archers paradow/cock feather in

[grayfeather]

I read that it was ok to have the cock feather in and I seem to shoot better that way.When I shoot cock feather out I seem to shoot to the left a little.Also what if I was shooting with 4 feathers ? I thought I would try that and see. Or should I keep shooting cock feather out until I get it right?

[njloco]

I was told that if I shoot carbon arrows, it's cock feather in, so your on the right track if your shooting carbons.

[jamesh76]

Imo it does not matter what type of arrow you shoot. Cock feather in/out is just a preference.

But you will see the majority of people shoot cock feather out.

[Night Wing]

It is a preference thing. My arrows hit in the same place I'm looking whether the cock feather is in or out. I prefer "out" since I like the way it looks on my bow when my arrow is nocked.

[Cyclic-Rivers]

shoot whatever way works best for you. There's no "wrong" way with fletching orientation.  

Unless of course you are looking at the tip of the arrow  

[TDHunter]

I've always got the best flight with cock feather in.

[Lee Robinson .]

I like to have my feathers oriented in such a way that one of the feathers runs through the corner between the sight window and arrow rest where there is the most clearance...and then with a 3 fletch the other two feathers don't touch the bow at all. This arrangement will allow for the most forgiving arrow.

[TxAg]

I've started shooting my cock feather in.  

I saw Fred Eichler doing it and then he explained why. Made sense so I tried it. My arrows still shoot accurately, but I don't get any feather/rest wear like I previously was.

[grayfeather]

thank,s I seem to shoot better cock feather in, and I was wondering if with the archers paradox  the feathers touch the shelf anyway,also if bow weight and draw length effect feathers touching the shelf.

[Javi]

Check out this video before you draw any conclusions..  http://www.youtube.com/user/wernerbeiter?blend=10&ob=5#p/u/0/wGNslUNBrEM

[Lee Robinson .]

Olympic class archer or not...I would say that arrow in that video is underspined. I suspect they set that up on purpose for illustration purposes.

Here is another video where they do something like that...shooting an EXTREMELY underspined arrow at 2:07 and 2:17 into the video you can actually see the arrow break as it flexed.

   

That said, all arrows will flex/paradox to some degree. Too weak and they flex too much for good flight. With many bows cut closer to center, we improve the bow's forgiveness to paradox...but I do believe it is best to have a slight amount of directed paradox in order to maintain consistency from shot to shot...so personally I don't seek to obtain true center shot. I will cut past center, but I do not wish to cut the sight window so far in as to obtain a true center shot arrow.

Ultimately, the more areas we can add forgiveness, the more stable our equipment will be. This is why I not only fletch my arrows to get one to run through the corner, but I also go as far as to use two separate pieces of rest material...one on the shelf and one on the sight window...with about an 1/8" between the two for feather/quil. Is it necessary to do this? Absolutely not. Does it add forgiveness to the bow to do so, I believe so otherwise I wouldn't do it.

[Javi]

I’ve participated in several of the high speed camera experiments here in the states, studying arrow reactions and the reaction in the Beiter video is fairly normal of the small diameter barreled carbon aluminum shafts.
 
As for the second video, it clearly shows much the same reaction with the fletching clearing the rest even though he is severely plucking (perhaps on purpose) and yes he does shoot a seriously underspined arrow in the last two scenes note his wrapped hand (he planned it).
 
The tests in which I’ve participated show the most forgiving shot occurs when the fletching clears the rest (shelf) on the shot, however the shafts nodes can have a great effect on this in addition to the spine as is often seen when shooting shafts with extreme over hang.

[beetlebailey1977]

I will shoot cock in most of the time.  Less wear on the feathers and the rest, and my arrow flys just as well.

[RUTANDSTRUT]

an arrow flexes downward also with many archers due to release and grip pressure.  i have found that the inside fletch (mainly the quill) with a "normal" cock feather out orientation causes fletch contact on the outside of my rest.  i shoot cock feather up (12 o'clock) to get complete fletch clearance with my shooting style.  fyi my shooting style consists of a lazy bottom finger shooting split and a high elbow with 25% foc which causes a lot of downward flex in my tuned shafts but im very accurate out to 40 yards so i'm not going to change my style.

[ron w]

I have seen many videos of the arrow at the shot. In most cases the arrow never makes contact with the bow or the rest unless it is over or under spined. If cock feather works for you go for it!.I have shot plastic vanes from the self with no problem,raise your nock a bit and cock feather in!

[Lee Robinson .]

Just for the record, the reason I showed that video was because I don't believe a properly spined arrow flexes nearly as much...and it is clear that one is extremely underspined as it not only resulted in a failure, but as mentioned...the archer anticipated it happening which is why his hand is covered.

I have seen some other videos of more appropriately spined arrows but I can't seem to find them at the moment. While they all will flex some, a properly spined arrow won't flex near that much. I think Black Widow produced one such video, but I don't have it on hand.

The arrow doesn't spin from helical fletching until AFTER it clears the string...and even then it would take a few feet for the air resistance on the "propeller" of a helical fletch to take effect. For this reason, I fletch arrows so the feathers are arranged at...

For right handed shooters... 12:30 / 4:30 / *8:30

and

For left handed shooters... 11:30 / *3:30 / 7:30

The * being the cock feather, which would be cock feather out. Let's remind ourselves what "cock" feather actually means? Does it only mean a feather that is a different color? If that is the case, then of course it would not matter which one was the ODD color. What does matter, at least in my opinion and experience, is the feathers orientation to the bow (more specifically the arrow rest). I want to maximize clearance and stability...and the fletch (even with a low profile quil and soft feather) does stick up higher than the shaft, so I like it to have a troth "fletching channel" to run through as it clears the bow. I feel this puts me in as good a position as possible without sacrificing anything.

[njloco]

I love reading this technical stuff of something that from the outside looks so simple. Keep it coming guys, I feel like a sponge, just soaking it in.

Thanks

[grayfeather]

thank,s for all the info,now I,m not sure what to do   ,I think now that the best idea is to have the 2 inside feathers have the least amount of contact with the shelf, cock feather at 8:30 is what i am trying now.thank,s for all the help ! the videos were great

[Mike Vines]

I would say what ever way works best for you.  If it flies straight, shoot it.

[Montanawidower]

I shoot Lee's set up... Just a hair north of 4,8,12 o'clock (cock feather out).  For me its not about shelf clearance as much as it is  about a secondary anchor.  A shields cut cock feather (at 4:30ish) just touchs the corner of my mouth when I reach my anchor.  I'm shooting three under  and use a jaw/knuckle anchor.  It works a bit like Ricky Welch's "feather to his nose" advice.  Maybe its mental, but I shoot much better with two anchors rather than one.
Oh and while shaving... three blades is better than two.