Land Management.

[rascal]

I currently lease ( no Im not happy to be leasing but its better than fighting over public property) approximately 500 acres in Davis county Iowa and Im trying to decide how best to manage this parcel. Davis county seems to consistently place in the top twenty counties for B & C bucks harvested in IA and I have personally seen some real toads (positively would make book) on this property, about 3 of them a year by my count.  The property has been in CRP for a number of years, cant really say for sure how many at this point but Im gonna guess 5-10 at least.  It is surrounded by crop fields (usual fare in IA corn and soy beans) and has a small river running through the property.  Fair ammount of timber including mast producing mixed with over grown field and river bottom.  The wooded areas and swamp / bottoms are made up of some larger tracts as well as some narrow corridors jutting into or splitting the fields.

I have been hunting the property for 3 years now and obviously without my manipulation it is pretty dog gone good.  I think it gets used as a safe zone for deer now that the trespassing has been curbed.  Im getting pretty familiar with the bedding areas and escape zones on the property and plan to maintain some areas as safe zones with no hunting at all.  To my knowledge the only modifications year to year are the trails along the field edges that the owner mows down with the brush hog.  The area is still considered way over populated with deer and has a liberal doe tag quota.

I moved here from rural Michigan about 4 years ago so its a big change for me and my perceptions might be a little off.  Im seeing what I deem to be pretty good buck to doe ratios, the bucks respond to rattling and grunts which indicates some competition for hot does.  Wont find that where I came from thats for sure.  Then there is the obvious antler size issue I need to address.

My immediate goals are to make sure to remove just a few more does (who am I to argue with the IA DNR), establish safe zones with ZERO hunting pressure, and decide on some sort of antler size restriction.

Ive informed the only other regular on the property that starting next season it will be a trad bow only property during archery season, giving it a year since he doesnt really have time to take up a new weapon this year.  Im still trying to figure out a good way to make an antler restriction that will work in the field, I dont want bucks under 3 1/2 years taken.  Perhaps 8 point with 18 inch spread would cover it with a small fine imposed on anyone who messes up (obvious exceptions made for the kids doing it for the first time).  

Its my lease so I get to / have to make all the rules up which is good and bad I suppose.  I know what I wont tolerate and thats all black and white for me, I may have to write all this down on paper for others.  Im a stickler for tracking wounded game for example and I cant abide by greed when hunting.

I only really have one issue with this property at all and thats the fact that the owner has a group  (4 people I think) from the south that come up every year for a few days to archery hunt. He made it clear that was part of deal when I leased it so not much I can do about it right now.  Im gonna try to renegotiate that part as I would rather pay more for complete rights than have them come up.  Something is fishy with that anyhow in my opinion, strange how they manage to draw permits every year although I have an idea of whats going on.


Anyone else here manage a leased or owned piece of property for hunting?  What sort of rules and regulations have you found helpful?  Anyone in Iowa care to chime in on what a 3 1/2 year old buck should be wearing for head gear so I can decide on my antler restriction?

[Onestringer]

Hey I lived in MI too and had a lease there, now I live in MO and guess what I have a lease here.  I am like you I hate paying it, but at least my treestand will always be there when I show up.  In both cases it was my lease, and I made the rules.  In MI it was archery only for deer, and there was a buck rule of 8 pt or better.  Here in MO, there is a little gun hunting (my brother in law and my wife)  The main thing bucks need in order to grow big racks is age.  I would try and up the age to 4.5 years instead of 3.5.  In IA there is a big jump between those years.  

In MO I had the same experience, the first year the landowner had a "friend" hunt also.  The second year I paid a little more and got the exclusive.  In your case a call to the DNR might take care of your problem.

The main thing in managing in a lease is to make sure all the members are on the same page.  In MI I shared the cost in MO I pay it all, so it is totally mine.  I do have a couple of friends hunt, heck I gave them all keys I don't care, but they are very responsible.

[rascal]

Scott Im probably in agreement with the 4.5 years old age class theory you have, Im not arsed to kill anymore small to average bucks personally.  Problem is how do I put that to a tangible rule for field judging a buck here in IA?  Whats a representative 3.5 or 4.5 year old buck?  Its gonna be a tough one for me, these deer are just different from what Im used to looking at for most of my hunting career.

