Advantage of a longer working limb?

[Easykeeper]

What is the advantage of a longer working limb length?

I'm browsing through the Black Widow catalog I just got and it shows a comparison of three 60" bows, a PCH, PSA, and PMA.  It explains that the difference between the three is the length of the risers and working limb length.  It goes on to say:

"The advantage of the shorter riser is that you can shoot a longer working limb with the same length of bow."

Following that it says there is minimal performance difference between the any of the 60" bows since the limb design is the same.

So what is the advantage of a longer working limb?

[Ben Maher]

I feel they are just smoother to draw , less pinch on the fingers and as such just more forgiving . I am a long fulcrum kinda guy though and have never met a short bow that I could shoot as well as a longer bow .
But that is just me and probably as much a mental thing as anything else .

[owlbait]

My buddy used to build a short riser bow with longer working limbs. Made the bow more efficient and performed better than bows of similar length but shorter working limbs. The limbs provide the cast/performance, longer limbs= more cast/performance. His bows were sold in the Black Widow catalog also.

[Sixby]

There is no particular advantage to a longer working length because it would be relative to what? If a bowyer is building three limb lengths and they all perform the same that is just strange to say the least. What would be the point? The shorter working limb would be lighter, have more preload , better stability because of that . The longer limb would work less overall, be less efficient and have less stability or a deeper brace height and loss of speed due to less string time.
My opinion,. is this. That the well designed limb will be the best compromise to get all the best attributes at a given draw weight and length. To go shorter working area than that or longer working area than that is simply poor designing.

God bless you all, Steve

[owlbait]

Apparently, his limbs were very well designed.

[Kip]

I know nothing about building limbs or bows.I have shot Bob Lee Bows since about 2000.They were all smooth and mostly 58" recurve.I bought a used 60" longbow and loved it and later tried a short riser with 56" recurve limbs.I found a set of 60" at 50lbs.on this site longbow limbs to put on the short riser and they are the best limbs I have ever used seems my draw is perfect and shooting better(need a lot of that)and very smooth.They would be 64" on std. riser.Not sure if it is the length but I love them just something about them that  feels sooooo good.Killed the bear in my avatar with them.My .02  Kip

[Easykeeper]

Sounds like it's really more of a feel to the longer limbs that BW is saying is an advantage.  Can I assume then that a longer working limb would stack less as you approach the long end of it's intended draw range?

[Steelhead]

"Sounds like its really more of the feel to the longer limbs that BW is saying"I think that is essentially correct.You mentioned stack.The longer limb is gonna be less prone to stacking as early in a shorter risered and longer limbed bow like the PCH as draw length increases.

I think it allows you to get away with a shorter bow and still have a smooth draw.That could be an advantage when hunting in tight quarters like smaller ground blinds or knarly trees or stalking/still hunting though thicker cover.

The PCH will have a tad less mass weight as well with the smaller riser.I kinda like that.Its still rock solid to me and dead in the hand.It Has a shorter sight window as well than the PSA and MA.Some will not prefer for the shorter sight window and to some its a none issue.


The longer working limb on a PCH that was 60 inches was very nice to draw for me.I have a solid 30 inch draw and feel the extra limb made for a smoother feeling draw and the bow shot very nice and fit me very well.I cant say that for many 60 inch 3 PC TD bows.Thier are others 60 inch 3 PC. bows that do work very well though.The PCH as as comfortable as most any for me.The Morrison Cheyenne A riser and D limbs especially with foam are really smooth for me as well in a 60 inch TD.The heavy deflex and short riser on the Cheyenne make for a nice draw and overall smooth shooting recurve.So its a similar concept as Widows PCH.

I felt the PCH was a smoother feeling bow for me with my draw length than a 60 inch MA or 60 inch PSA with thier longer risers and shorter limbs.The PCH just felt nice and comfortable at the back end of the draw cycle.I prefer 62 inches in the PSA.

[stagetek]

Shorter riser, longer limbs, a smoother pulling bow. Longer riser, shorter limbs, harder pulling, perhaps faster (?). Thats what I've always been told. I'm sure there's all kinds of variations and opinions. I draw to 31", so longer limbs have always worked well for me.

[wingnut]

Here is a link to testing done by Blacky on Black Widow limbs a couple of years ago.

 http://tradgang.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=074069

The longer working limb was the best performer.

Mike

[Night Wing]

If given the choice between two 66" recurve bows (of the same bow model) and one has a 19" riser with 23.5" limbs and the other has a 21" riser with 22.5" limbs, I'll take the recurve with the 19" riser and 23.5" limbs every time.

[Sixby]

I would think that the force draw curve would be more important than the actual limb length. But hey . I could be wrong.

If I draw 29 inches and have two identical bows, one with 22 inch limbs and one with 23 and they both are same poundage being drawn to 29 inches and both have identical force draw curves to 29 inche and one starts stacking at 30 inches and the other at 31 inches then what gain do I get by haveing a longer limb?
God bless you all, Steve

[Deadsmple]

the advantage is in leverage

[Bjorn]

Sixby you are a riot!!      

[Sixby]

BJorn, Yep , I know that sir. I resemble that remark
What is the advantage of a longer limb?

Advantage Bowyer. LOL Its kinda like having a plus of minus of a thousand instead of a hundred.

God bless you all, Steve

[**DONOTDELETE**]

  "The advantage of the shorter riser is that you can shoot a longer working limb with the same length of bow."  

a longer working limb can typically draw further without stacking. For some that would be considered advantageous.


 

  Following that it says there is minimal performance difference between the any of the 60" bows since the limb design is the same.  

if you have 3 - 60" bows with 3 different limb lengths and riser lengths with the same pad angle. The only way you are going to get minimal performance difference is if you have 3 different guys with different draw lengths shooting them.

[Sixby]

Question. What advantage do I get with a longer limb if I draw 28 inches and the limb does not stack at 28 inche with a shorter limb?
I say that the longer limb is overkill and extra weight to move which in fact impedes performance and adds nothing to the force draw curve.
Someone said the longer limb is smoother to draw.
This is not the case if the bow does not stack at my draw length.

There is an advantage to a generic draw bow . A bow with longer limbs than necessary to the owners draw length.
This advantage is that when he gets tired of his tired , slow bow, He can sell it to someone with a longer draw and not worry about it stacking.
That is the only real advantage Ican see.

Since most people do not sell their really good bows then this is not really a huge advantage to most people.

God bless you all, Steve

[gregg dudley]

The difference between my SAIII and PMAII bows that matters most to me is the larger site window afforded by the larger riser.  There is not a differece in draw or performance that I can discern.