Arrow cast/limb length

[BCR1985]

Hi everyone!

This is a topic that I'm sure everyone has an opinion on, but I was a reading a book by Sam Fadala about limb length and its effect on arrow cast and wanted to see what some of your opinions/experiences were? His opinion was that modern components/materials have significantly limited the effect of limb lengths on overall shooting performance for modern bows. I've been contemplating picking up another recurve for some time now and have narrowed it down between 2 similar styles- one 58in and one 62 in. Draw weight would not exceed 40 pounds. I draw between 27 and 28 on avg. Does anyone feel that with those specs in mind one would perform better than the other? BTW I did speak with someone at tech support from three rivers and was told that the shorter bow would provide greater cast.

[damascusdave]

If the only thing you are interested in is arrow velocity it surely appears the shorter bow is the better performer

DDave

[BCR1985]

Dave,

Velocity certainly plays an important role in a hunting bow, but I'm also concerned with the potential for stacking. I was always under the impression that longer limbed bows were smoother and more forgiving, but lost out in the velocity department when compared to a shorter limb design. However that was before I read Fadala's book: he argues that modern archery components have nullified this concept.

[Bjorn]

I am told the longer limb will store more energy. It does depend on the design somewhat but the longer bow wins all else being equal. The longer bow will generally be smoother and less finger pinch. At least that has been my experience.  

[Stumpkiller]

All kind of fun factors here.  I have a 66" 40# recurve I draw to 30" and has limbs like noodles but it puts my arrows in little bunches (a Wing Presentation II).  I also have a 58" 41# Wing bow (a Red Wing Hunter) that, when drawn to 30", puts a lot more juice onto the same arrows.  Groups are larger, however.  

IMHO the longer the recurve the less sensitive it is to release faults.  My favorite hunting recurve is 52#@28" and 62" AMO (a Browning Explorer) that has a nice feel on the fingers and puts a 640 gr. arrow out at what I perceive to be good speed.  Haven't chronographed it but it is neither noticably faster or slower than modern recurves I shoot among.  Currently I'm shooting a 47# Red Wing Hunter (58") that seems about equivalent in "cast" to the 52#@62" Explorer . . . but they are about as different as two one-piece recurves can be.  The Hunter weighs about half what the Explorer does.  

They're both great hunting tools - I just happen to shoot the Explorer better so far.  But that keeps me working on the Hunter because I'm motivated to get better by learning to use it better; if you know what I mean.

Your results may vary.

"Cast" is often a vague term.  It refers to how far a bow can propel an arrow.  The modern equivalent is speed: as in if two bows loose the same arrow the one leaving the string at a faster pace will go further.

[Kris]

I think your perimeters are a bit vague (no disrespect intended).  You sort of have to know whether you want a "shorter" bow (58") or a "longer" bow (64").  Shoot both and compare if at all possible.

In simply talking about velocity (i.e. cast), I could imagine one exceeding the other either way, there are many variables to this equation.  

I don't think many guys on this forum would select one bow over another based on perceived cast differences alone.  There are many qualities to consider when choosing a particular bow.

   

         

 

"modern components/materials have significantly limited the effect of limb lengths on overall shooting performance for modern bows."

Hmmmm...The word "limited" doesn't make sense to me?  Without reading the whole article I could be misinterpreting this sentence.  What article is this that Sam F. wrote, I'd like to read it?

Regards -

Kris

[Will Cocke 2]

Two bows exact same design exact same poundage,  The shorter lighter limb would go forward faster than the longer heavier limb.  Hard to argue with physics.

[Kris]

BCR1985 said "two similar styles" not exact styles.  Not knowing what these bows are, in theory a 64" bow could have the same working length limb as the 58", or it could be foam cored, or etc.  

I agree, hard to argue with physics.

Kris

[damascusdave]

When you mention stacking then that has some significance for me since my draw length is 30 to 31 inches...my shortest bow is a 58 inch reflex/deflex longbow that only gains 3 pounds per inch past 28 inches...on the other hand that bow is not all that fast (nor is it designed to be)...the worst bow I own for stacking is a 63.5 inch mild reflex/deflex longbow...stack is not often a factor for those with a draw length of 28 inches or less

DDave

[BCR1985]

Thanks to all of you for so much great insight!  I realize I oversimplified my points and will elaborate further when I get the chance. For the sake of this discussion, the similar bow styles are the Damon Howatt Mamba  at 58 in vs the Hunter at 62 in. Both at 40 lbs. I'd love to hear what y'all think with this discussion of performance in mind! Thanks again!
Ed

[Stumpkiller]

I'm a Damon-Howatt/Martin Hunter fan.  The Mamba and I don't see eye-to-eye.  With your 27" to 28" draw length it won't be a problem.  I tried one that was practically being given away at a pro shop years ago and it halted at 29".  That was a 55# bow; and they are nice bows and I'd have grabbed it up if I could have managed it.

The Hunter is a classic and a great recurve.

[Fastltz]

Also remember just because a bow is longer amo the limbs may not be much longer. Best way to try all this would be with a bow that you can change risers and limbs. Maybe an ilf bow. Lot of combos there to try. Is 17" riser xl limbs vs 19" rise l limbs same amount but diff limb length. Could be a lot of fun.

[Sixby]

My thoughts are along these lines (much simplified)

long bow , long riser, short efficient limbs.you get the best of all worlds. Howatt Hunter all the way.
I would put the Monterrays, Catalinas, Hunters , up against most bows made today in all around performance. That is why I have used their bows as models , in theory, for my designs.
God bless, Steve

[BCR1985]

I have to agree with what you guys are saying. There's something about that Hunter that I really  do find appealing. Probably more to do with riser design than anything else. I've owned and sold a Savannah which was a great shooting bow at 62 inches. I'm just nervous about ordering one without giving it a test drive first. Still I'll probably end up biting the bullet one of these days. If anyone runs across the Hunter at about #40 please let me know! It's funny to watch my bow collection drop in poundage the better I get and the more I learn!

[dhermon85]

E*** has a 40#er right now