Making knifes from old files???

[Jeremy]

I've been carrying a knife my father made for me out of a file every season since I started hunting deer.  It still gets the job done    

Files can make very good knives, but like knives made from any other type of steel, it's only as good as the heat treatment.  If you don't want to mess around with annealing it (softening it) and then hardening and tempering after you're done working it, I'd recommend throwing it in a toaster oven at 400 degrees for an hour or so to draw the temper out a little and then as Dan said above, go S-L-O-W.  This will make it easier to work and a whole lot less brittle than the file is to begin with.

Grind barehanded and keep a bucket of water close by just in case the steel starts to get too warm.  Notice I didn't say too hot     When you get it close to shape and the bevels done pretty well switch to files and smoot everything out.

[Jeremy]

Scratch that!  Ignore everything everyone has said!  Files are junk!  Send 'em to me and I'll dispose of 'em for ya!  

[String Cutter]

Alrighty then what size file should I use to make a skinner? Would Like it to have a nice little round belly and maybe a gut hook?... Think the biggest I got is a 10 inch Nicholas Bastart file... Could I heat it up with  the blowtorch and thin it out on an anvil I have on my work bench??

[Jim now in Kentucky]

String Cutter,

If you heat it and forge it, first GRIND OFF THE TEETH. Otherwise, you'll drive the teeth into the body of the file and make a weak discontinuous surface.

Further, pretty much all old files, and as far as I know new ones, are made of high carbon steel. If you have a wood stove, just toss the blade in with the wood (to one side of the pile, not on top) and leave it til morning. Done that lots of times with great results for springs and blades.

After that treatmen, you can rough it out with a hack saw.

[OconeeDan]

Jim, tossing the file in the wood stove...
Does that soften it up for easier "working"?
After that, do you need to retemper it, or use it as is?
Dan

[String Cutter]

Does heating up cherry red then putting it in water or oil harden it of sofen it??? How about Heating it up red and letting it cool over night???.... Can I sofen it up to work then make it real hard again before I put an edge on it??? How would I go about doing that????? I'm sure there's alot of guys here that would like to know how it all works.

[robtattoo]

Take a looky   HERE  

Ths should explain really simply, how to go about dealing with your steel. This is actually for 01 toolsteel, but the same temperatures etc.... work fine for old files too.

The only bit you'll really need (forget all the metallurgy stuff) is 2/3 of the way down the page, 'Guide to Hardening and Tempering O-1 Tool Steel'

[Dick in Seattle]

At the risk of branching out here, I'm wondering about surgical scissors as a metal source.   I happen to have quite a lot of them.  If you anneal them by any of the means described above and then grind carefully, would the steel be good, bad or indifferent for a knife?

Another question, because you all have gotten me interested, would someone recommend a couple of good basic, "Knife Making for Dummies" type books that are in print.   Getting some books is always my first step...

[LAR43]

Before you guys put a lot of work into files, because some of the newer ones are case hardened (lesser quality steel) & aren't good for blades, I'd recommend heating  the tang to non magnetic & quenching it in room temp water.
Then put on a pair of safety glasses & gloves, put the file in a vise, tang up, & hit it smartly with a hammer. . . If the tang snaps off, or shatters like glass, the file's a good one for making a blade. If it bends, or just cracks,or takes more than one sharp rap to break, it's too soft & most likely won't be hardenable enough for a blade. When you quench a blade, you want that hummer to be as hard as it can be. Then you'll draw the hardness back during the tempering process.

JMO . . (based on making blades from files)

Dick,
If the scissors are stainless, they may have to be cryogenically hardened. Some types of stainless require entirely different hardening techniques, yet other types, (martensitic) are hardenable by using the standard tool steel methods.
The $50. Knife Shop by Wayne Goddard is probably the most down to earth, getting started making good knives on the cheap, book out there today. It's mostly about forging blades, but there's enough about tools,heat treating, stock removal (filing/grinding) info in it to make it worthwhile for any beginning knife maker.

Larry

[Ringneck]

Dick, those scissors are more than likely stainless and the heat treatment of that steel is a whole nother animal.

[Dick in Seattle]

thanks, guys.... so much for the scissors.   I took me off to Barnes & Noble for lunch and came back with Goddard's book and one by Barney and Loveless.    Lots of good info.   I honestly don't know how much I want to get into actually working with the forging and tempering of metal, though I'd like to at least give it a try.   I do remember having a lot of fun working with blades to make knives.  I know I have a box of blades downstairs... but do you think I can find them... Hah!  

I always start with the books, but the best way I learn is by watching and doing.  I'll ask around next shoot I go to and see if I can't locate someone locally who'd be willing to get me started and keep me on the straight and narrow.