First attempt at a longbow coming up (completed)

[VAFarmer]

Mornin' all,

So I have sourced a few good staves of white oak locally, and at the best of prices(free if I remove them all together).  

I have seen that white oak can make a decent bow that will take a little set.

I draw at 29, and can shoot up to 60 lbs well.  

As far as what type of bow, I know I want to try to make a longbow.   Seems like I can shoot these well.

But I need a recommendation as far as what should produce decent results---selfbow or something laminated/backed.

If I back it with linen/paper/fiberglass--What is the best way to apply the backing? Some type of epoxy?
I plan on using titebond to glue, but that is only if I need to laminate.

I am trying to use the search as much as possible, please bear with me if I ask redundant questions.

God bless,

Farmer

[walkabout]

have you read sam harpers site yet? its called poorfolkbows.com. he has a great build along of a red oak board bow that shows the basics. most of my board bows are from 1x2's, so 1 1/2" wide, then tapering from about 12 inches from the tip down to 1/2" at the nocks. for backings i suggest Titebond3, which is waterproof after it dries. you could also check out 4EST's build along of a pyramid bow from red oak, it may actually be better suited for the white oak as its overbuilt and might help keep the set down. heres a link to it   http://tradgang.com/noncgi/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=125;t=002064

[John Scifres]

Selfbow, 70" long, 4" handle, 2" fades, 2" wide at the fades tapering to 1/2" nocks

[4est trekker]

Yep.  Right on , John.            Or, if you're so inclined, you could allow the bow to bend through the handle, even if just slightly.  You could then safely shorten the bow  2-3 inches and narrow it to about 1 1/4-1 1/2 to start with. This type of bow is also easy for new bowyers to tiller as the profile will more resemble the true arc of a circle.  I would suggest a simple silk, rawhide, or linen backing applied with TBIII.  Do a search in that regards...plenty of threads on backings and how to do them.

[VAFarmer]

K,

Thanks for the advice.   I agree, Sam Hapers is a very good build along, and that is the one I have been planning to use.

What is best to glue tips on?  
My specific item would be deer antler, a very large shed rack that I came across last year.  


I am planning on cutting these out of the antler, but should I use expoy instead of tbIII?

Thank again for the responses so far.

God bless ya'll,

Farmer

PS,I have read thru many posts here that say do not back red oak with fiberglass, but Sam's tutorial indicates that he does (with drywall tape) which was what I was planning to use.

What is the concensus of you guys that have responded, better to back or not?
 
I feel like a draw weight of 60 is just setting up for certain failure, so maybe 50 at 29 is more reasonable.

Would I still want to keep the bow at around 70, or can I cut down to around 68 for this?  I am only 5'10 and do hunt a stand every now and then.
Any length I can loose will help, but I dont want to sacrifice length for strength/durability of limbs.

Once you tiller to your draw weight-length, how easy is it to "re-tiller" and go shorter with the bow.
Nothing under 66, mind you.

Thanks again

[John Scifres]

I wouldn't back it.

50# is good.

Draw length dictates bow length.  Not weight.

Here's how Tim Baker described it a long time ago, at least the way I remember it.

Each piece of wood has a thickness that minimizes set at a certain bend as determined by draw length and bow length.  If you know that thickness, you can adjust the width of the limbs to get to a certain weight.  

Since we don't really know that, we have to guess based on experience.  I know that the whitewood bows I have made for a 28" draw took less set if I made them 68" or more (with a rigid handle).

If you want 50# instead of 60#, you could make it narrower but I would not go shorter.

[walkabout]

drywall tape really isnt the same as the fiberglass cloth that people say not to back oak with, theyre refering to fiberglass cloth for auto body repair. ive had luck using tb3 with antler overlays, just be sure to get the overlays sanded nice and flat to ensure good gluing surface. also dont clamp them so tight that all the glue is squeezed out. i just use some big spring clamps and it works fine.

[Jason Scott]

I built from sams build and used the dw tape. It makes for a durable bow. If you have minimal grain runout then maybe don't back it but if the grain is not perf then do it. That is not the kind of fiberglass they are advising not to use.

[VAFarmer]

Well,

Not having much time to complete this bow like I thought---but,

Purchased a bandsaw, and some sanding drums for my drill press---what a difference some good ole power tools make!!

I finally got the bow down to a shape that it is starting to "look like a bow"
In fact, tonight I will only be spending a few minutes with the bow to glue on the riser, then will be building my tillering stick.

I am hoping to get this bows length to 66.   I have left the limbs a little wide.

With Red Oak, (sorry guys, know that I said white in orig post)  should I shoot for a higher draw weight than I desire to be shooting?

I shoot 60 lbs.....but I have a feeling like the wood wont hold up to this.
I would be happy with 50, I guess, so should I tiller for 55 @29 and then after maybe 100-200 shots it will sit around 50?

Man I really got luck with this board--nice and straight grain---looks really nice.   I will post pics eventually of the finished product (if it is successful   )

I think I have officially caught the bug--I am already planning bows for the wife and kids, and I haven't even successfully finished the first one.

Anyway, any thoughts on tiller over a few pounds?

will Red oak go to 50-60 pounds?

God bless you,

Farmer

[John Scifres]

I would not make a red oak bow less than 70" for a 29" draw.  I would make it 2" wide for either a 55# or a 60# bow.  I would not make a red oak board bow heavier than 60#.

[VAFarmer]

Well,

It has been completed for some time now, just neglected to update.

It looks very basic......
I will try to post pics, I just havent taken pics yet...........

The string nocks set at 64" inches
This way I could use the string from my "montana" as a test string.
Wrapped a handle of hemp type twine, and just shoot off of my hand.
I just finished it with Minwax, so it has a nice deep color, and the grain is nice looking.
I am proud that I could make my first one and that it was shorter than I was expecting to have to make it.
It looks very much like a Fred Bear recurve, not shape wise, but with the finish, and black painted on the back.   I followed Sam's build along for this, and it was almost too easy to follow along.   He has a good talent for description.

What I learned...........hmmm........well the obvious!!
I now understand how to lay out, and tiller the bow.   I quickly learned what is meant by so many about having an "eye" for what looks right.

The only disappointment that was in this project was ..........
That I tillered to around 52 lbs....but after sanding, and about 2 inches of string follow or "set" I am now shooting around 47 lbs, which is NOT what I was aiming for.
Was hoping for 50, and think that I would have achieved if I had not overlooked that sanding out file marks would reduce the mass as much as it seemed to.

All in all, I am happy, but am already planning a new one to try and achieve 50lbs or above.

Could I modify this one some how?   Perhaps remove my glue/drywall tape backing and then add a strip of something to get my weight back up, then retiller?   I know this may be more work than just building another....but I REALLY would like to hunt this year with the bow that I made.

I have hunted once with this one, but didnt see anything.   Maybe just as well.

Sorry so long on the update.

God bless ya'll,

Farmer

[John Scifres]

Cool!  47# will shoot through a deer.  You could make another board bow faster than trying to bring up the weight on this one.

[hova]

couldnt he just pike it , and call it a day? that would get him to 52ish when its all said and done , and hed still be at 62"...


-hov