earn a buck ?

[Firstarrow]

Great post trashwood!
too bad the score books are based on horns, not how wiley a doe is.

Show me a doe that successfully raises young six years running, it will be the hardest critter to kill in the woods imo!

Personally I would rather see a kid with a bow in his hands ventilating does. Than a bad bow tie with a doe it it's grill.

In our state MORE deer are killed by automobile than by hunters.

[Jeff Strubberg]

You can get the doe population in check by giving doe tags for free.

Not around here.  For whatever reason, teh general population thinks it's "unmanly" to shoot does.  A friend and I went to one of the local processing plants the third day of rifle season last year to see what processing a couple deer for a local food pantry would cost us.  While we were there, the owner offered to show us the take for the weekend.  He had a reefer trailer pulled in behind the building with 71 deer hanging in it.  64 of them were bucks.  Eight were what I would call shooters.

Many of our counties have unlimited doe tags for five bucks a toss.  They don't sell worth a dang.

[xtrema312]

This management stuff is complex with all the different areas.  You can’t make everyone happy.  Earn a buck would work great for me.  I know some people on properties with limited deer or state land would not like it.  Trophy hunters will not like it;  I say if you don’t shoot a deer to eat it first of all then I don’t feel too bad for you, but I don’t condemn you for why you hunt either.

Here in southern Michigan we have over the counter private land doe permits.  Two a day now over the counter this year.  I hunt four counties and it has been a very long time since I couldn’t just go get a permit about any time of the season.  They have been trying to get the deer count down.  I don't see that big a problem with the count, and I don’t see as many deer as I used to 20 years ago.   I guess that is just me.  

So you don’t like earn a buck?  Well maybe you should do what Michigan has done.  We have a late antlerless season, which along with a muzzle loader season all running about non stop after gun season, apparently has done nothing but keep the deer nocturnal all through late archery season with few shot or at least so few we have had to do other things.  We now have any weapon youth and private land antlerless season before bow season to try and cut the numbers.  A good part of the two weeks before archery season you have guns in the woods including shoot anything youth hunt.  I am all for the youth, but my neighbors kids gunning all the best summer pattern bucks down before archer season is a little hard to take sometimes.  If you want to kill the does how about a youth doe hunt?  No it is much better to have them kill all the bucks.  

This year we have X-bows so we can get more people in the woods and shoot all these deer.  Now the people who are too weak, too busy and just done care to pull a bow and practice can hunt archery season.  I guess getting gun hunters who don’t shoot the does now into archer season will fix the overpopulation problem.  Ya right.  I think an earn a buck would be a much better option to all that.

[Jason R. Wesbrock]

Originally posted by Gottabow:
It is all about money.  The same Does tags that were $2 last year are $12 this year.  The DNR are not that concerened with Buck/Doe ratios as much as Deer/Car crash ratios..It(DNR) has become more politically motivated than anything else.

Friday afternoon I bought my NR tags for deer and turkey. Herd Reduction Zone (HRZ) antlerless tags are still $2. If yours are now $12, your zone must have changed out of HRZ.

On another note about giving away free doe tags...

WI's CWD zone started in 2002. Hunters can get up to four free tags per day, and I think the only reason they limit it to four is to keep some anti from walking in and taking the entire box. The CWD zone has been unlimited earn-a-buck (can kill as many bucks as you have killed does) every year with the exception of one. I think it was two years ago they dropped EAB and went to unlimited either sex: shoot whatever you like; free tags. If memory serves, hunters in the CWD zone killed fewer antlerless deer as a percentage that season than in any previous year under EAB. The very next season, EAB was back in the CWD zone.

I’m not supporting or opposing EAB, nor criticizing WI’s deer management. That would be improper of me as a nonresident. Rather, I’m just trying to share information on this topic, for what it’s worth.

[Wary Buck]

Let's face it, in many parts of the country we are still fighting the old stigma that shooting a doe is a blow to your manhood.  For many, it's a macho thing.

In Nebraska, I still remember our old Big Game Manager telling me (late 80's/early 90's) they'd never be able to sell antlerless (doe) permits.  Well, that was one of many wrongheaded things he said over the years.  Nebraska now offers thousands and thousands of antlerless tags per season.  I will say though that getting people to shoot does required (and is requiring) a lot of education.

And in some cases, the public darn near has to be forced to kill does by making that the only deer they can kill on certain permits (thus allowing the macho hunter to "save face").  In NE, almost every tag is good for one either-sex and one antlerless deer.  I would guess that Earn-A-Buck would be a similar effort to force hunters to help trim populations (when optional programs in place before did not achieve that).

I personally probably would not like it, but only because I've had some fair success on nice bucks early and wouldn't want to bugger things up killing a doe.  Plus, almost every season I kill more does than bucks anyway, (last year 2b and 5d) so I'm doing my part.

I know I've already gone way over my two cents, but I'll add one more thing.  If I were a landowner farmer, every one of the hunters I let on my land would either kill more does than bucks or it would be his/her last season on the property.

