Reducing sap wood?

[twitchstick]

I have a western red cedar stave I was thinking of reducing the sap wood but I'm not sure if I should. I had planned on sinew backing it. It has 1"+ of sap wood which wouldn't leave much or even any heart wood. I'm new to working with a stave so I'm not sure what to do?

[PEARL DRUMS]

Rasp it down evenly to about 1/4" thick max. Don't worry about growth rings because you wont be able to see them. Make it even and smooth, then add your sinew.

[Pat B]

WRC is pretty light wood. I've only seen one bow made from it and it was long and wide. Sinew might make it more suitable for a bow but go slowly with the tillering.

[twitchstick]

thanks

[twitchstick]

Pat if WRC is a light wood and might be tough to get a bow out of it. Would I be better to save my sinew for a better stave?

[LittleBen]

In my opinion absolutely yes. Save the sinew for a better stave. Mill the WRC and build a strip plank canoe or a deck or something.

Western red cedar is not typically considered bow wood.

Granted you could probably make a bow from willow if you wanted, but even with the best craftsmanship it would probably be garbage.

I'd look for some juniper, or really any hardwood over WRC

[Pat B]

Yes Jimmy, wait for a better stave, better bow wood. Like Ben said juniper works very well with sinew backing.
 You can make pretty good arrows from WRC. They'll be a bit light physically though.

[fujimo]

have you got a pic of the stave- just to make sure.
youre thinking of eastern red cedar?
 the sapwood on WRC is not that clearly discernible. there is no clear line like many other woods have!
 but the fellows are absolutely correct- WRC is not really bow wood- good  for siding, shakes  and decks etc    

[Mad Max]

Guy's
What is the difference in Juniper, ERC and WRC

I have a good bit of cedar On my place, lot's of limbs on them

Mississippi would be ERC ?

[fujimo]

well western red cedar only grows up here in the pacific north west- i believe- i think juniper and erc are considered the same thing- i dunno- open to correction here- wait for one of the experts to chime in.
wrc is extremely soft almost like balsa wood. with its oils- it has a significant rot resistance- and is used for shake and shingle and decking.

[LittleBen]

Originally posted by Mark Daniel:
Guy's
What is the difference in Juniper, ERC and WRC

I have a good bit of cedar On my place, lot's of limbs on them

Mississippi would be ERC ?

Western red cedar is a cedar, and grows in the west. Enough said.

Junipers are a genus of trees which include a large number of species growing all over the place.
Eastern Red Cedar is a species of juniper (juniperus virginiana) which grows all throughout the eastern states    Wikipedia Map of ERC distribution  .

As far as I know most of not all juniper is pretty elastic in compression and will make a nice bow. I've built a few of ERC and it's probably just about as elastic as yew in compression, but is probably only 75% as dense as yew at best, it also isn't very strong in tension. It's best when backed with something like sinew, although hard backings have been successfully used, like maple or hickory or bamboo or w/e your fancy is. Selfbows are definately possible too, but they really need to be wider and longer and really well executed.

The biggest problem I've had with ERC is that finding a respectable stave is like trying to find the lost city of Atlantis. But they do exist. I saw a set of billets that canopyboy had that were extremely straight, zero twist, zero knots, absolutely perfect. I've been searching for years and haven't found one I can cut that is nearly that good. The biggest killer is the knots honestly ... Or maybe the ruthless twist many trees have. But usable staves are out there.

[fujimo]

there you have it    
somebody who actually knows!

[Bison Bows]

Juniper/WRC will make a great bow if it is sinew backed. A mixture of sap wood and heart wood is preferred. Juniper is not very good in tension but better in compression than osage. If you put on the right amount of sinew it will have great tension and compression and make a great light in the hand bow. Work it slow.......

[fujimo]

juniper/ ERC mate!
western red cedar is a different beast altogether    
cheers
wayne

[canopyboy]

Originally posted by LittleBen:
I saw a set of billets that canopyboy had that were extremely straight, zero twist, zero knots, absolutely perfect.

Dang, I've forgotten about those stored up under the bench. I still have the sinew you gave me to go with 'em Ben. I better get on that! (My bow to-do list is almost as long as my honey-do list these days...)

[Bison Bows]

My mistake fujimo.....I knew I was talking about WRC instead of ERC but just turned 70 this month so I'll use that as an excuse :-)

[fujimo]

 
its cool- with all these acronyms nowadays- it can get very confusing- my 13 year old daughter's texts look like some second world war code!!