propane regulation

[Scott Roush]

I need to find out if it is possible to run a forced air forge off of a regulated tank.  I'm currently set up with full flow (tank pressure) going to a 0-30 psi regulator inside my shop.  My propane delivery guy help me set this up.  But I just had a safety inspection and according to local code you can only have a maximum of 5 psi going into a building although they will allow me a 10 psi regulator on the main tank.  I can't imagine that 5 psi would be sufficient for forge welding, but would a 10 psi regulator on the main tank provide enough flow?  For forging, I'm only running at 2-3 psi... but I haven't welded enough to get a feel for what I would need.

I've always thought it was necessary to have full tank pressure going to a gas forge, but the inspector thinks I should be fine with this 10 PSI reg.

So any advice on this??  Or do you guys just bribe your inspector???

[Scott Roush]

in other words... do those of you running a larger tank have a regulator on the actual tank that has to meet a local zoning reg??

Karl.. Don't you have a 0-30 on your main tank AND at the forge???

[Steve Nuckels]

Scott, I'm using a 30lb tank so as to avoid the city getting involved and their creative fees!

Interesting stuff!

Steve
--------
Potomac Forge

[Scott Roush]

I get WAY better rates with my 120 so I'm trying to make this work....

[Ragnarok Forge]

Are you using forced air right now?  I use 3 to 5 psi for general forging right now with a venturi burner.  My understanding is that a forced air system gets a lot hotter while using less fuel and lower pressure. I am working up a forced air system for my forge right now.

[Scott Roush]

yeah... it's forced air and it does get a lot hotter at lower psi than my venturi.

I know now that I have to get another reg for my tank size... I just need to find out if the 10 that they want me to use will work.  I've got this on three forums and I can't get an answer for some reason!

[kbaknife]

I have a regulator on my 100 gallon tank that steps it down to 9 PSI before it enters my shop piping.
Then a low pressure regulator at the end of my supply line that regulates the pressure to a needle valve at both forges.
And don't forget to have shut-offs everywhere you can think of.
At the tank, before it goes into the building, after it goes into the building, at the regulator at the end of the supply line, and at the forge.
Anyone who runs full pressure directly into their building seriously needs to re-think what they have just done. If there is ANY! kind of rupture in the line, they've got a serious blow torch that can change their life in only seconds. I mean, it's only a regulator for goodness' sake, and could make the difference between having a nice day or watching everything you own go up in smoke.
Safety and control is the only way to go.

[Jeremy]

I can get my small forge up to welding temps at under 10psi with a venturi burner.  I don't see why you wouldn't be able to do it with forced air burner.

I have to agree with Karl, and it needs repeating...
 

Anyone who runs full pressure directly into their building seriously needs to re-think what they have just done. If there is ANY! kind of rupture in the line, they've got a serious blow torch that can change their life in only seconds.

[Scott Roush]

As I mentioned in the beginning of this thread, I didn't set it up that way. The propane delivery folks did. Even the safety inspector, in his opinion, thought it was a safe set-up since everything went directly to black iron pipe with a direct connection to shut-off and regulator in my shop. His concern was mostly with code.  And I do indeed have all the shut-offs and needle valves inside my shop which I set up.

And I never said I was trying to NOT put a regulator on. I thought I made it clear enough that I was trying find out WHICH regulator would allow my forge to operate normally. The only reason I didn't have one to begin with was because it was set up that way by my supplier. I thought it was reasonable to trust the pros.

Jeremy.... The local code may require that I use a 5 psi reg at the tank so I hope I can indeed forge weld at that pressure otherwise I will have change everything.

Anyway... it seems that if they allow me the 10 psi reg rather than the 5, then I will have no problems. That is what I needed... Thank you!

[kbaknife]

I'm guess that what most "local regs" are focused on is pressure running into living dwellings. When converted from water column inches, the pressure run into most household appliances is only about 1/2 psi.
And that's with good reason - for the same "blow torch" scenario I mention above.
You know those flexible tubing supply lines often used for gas stoves and such? There is no way they would be safe at higher levels, so the codes keep the pressure really low.
I got an insurance policy on my shop, and rather cheaply. Maybe if you can pull that off, it would influence some "inspectors" or even the gas company to assist you getting things right.
I'm not fluent on all the terminology, but why is a "0-30" regulator considered "high"? Doesn't "0" constitute "low"? They're adjustable.
Heck, Darren Ellis sells "low" pressure regulators for gas tanks - get one of those. I would think that setting a regulator at 7# on a "high" pressure regulator or a "low" pressure regulator is still 7#!
Don't know if you remember, but I have a 100# tank right inside the wall from the outside tank, and have it connected in-line, with the big tank, with a shut-off, as a back-up in case I run out of fuel in the big tank. I put one of those regulators from Darren on it and have it regulated down to about 7#. Just get one from him, and they're not all that expensive, either.
No matter how you do it, I would just not operate until you can step that full tank pressure down before it enters your potential rocket ship.

[Scott Roush]

yep.. it' all cleared up. They are gonna put a 10 psi reg on.   Wheewww!

I don't know if a 0-30 is considered 'high pressure' or not, but since it allows 30 it goes way beyond what is legal.  The term regulator always implies that you can regulate the pressure beyond just stepping down, so 'high pressure', i figure, would designate the highest psi capability.

all of this is low pressure to me being a scuba diver... I'm used to dealing with 3000 psi.

[kbaknife]

Good thing that what you are dealing with isn't flammable!

[Scott Roush]

some of it is... oxygen.  I mess with mixed gas diving. flaming up is the last thing we worry about!

[mater]

I have been welding with 5-6 psi with a venturi forge. Cant imagine you would need more than that.