas is on the right track by attacking the feral hog problem at the source and preventing commercial activity by saying NO to feral hog hunting.   It adds alot of responsibility to state game officials and public land managers and the taxpayers of Kansas but I commend them for thinking outside the box on this one.  

Time will tell, Trap

[SC Bowhunter]

I don't want to start an argument, but I have to chime in here.
Lets be realistic. If the neighboring state has wild hogs, there is no way in the world you are going to keep them out of your state. To attempt to is a giant waste of money.
And as you say, if it is the USDA doing the shooting, it is my tax money as well.
Also, whenever I hear someone say " do not allow hunting, we can hire shooters to take care of the problem", nine times out of ten it is anti-hunters and gun-rights advocates, not the hunters themselves.
To say that as long as you can hunt the hogs, the commercial operations will break the law is ludicrous. Thats like saying as long as cars can do over the speed limit, everyone will speed.

Face it, the hogs are here to stay and the ONLY way to control them is with the hunters.

Rob

[TRAP]

Easy Rob, no need for name calling.  

I agree, if neighboring states have hogs, there will always be an influx of hogs that need to be dealt with.  States such as Nebraska, Iowa, Kansas and Illinois are counting on us to do our best to prevent the further spread of feral hogs.  

You make referrence to USDA doing the shooting as a waste of your tax money.  Would you prefer your tax dollars be spent reimbursing landowners for damage caused by hogs so local hunters have a population to hunt?

Trust me, I am not anti-hunting or anti-gun.  I sent you a PM with my phone number if you'd like to discuss that further.

Maybe Missouri is unique with the type of Commercial operators running feral hog hunts.  I'm sure there are some that are law abiding and if I said they were 100% outlaws I appologize.  The bulk of them advertise guided hog hunts on private and public land behind dogs.  While private landowners may welcome someone helping them eliminate hogs, there arent many if any that welcome hog populations on their land.  They are the folks screaming at our conservation department and other state agencies to get rid of them.  Sadly those Landowners are  victims of circumstance.  They own land adjacent to public land where hogs have been released by those "law abiding" commercial operations. (typed with tonque firmly in cheek).

The state of Missouri is wide open to hog hunting.  As I stated before hunting is a great management tool as long as it's done ethically and legally.  If there is a way to stop the illegal activity (illegal releases) while allowing guys like you and me to hunt hogs recreationally I'm all for it.  You and I arent releasing hogs though just for recreation,  there's no money in it and we know better.  

A ban on the hunting of feral hogs would no doubt be punishing law abiding recreational hunters right along with the scumbags that do what they can when they can to propogate a feral hog population.  Some hunters are not willing to make that sacrifice.  Some hunters welcome the feral hog as a way to extend his/her hunting season. We are all entitled to our own wants and desires.  

I read a thread on the Pow Wow forum where someone was on a hog hunt somewhere in the south and was told they couldnt shoot pregnant sows or sows with pigs.  I hope it never gets to that point in Missouri.  I hope we never view hogs as a welcome member in our natural environment here in Missouri.  Our deer herd and wild turkey population and the many other aspects that make Missouri special to me would suffer immensely if hogs ever exist here in the numbers they exist in the south.  I say that without reservation because I'm entitled to my own opinion and I think hogs are bad for Missouri and those who own land here.

Trap

[SC Bowhunter]

Daryl,
You misunderstood what I said. I was not inferring that you were anti-hunting or anti-gun. What I was saying is that some of the things you were saying were sounding just like those groups. For example, forbidding legal hunters from hunting a species while at the same time gladly paying someone to shoot them.

Look, it is already illegal to release the hogs in the wild. It is similar to the gun control issue in that these people are already breaking the law. Do you think they are worried about breaking another one?

From my standpoint the best way to go about it would be to make hogs legal game year-round (and maybe have a bounty) while at the same time, do not allow commercial outfitters to offer hog hunting.
That way the hunters have the opportunities and the incentive is still not there for the outfitters.

Rob

[TRAP]

Hogs "are" legal game year around currently in Missouri.  We can't make it much more liberal.  

The point I'm trying to make is, It's nearly impossible to control the activities of commercial hog operations if any form of hog hunting is allowed.  

Here's a scenario for a Law enforcement officer responsible for making cases against illegal "commercial" feral hog hunting activity.    

You stand on a ridgetop in the Missouri Ozarks at high noon on a day in the Middle of March and you can hear some dogs running game in the distance.  Rabbit season is closed, so you can assume those houndsmen are running hogs or deer or maybe coyotes.  You hear a gunshot and some hooping and hollering.  When you approach the happy hunters you realize they have taken a feral hog.  If "commercial" hog hunting is legal you congratulate them and keep moving.  If "commercial" hunting is illegal you ask questions of the fellows standing around with guns and designer hunting clothes on and you ask the local in brown duck coveralls if any money has changed hands between them and everyone says no, they state they are just friends of the local guy and they are here from out of state by invite and simply hunting for recreation.  You're left with the burden of proof which in this case is pretty hard to dig up.  You tell them congratulations and move on.  In this scenario it's nearly impossible to stop the commercial guy from doing business. Money changes hands under the table and unless someone opens their mouth business continues.  

In another scenario where all forms of hog hunting are illegal, you're standing on the same ridge listening to houndsmen running game.  When the gunshot is heard you head down to the scene and arrest everyone involved.  The illegal commercial hog man packs up his dogs and moves to another state where his dogs and his activities are welcome.  He no longer has a reason to buy and release hogs under the cover of darkness. You've taken away his incentive.  The way the system is now, he conducts business under the disguise of a recreational hunter.  

Several of you have suggested bounties and I'll challenge you to give one example of a bounty system that has worked to control wildlife.  You say you are concerned about how your tax dollars are spent.  The bounties will be paid with Missourian's tax dollars.  We're going to have to defend that and I'm not sure we can.  Bounties have been paid for coyotes throughout the US and we have more now than we ever have.  I spoke of the unethical activity which surround the beaver bounty earlier in this thread.  Please enlighten me. Maybe they work, I'm just not aware of a situation where they have.

I dont know guys.   There has to be a better way than the current system.  We are as liberal about folks killing hogs as anyone in the nation and encourage hunters to kill them and meanwhile the population grows.  

Trap