My brother is the other hunter who will be a regular on this property and he has already offered to split the cost of the lease, I would just rather have the control.  Its not a trust issue really it is about avoiding any possibility of a disagreement.  One boss one set of rules period.

[oneshot1]

Point rule's are proven to destroy the herd health long term. Plant good feed, declare war on coyote's, and keep doe number's in check. Good luck from another land leaser.

[rascal]

David I think the herd is in good health right now, the point rule isnt going to change much of the way we hunt currently, just gonna let the little guys walk till they are mature.  Ive personally followed an 8 point rule for the last several seasons, many of those in an area where the bucks just werent as big as Im seeing here.  The other people hunting on the property are about the same just want to make it clear and real that we arent shooting the little guys, does fill freezers just as well.  With the hunting pressure on nearby lands I dont think using this rule on one parcel is gonna upset the apple cart.

[BOFF]

Well, I'm not familiar with your herd, but making it an 8 point or better on our land is going to kill a lot of 2 1/2 and some 1 1/2 year old deer, who would have had great potential for trophy deer. I also must add that a lot of "mature" deer are not going to have enough points by your rules to be taken.

May I suggest in teaching your people who   you have hunt on your land, what a mature deer looks like. Yes, I know it may be difficult, and takes time and experience and it is easier to do the points, but, if you really want to grow trophy deer, the points will kill you.

To a certain degree though, if your neighbors are shooting what ever is walking, your trophy management may be of little use. Have you talked with the neighbors and what their plans are for deer harvest?

What management do you want? I wrote "trophy" but you may not want that for your management. To me , a "trophy" deer is a mature deer.

[BOFF]

Not familiar with Iowa. What are the seasons like, and how do the seasons affect the deer herds?

[Onestringer]

I agree with everyone in regarding the 8 pt rule.  I should have made my self more clear.  The 8 pt was a mature 8 point.  Not a 1.5 year old buck.  Also, if there was a mature 6 point, or a small framed mature buck, it was a shooter.  I agree just an 8 pt rule will put alot of 2.5 year olds at risk.  

I do agree, if you want to make the rules, you must write the check.  Sharing cost will lead to sharing management decisons.  

Boff, has a great point, If your neighbors are shooting every buck they see, your management efforts will be limited.  

Scott

[rascal]

I may have given the wrong impression when I said I wanted to make some sort of point rule, for me its not neccesarily about cultivating a TROPHY herd.  I know there are plenty of trophy deer in the area and thats a plus. Im pretty sure I cant control what some of the neighbors are gonna do after meeting some of them in past seasons.  I dont really think that my efforts alone are gonna improve the overall health of the herd or antler size in this area is the bottom line.

I did spend some time measuring some past racks and I have some very good examples of what I think are gonna be racks I would consider worth taking.  I have a nice long tined 8 point from IA that only measures 14.5 across, very little mass, very nice symmetry, would have made a real toad had he been left.  Ive got a heavy 7 point from Michigan that measures 16 inches across that also would have made a real bruiser had I let him walk.  Now I have a pair of 9 point racks that would meet the 8 point 16 inch spread (both Michigan bucks taken by my wife) and the difference in mass and overall size is profound.  Ill post some pictures of the examples of not quite close enough and what I call good.

I guess Im just drawing a line in the sand here, Im holding myself to a higher standard and expect the same of others who want to hunt my lease.  There are only about 4 of us on the property for the most part, the occasional guest isnt out of the question.  We wont be impacting the herd enough to make a difference its just a choice not to hand out a death sentence for the crime of having antlers.

[rascal]

Here are some pictures to give an idea of what Im trying to accomplish with a point/spread rule.

This is an Iowa 8 point with a 14.5 inch spread.

 

Here is a Michigan 7 point with a 16 inch spread.

 

Now Im not ashamed of these deer by any means they are both respectable, Ive just had my fill of them.  They are what I call "Not quite up to standard".

Here is a Michigan 9 point with a 16.5 inch spread.

   

Here is a Michigan 9 point with a 16 inch spread.

 

Both of these deer show nice mass and antler developement, its an obvious difference between them. These are takers in my book even if they dont qualify for B & C / P & Y book.  I really wouldnt know since I havent had any of them measured but you can get a general idea of what Im trying to do.

In the way of giving credit the two 9 points are my wifes deer, I havent been so lucky.  Sevens and eights have been the normal take for me and its time I held myself to better standards.