Riser glue up

[kenboonejr]

OK its me again with more questions.  I really do appreciate all the great advice you guys provide.  So on that Bingham's Take Down I am working on.  Today I glued up the riser.  So what I had to start with was a coreflex/superaction riser block.  Then I had two light colored hardwood riser accent strips and 2 black phenolic strips.  I had a real nice piece of what I think is cocobolo left over from something awhile back.  I cut a piece of that to about 1/2" thick.

So the order was half of original riser block, black phonetic strip, light colored hardwood strip,  1/2" thick cocobolo (I think) , then the reverse, light colored hardwood, lack phenolic and then the other half of original riser block.  So 7 pieces.  I basically glued them up just like I did with the limbs with the smooth on and wrapped them in plastic wrap and applied the clamps and then threw it in the heat box.   So that is where it is now. 

But this is what I am pondering on.  When I started applying the clamps, things got squirrelly and it was really hard to keep things aligned.  Then I started wondering if the better way to do this was to maybe do half of this at a time and then once both halves are dry, then glue the two halves together kind of thing.  I know it would have taken longer but just wondering if that would have been easier.  Then I wasn't sure if you go throw already glued pieces back in the oven when you glued them together.

Just wondering what yall think about this.  Did I do it right, or is there a better way?

Thanks,

[Flem]

Here I go again, ad nauseam. I can hear the groans already.
But since you asked, yes there is a better way. Put it in a bag and suck the air out. Squeezes from all directions, which will keep even the oddest assortment of pieces in place.

[kenboonejr]

Dude that is brilliant idea!  That is awesome.  Thank you for sharing that.

[Flem]

My pleasure, but be careful, these guys might crucify you for encouraging me

[kenboonejr]

My pleasure, but be careful, these guys might crucify you for encouraging me

Ha - its all fun and games until someone gets hurt!

[Mad Max]

You can C clamp the main blocks laying down on a work bench on top of wax paper, trap the stripe pieces from going left and right, clamp it all together Horizonal with 3 C clamps.
After about a 30min. to 1 hour you can take the C clamps holding it to the work bench OFF and then move it to the oven.

[Shredd]

Dude that is brilliant idea!  That is awesome.  Thank you for sharing that.

   See Flem...  Somebody likes your Idea...   

   I like it Too....   

[Crooked Stic]

You can drill and dowell the pieces in a part you cut off. Also can side clamp to keep pieces lined up.

[Jeff Freeman]

Yep you can pin them in a place that will be hidden or cut off, I use toothpicks but that might be short for a recurve. Since I only glue up longbow risers. Yes you can clamp from the sides also. Or just clamp it up on a flat surface top to bottom or whatever it is to hold the two together with the other pieces in between. Push it down tighten it up a little bit more throw it in the oven. You have plenty of time before the glue starts to kick so tight and slowly and go from there. JF

[Flem]

Ken, if you weren't already a Hoser (or a Clampet) I would recommend becoming a BagMan. Looks like it's too late though. You could easily squeeze a recurve. This is a test I did a while back. Its 4ea 3/16" Maple slats, overlapped in the center for a total thickness of 3/4". The vacuum was set at 12hg, which is low. I can pull 25hg at my elevation, 29@ sea level. The only reason the tips are not flush with the form is because I did not pull the excess bag out of the way during draw-down.

[mmattockx]

You can C clamp the main blocks laying down on a work bench on top of wax paper, trap the stripe pieces from going left and right, clamp it all together Horizonal with 3 C clamps.
After about a 30min. to 1 hour you can take the C clamps holding it to the work bench OFF and then move it to the oven.

This is how I glue multi-layer blocks, works fine. Vacuum is also very good and versatile, but you have to be set up for it.


Mark

[kenboonejr]

Ken, if you weren't already a Hoser (or a Clampet) I would recommend becoming a BagMan. Looks like it's too late though. You could easily squeeze a recurve. This is a test I did a while back. Its 4ea 3/16" Maple slats, overlapped in the center for a total thickness of 3/4". The vacuum was set at 12hg, which is low. I can pull 25hg at my elevation, 29@ sea level. The only reason the tips are not flush with the form is because I did not pull the excess bag out of the way during draw-down.

So I didn't know this was a method to use until you posted this.  I did the hose method on this one.  What kind of vacuum do you use?  What kind of setup does that take.  I guess you need special bags with adapters and then you suck the air out to a certain pressure and then seal it off and let it set?  I find that very interesting.

[Flem]

I did a show and tell a couple years back. Hopefully the link works

http://www.tradgang.com/tgsmf/index.php?topic=167130.msg2858472#msg2858472

Just checked, it works!

[kenboonejr]

I did a show and tell a couple years back. Hopefully the link works

http://www.tradgang.com/tgsmf/index.php?topic=167130.msg2858472#msg2858472

Just checked, it works!

Thanks Flem.  That is really cool.  I think that is a little beyond me at this point though.  It does seem to make the glue up process easier though.

[kenboonejr]

So I basically did what a bunch of you guys were saying and used my clamps to get all squared up as much as possible.  The problem is that I didn't have any clamps long enough to clamp the riser together but short enough to fit the whole thing in my heat box.   But I got it in there and the lid just kind of draped over the ends of the clamps that were about 6" sticking up out of the box, so there was no such thing as a seal on the lid for the heat box.  I ended up draping some old towels over it and let it go for about 5 hours - knowing it wasn't getting up to the 150 degree mark.  Then I shut it off and killed the AC in my workshop and let it sit for another 16 hours or so until I got home from work today.  Workshop was probably around 85 degrees.   When I pulled it out today, of course big glue chunks running down all the seems.  I used 40 grit on a belt sander on it to get it close then, took it to the joiner and it ended up cleaning up real good.  I am happy with it so far.  Here is a pic of it.  The limbs I haven't cleaned up yet, and although the pic makes them look like they are different shapes, they really aren't its just that there are some big epoxy boogers making it sit crooked.

Thanks again everyone for all the advice and help.

[flyonline]

Another quick and easy option for a vacuum system is to use a food saver type with the endless rolls they sell. They pull about 12" of vacuum if I remember rightly, and we use ours for a whole heap of other stuff as well.

I've done a few boo backed board bows in it, and so far they've all held up fine 

[Crooked Stic]

Your risers will be fine without heat unless you are in a hurry to get them done. In 80 degree weather just set them out in direct sun clamped.

[Flem]

Any progress Ken?

[kenboonejr]

Any progress Ken?

Yep.. The riser ended up gluing up nicely.  Then work got in the way   However, last night I was able to take the 40grit sandpaper and was able to clean up all the epoxy on the limbs.  I was really worried that would be difficult but it was not a big deal.  The 40 grit on the belt sander took it right off.  Took about 30 mins to get both limbs cleaned up.  Then I went ahead and traced out the templates for the basic riser dimensions and the template for the limbs and then cut those out.  I am hoping to get the riser to the correct size with the 21 degree angles cut today, the holes drilled, and the limbs cut to size today.  That is my plan anyway so we will see.  I am feeling more confident that I can pull this off now though