Poly in a can...help please

[fujimo]

So I have been using wipe on min wax for a while, but it always seems to have a funny, kinda sticky finish, and will rub off yellow on the bow hand if it gets wet in the rain. So after reading here I bought a can of min wax poly, satin, and it was labeled fast drying. Not much variety here, there were only about six cans on the shelf.

Thought I was following the instructions, but it seems to come out kinda rough, almost as if the liquid is in too big a droplet, not atomizing properly, is that what you call orange peel.?

So what am I doing wrong?
It doesn't look too bad, and gives a very Matt finish, which is a good thing, but I know it's just not right.

[timbermoose]

i've had the same problem, thought i wasn't shacking it enough. had my 7yr old shake it for 15 minutes and came out the same. i started sanding with 400 grit between coats and 0000 steel wool very lightly after about 5 coats. comes out nice and satin. i can still see it with a mag glass but none my friends see the "orange peel look i see, that i look hard for.

[talkingcabbage]

I'll only use the spray can poly, just because it's easiest to work with.  Here's what I do.  I always try to seal the wood first.  This helps with the "fuzzies" you're getting.  I use an oil finish, about 3-6 coats, depending on how much the soaks into the wood.  I'll typically use a 220 or 320 in between coats 2,4,etc.  Then let that oil finish cure for 4-7 days.  There's no adhesion problems as long as that oil finish is cured well.  Then hit it with a 320 or 400 grit to smooth it out and scuff it up a bit, then 3-5 coats of the spray poly, using 0000 steel wool after every coat.  I've noticed doing it this way that the oil really helps bring out the color and grain of the woods nicely, and the poly gives it that nice hard finish.  Oh, and after the last coat of poly dries for at least 24-36 hours, I very lightly hit it with 0000 steel wool then coat the whole bow in 1-2 coats of paste wax.  That stuff really finishes it out nice and gives it a good protective coat.

As far as your splattering, get some denatured alcohol or laquer thinner on a rag and make sure the spray tip is clean.  If you get any boogers on there it'll splatter.  I've personally never had a problem, but I'm sure it can happen.  Maybe you got one with a bad tip?

[talkingcabbage]

Oh, I should mention; if your wood is real oily to begin with, like cocobolo for example, you'll need to seal it for sure.  Just putting poly over it without sealing that oily wood will keep it from curing and it'll be gummy forever.  Some guys use CA glue but that stuff burns my eyes too badly, and I feel the oil finish just enhances the color and grain so much better.  Not to mention I don't have to worry about gluing all my fingers together at once.  

[fujimo]

I have about 10 coats of im wax wipe on with steel wool buffing in between . Then I applied the poly after buffing again.
Like TM said, it is subtle, but I know it's there!

[John Scifres]

What is the temp. and relative humidity.  Minwax will do that if it is less than 70 where you are spraying.

When it's cold, I leave the can and bow inside in the heat and then spray a coat very quickly in my unheated garage.  Then get it back inside quickly.

[fujimo]

Aye, I think that be the problem.
Will bring it into the house to warm up.
Thanks

[Jon in North Idaho]

Sounds to me like you might be coating too thick, or possibly holding the can too close.  Either way, it might be that you're coating too thick.

I have done "many miles" of spray painting and finishing.  When doing my bows, I usually only need 3 to 4 coats -- it's best to build up the coats gradually, rather than in one pass - each coat might be 2 or 3 very light sprays.

Satin poly in a spray can does have a tendency to have an orange peel look.  One thing that helps is to start off with a gloss and then do the final coat in satin.  Gloss is also a harder finish, so the base coat will be a little tougher.

[fujimo]

thanks Jon.
i have been only doing one pass with the spray- not too slow either- as the last thing i want, is for it too run.
i will try the gloss first next time- with bow and can a little warmer.
i am usually about 9" to a foot away.
and did only put on about 4 coats.
although in the sunlight this morning- it doesnt look too bad- really fine"orange peel" effect- and i dont mind it for my personal bow- well all my bows are personal bows- but always try to do things right, and i was obviously doing something wrong.
thanks for all the help and insight.

[red hill]

Timbermoose, you guys don't have child labor laws up there? LOL!

[fujimo]

[Zradix]

I haven't had the "yellow on your hands after it rains" problem with wipe on poly (minwax brand).

I did notice the first coat  took a loooong time to harden on osage the last time I used it but it was 85˚ with about 80% humidity too. I've learned you need to wait for that 1st coat to completely harden before you do another coat. otherwise you're going to fight drying issues for a week.

Personally I like to use wipe on gloss for a couple coats.
Then switch to the wipe on satin.
Then I like to use the spray satin from a foot away or so the spray is starting to "roll" by the time it hits the bow.
Gives you a very matte finish as you mentioned with a little grip as well...I happen to prefer that.
That final coat does wear off after lots of shooting ( maybe a season) in the grip area but it's easy to redo.

I have tried to get a nice smooth even coat with only the spray.... no luck. It seems too thick...doesn't want to spread/even out.

The only way I've found to get a pretty smooth coat from the spray is to spray it JUST to the point where it almost wants to run. Of course it's a fine line to walk and easy to overspray one area and get a run.

[fujimo]

gotcha- i probably have been putting on second coats of the wipe on too soon!!
it probably wasnt dry properly when i took it out the next day!
thanks

[Todd Cook]

Definitely make sure the area is warm enough(70+). Also warm up the can before you spray. This time of year I spray in the shop with the heater on , but quickly bring the bow in the house to dry. The lower humidity and air circulation inside really helps.

Also, on woods that are oily( and that's a lot of the exotics), sealing them with CA, shellac, ect. will help dry times .

[Crittergetter]

I picked up a can of fast dry Polly the other day at the hardware store and the label said to stir the can and never shake! But I cannot for the life of me remember what brand it was! Idk, food for thought!

[Crittergetter]

So why can u shake a spray can type Polly but not a wipe on polly?

[Zradix]

I've always shook the wipe-on.
Especially the satin in order to get the "satinizers" well distributed.
I've had zero problems with the bubbles staying in the finish.
Normally shake the heck out of it, pour some in a little cup, submerge a piece of bounty paper towel in it ( about a 4x4" folded over itself), squeeze out the extreme excess and start wiping.

Works for me and I'm pretty picky.

[John Scifres]

Spray finishes are atomized so bubbles aren't an issue.

Brush on will retain some of the tiny air bubbles.

Wipe on doesn't have the same issue as brush on.