Am I Nuts?

[Ragnarok Forge]

I keep reading the comments and threads about drawing your knives, mid process sketching, etc....  I have to date never drawn or sketched a knife.  I enjoy stepping away from my engineering work and free styling the blades I make.  I like to form the vision of what I want in my mind and then transfer it to the steel.  

I know I am going to have to change my ways if I want to pass my journeyman test in a couple of years, for now though I am not planning to make the drawing transition in the near future.  

I keep a pattern of all my designs that I like so I have something to use to repeat the design.

[Lin Rhea]

You do it when you're ready Clay. I have pushed to draw your work. I may have pushed too hard. That "vision" you speak of is the one I try to capture on paper first. Sort of a snapshot of what I want. But, every one of us can make knives the way we are comfortable. I support that.

[akaboomer]

No problem with that, I have done it myself. I have trouble getting my mental vision to translate without a pattern. But I have had a couple knives turn out the way I wanted them without a pattern. It's your journey, do it your way.

Chris

[Ragnarok Forge]

Lin,  

You haven' t pushed to hard at all.   I am just trying to get  a feel for how folks here do things.  The title of the thread was meant to be tongue in cheek.   Your advice is always sound and appreciated.

[robtattoo]

Personally, when I was building knives, I used to do a very rough sketch, if I was doing something new, & freestyle it from there. To me, the sketch just gave a little further inspiration & a rough idea of what I was aiming for.
If I was building just for kicks & giggles, I never drew anything. I always like the steel to tell me what it wants to be.

[Ragnarok Forge]

Rob,

It may sound weird, once I get into a forging rythm I can hear the steel singing under the hammer blows.   I sometimes change my knife design in the forging process based on what I am hearing / feeling.  Nothing mystic here,  just listening to my inner voice and the sound of the steel as it moves under the hammer.  I spend my working hours in a regimented field with set criteria that have to be followed.   Free form forging and following a vision in place of a drawing is very relaxing for me.  

That feel and expression of vision is part of why I forged knives for 5 years and did not join the ABS.   I figured I wouldn't be able to meet their criteria with my methods.  Here soon I am going to have to refocus my efforts and style to conform to the ABS requirements long enough to pass my journeyman and masters tests.

[gables]

Clay, I think you summed up what seems to be a conflict that many have with the ABS standards and style. The ABS has a great mission and they have created very well respected standards of achievement. Applying standards, expectations and rules to what is an artistic process is going to not only test the established standards but challenge those trying to meet them. It seems, however, that the benefits of meeting those standards and expectations outweigh the creative strife that can emerge when doing things a certain way that conflict with your preferred style. I draw parallels between my goal for master smith rating and achieving my Eagle Scout award with the BSA. I don't 100% agree with the stance and teachings of the organization but I do believe that the benefits and good that emerge from a young boy attaining Eagle far outweigh the perceived negatives of the organization.

[Lin Rhea]

Clay, Your approach to forging is not uncommon and is great for "free styling".  I'm not the ABS and cant speak for them. But in my view, they dont care so much if you have a drawing or forge free style. The ABS in the context of taking the tests merely want to see clean work, primarily in a technical sense rather than artistic. So when you look at it like that, it really has very little to do with the ABS. It is in the artsistic sense that drawing my work has made a big improvement. In fact there are some knife makers that can knock your socks off that are not in the ABS, but they sure can make pretty knives. I cant imagine Wolfgang Loerchner not drawing his work before hand.

Again, this is not to sound preachy, just to offer that suggestion to the guys who are not happy with their knives. It gives them a direction to go.

Besides, your knives look pretty good anyway.

[Ragnarok Forge]

Lin,  

I will be posting pics of a Bowie knife I hot punched the guard on tonight.  I would love some critique.   I have a fair number of blades I forged a while back I am putting handles on some and finish grinding on others.  I want to finish them all so I can refocus my future  work to the ABS standards.

[Lin Rhea]

After reading Gabriels post, I would add:

In my opinion, there are some misconceptions about the ABS. The "standards, expectations and rules" are primarily concerning technical merit.I have heard time and again from the judges themselves, that style is subjective and they are smart enough to know a clean knife an any style. Your style is yours. If the fit and finish are good, they will appreciate it and it will pass as long as you have followed all clearly stated rules. You can make a knife with no ricasso, which is often linked with the ABS and if it's clean and fit up good, it will pass.  Some want to lean toward the Japanese influence, which is fine, but it better be as accurate as possible.

The judges themselves might make knives that are steriotypical "ABS style" but dont think they dont know other genres and styles. They do and they would appreciate it being accurate.

My point is the ABS is not being restrictive by levying rules. It has to be done. I never felt my artistic liscence was restricted by the testing process. Forging is just a part of the process of my knife making and should not of itself dictate the end result.

[Ragnarok Forge]

Lin,  

I completely agree.   My prior thinking was not based in actual experience with the ABS.   I have put in a lot of time researching the ABS and find it to be a great organization.   I just have to take the steps necessary to pass their testing.   One huge misconception I run into is the idea that the ABS method for heat treating a test blade is the only allowed method for ABS smiths.   Just plain silly.  That and people who argue that I should orient my blades to North when quenching.

[Lin Rhea]

Clay, I want to clarify that point as well. The performance test is merely to show that a smith is in control of the process. That he can make a hard, durable edge and a soft spine able to take a flex/bend of 90 degrees. Here is the part often left unsaid: That is only for the test. The ABS, their judges, and experienced members usually will not heat treat a blade in that manner for a durable and practical knife, not to mention one that cuts better and has "life" in it.

I saw a guy chop a 2 X 4 and bend his blade. You know why it bent? Because he made it as if it were a test blade with a dead soft spine. I only heat treat that way for test blades. All others have a springy back.

By the way Clay, you're not nuts. These are things I've heard before and are understandable concerns. I'm glad you brought it up.