And here we go!(First selfbow) Not Good but Not Lost

[Stiks-n-Strings]

Sounds good Pat
Thanks

[Shaun]

In your last tiller pick here is what I see: LEFT limb is bending more right at the fade, middle 1/3 bending some and last 1/3 not bending. RIGHT limb is bending nicely out to the slight hinge about 60% of the way from fade to tip, past this hinge there is little or no bending.

I would mark the left limb at the fade and the right limb at the slight hinge with XXXX and remove small amount of wood from the rest of the limbs with a few extra strokes on the last third towards the tips.

Yes, you are at the scraper stage now, go slow. Don't pull past final draw weight or past where you can see a flaw in the tiller.

Good work, you are getting close.

If you are going to recurve tips I like to do it at about the stage you are at. If you go for much recurve, you can lose some belly wood to delamination when you bend. Do it while you have wood to spare. A slight flip can be done at any time with much less chance of damage.

[Stiks-n-Strings]

Haven't worked on her alot lately but I have a few more questions before I go any further. I did do a little more tillering (never pulled it past my intended draw weight and exercised the limbs plenty) and it took about two inches of string follow.
 I have read a little about heat tempering the back to induce reflex or deflex (I can't remember which is which) How Exactly do I go about doing this? should I put oil on the part of the bow to be heated and if so what kind?

 Also should I boil, steam, or dry heat the tips to flip them? I dont want to put htat much recurve in the tips probably just the last 3 or 4 inches and a nice smooth curve.

Thanks for all the help so far I sure am learning alot and loving every minute of it.
Kris

[Stiks-n-Strings]

Top for answers

[4est trekker]

Kris:

You don't want to heat the back of the bow.  Heating tempers (i.e. hardens) the wood.  That is suited to belly (compression) wood, but not back (tension) wood.  

You can't remove/reverse set and/or string follow.  Once the wood fibers have compressed (i.e. manifested string follow/set) you can't undo that.  You can OFFSET it to a certain degree, but you're going to make some parts of the limb work even hard than they are now.  For example, let's say you reflexed or recurved the tips.  That would offset the effects of string follow, but youth will be asking the inner and middle third of the limb to do more work than they currently are.  You bow will thus show more deflex in this region, but may retain the reflex/recurve in the outer third.  The sum package may equate to LESS string follow, but you've further degraded the efficiency of the main working part of the limb.  

Another example would be to steam/heat some set back (reflex) in the inner limbs just outside of the fades.  Same story, different approach.

Here's my advice:  Finish out the bow as is, and then get yourself another stave.  If you want recurved tips or a deflex/reflex profile on that one, do it before hand.  

By the way, I still want to see some finished pictures of that board bow you've got laid out!  Seems to me you were the one that prompted that build-along!       Good luck.  Hope my answers help.

[Shaun]

I agree go ahead and finish this one. You can still flip the tips some and it will improve the performance. No heat on back, just belly if you want, but osage does not respond to this like hickory.

Next bow, put some backset in the stave after you get to floor tiller stage. 1 1/2 - 2" of backset induced with heat on a cull at the same time you straighten some of the whoop dee dooes. Then when you loose the couple inches during tillering, you will end up straight. You cannot add backset once the bow has started to bend much - it will come right back out.

Flip the tips at little, finish tillering to draw length and post report and pics. Keep up the good work!

[Stiks-n-Strings]

4est: I did prompt the board bow thing didn't I. I haven't gave it up just got to making this osage and fell in love with it. I will get the board bow done soon and post pics as I go, I promise.
 
Shaun: I am going to work on it tomarrow and post some more pics. What I have planned is to flip the tips and sinew back it with some diamond back accent backing. Been doing alot of reading on self bows and pondering before my next move but I am ready for my next move so...
 More to come!
Kris

[George Tsoukalas]

Sticks, I missed way back how you were fiddling around with the layout. You can't do that. Always draw  a line down the middle that follows the lateral or vertical grain.
 http://georgeandjoni.home.comcast.net/~georgeandjoni/layout.html
If show pics of where you are we can give you our $ 0.01 worth.    Jawge

[Stiks-n-Strings]

I was just looking at string tracking George. I did not even think about what you are taliking about though so I am glad you pointed it out. I don't think I violated the vertical grain. I was going after a snakey character bow when I started this one cause it has some snake in it and a real nice knot.
When I took it down in width I split it and cleaned her up with a rasp. I hope done it right, If not oh well I am learning a pot load and am well on my I hope.
 you guys have been invaluable here and I appreciate it.
 Kris

[George Tsoukalas]

I know that you were trying to improve string tracking but you can't do that at the expense of the lateral grain. Well you can if you want but you shouldn't. LOL. Measure the same one each side of that line that follows the grain and that is how you get your width. To improve string tracking leave the handle wide and nocks wide and then adjust tracking that way. I can explain further if you are interested.  Jawge

[Stiks-n-Strings]

George I am interested in what you are talking about, I think I understand what you are saying but more detail would be great.

 I do have some bad news though... I was working on recurving the tips and she cracked from belly to back the whole width of the limb. Oh well on to the next one LOL.
 All is not lost though I only lost about 3.5 inches off the tip so I am going to cut the other end and make a youth bow out of it.      
 
 I will go round up another stave in a week or so and get started on it      
 Dano you were right about the learning alot.
 My wife said she would have thrown it through a window, LOL I'm just looking at all I have learned and taking it to the next one with a big grin.  
Can't wait to get started on the next one but I got a board bow I'm gonna build that I have been putting off during this endeavor so I think I'll get after that first. I definetly ain't given up. I will have an osage stick to hunt with that I built for next season. Good thing I got plenty of time LOL
Kris

[Stiks-n-Strings]

I got to thinkin....
When I cut the other tip off it will leave me a 54" stave. I'm thinking bend in the handle bow at about 45-50# at 28". Is this doable or do I just go with kids bow idea?

[George Tsoukalas]

You'd be able to draw it 25 in anyway, Sticks. Before I explain how to track the string for a little bit with out heat do you understand the concept of following the vertical or lateral grain? I'm not sure that you do so let's back up and check that out. Jawge

[Stiks-n-Strings]

From what I gather from your site George I need to follow the grain down the center of the lay out for the bow, Is this right?

 As far as being able to draw it 25" I think I;ll just make a youth bow nad call it good. It wil lgive me an opportunity to work on my tillering skills.
Kris

[Stiks-n-Strings]

TTT