[onewhohasfun]

Well said Extrema. I think its hard for people outside of Michigan to understand how rediculous some of the policies we have in place here really are. Buck doe ratios here are so out of wack it isn't funny. I've hunted other states and beleive me the grass really is greener.

[Gottabow]

Like I said before..I'm not against shooting Does..I've shot plenty.  What this earn a buck has done is promote the shooting of everything..it is antlerless not Doe only.  In effect it is the killing of anything without antlers..Does,Doe fawns and Buck fawns.  People will shoot whatever they need to get the sticker for ther buck.  Its very distructive here and has nothing to do with Buck Doe ratios.  In Wisconsin anything with less than 3" horns is considered antlerless.  I'm for a balanced Deer herd but it promotes a if its brown its down mentality.  Its very frustrating.

[buckeye_hunter]

It is a good idea to reduce the deer herd by ensuring the shooting of does first, but it could have a drawback.

What if a hunter has the theory of "I will shoot any deer that gives me a good shot", but then has to pass a number of bucks because of earn-a-buck. He/she may subsequently never even take a deer which did NOT help the overall goal of reducing the herd.

How many hunters do not get to fill their tag with this theory and actually hurt management?

I know this mentality is exactly what the previous post argued against, but what is wrong with wanting to fill a freezer with any deer that offers a shot. You can't eat antlers and I'm not a trophy hunter. I want the venison. Period.

Just a thought,
Charlie

[Cyclic-Rivers]

I hunt WI. every Year. My family has property in the south west part of the state where there is herd reduction not herd eradication although it might as well be.  I have hunted there every year since I was 12. I am now 30!

Our Deer management unit was the first to initiate the "earn a buck" program. It was hated immediately by hunters however we shot some very nice bucks in subsequent years.  They have continued with the earn a buck program and I have only met a handful of hunters that had to pass on the "buck of a life time" because they were not able to kill a doe yet.

There are few doe road kills laying around these areas. people pick them up for "insurance" although this practice quickly has become illegal.  In our area the bucks  out numbered the does and as a result we do not kill many deer.  Most of the deer we see are basket rack bucks 6-8 pts.

This is because the does have been hit so hard by hunters.  

I think earn a buck is a great program that if used right would be a great management tool.  The problem in Wisconsin is the DNR severely underestimated Deer populations. This year in many areas they are returning to Buck only tags because they have realized their poor censuses of the past. I think they need to administer a set amount of tags which are first come first served and allow a healthy # of harvests.

For the last 4 or five years we could have shot every single deer we saw and had a tag for it.  In fact last year we were allowed 4 deer a day.  Irresponsible management and hunting practices have lead to a deer decimation.  Not much different than our banking and lending industry.  The blame is not only with the DNR but also hunters that shoot because they can. (Irresponsible lending and borrowing) which has created an unsustainable system now leading to a crash. We have found many hunters shoot first and then see if they can legally tag it. Unfortunately we have found many small bucks shot and left to lay. Most likely because of poor identification.

Last year the kill was way down. I talked with 3 registration stations who were down by almost 40% in deer registrations.  Every single friend I talked with said their groups did not see many deer.  3 groups ended up not taking any.

I know practices by the WI DNR will never be accepted by all but lately it seems as though their practices have been more budget building rather than responsible herd management. It is frustrating but I think they are getting the picture due to results of their selfishness.

Hopefully they will return to a sustainable system.  

I also hope if anyone is still reading this, they do not get discouraged about hunting WI. Our group of 7 saw 5 bucks that were in the 140 class. 2 were shot!  I saw 7 deer in 4 days of hunting and shot a wounded nub buck.  There are deer there, including some nice bucks. 3 deer were on public property.  It is still a great place to hunt if you keep in mind hunting is hunting, there are no guarantees.

Charlie

[Cyclic-Rivers]

Oh yeah, sorry

Just a beef.  My family and I have been letting little ones go for several years. After they opened the season to as many as you want, either sex our neighbor shot 11 bucks 10 of which he was getting head mounts for.  He is a taxidermist, I guess he can do it cost effectively and probably sees some nice bucks. But goes to show you the irresponsibility of hunters.  Who in their right mind can eat 11 deer?

-Charlie

[Arwin]

I would like to see earn a buck here in Michigan for the combo license. I think it would work great for those who want their 2nd buck tag, which is restricted to 4 points on one side.  That way you can take a buck of any size and then a doe, then chase the big boys!! Good balance there.
 I beleive it would give more accurate harvest stats. Right now our DNR is guessing based on a few hunters who provide them some info.

[tarponnut]

Earn a buck makes sense in a Gun season but since archers have such a small impact on the deer population overall, I don't agree with it.

Personally, I'm just as happy to shoot a doe.
If we are truly concerned about controlling the population we should be shooting does AND fawns(since slightly more than half will be does).
Just my opinion.

[buckeye_hunter]

Not me.....I just want 2. That should get me through the year.

-Charlie