Does Black Widow t/d geometry equate to shorter draw length?

[insttech1]

On all the 'curves that I've had over the last two years, I've had to get at least 31" arrows to clear broadheads and judos to the riser.

I sometimes "overdraw" about .5" until I anchor, (very solid anchor--NO snapshooting!!), so I eventually started cutting my arrows to 31.5" just so I wouldn't "tick" the riser with the broadhead.

Now with a new Widow, I find that I have easily 1.5" of arrow hanging off the front of the riser at full draw.

I know that doesn't have any bearing on tuning, etc...etc...and I don't use my arrow tip to aim with.

I just wonder if anyone else noticed this when switching to a Widow?  It's a 64" PMAII.

Thanks Much!
Marc

[Orion]

Marc:  Your draw length really shouldn't change by more than a quarter inch or so, which could be caused by variability in thickness of the grip at the throat of the bow.  Did you perhaps go to a heavier bow?  More weight will often shorten a draw.

[Kelly]

Also age has a tendency to shorten ones draw. The deflex shape of riser right by the arrow shelf could change it slightly but no more than 1/4-1/2".

Have you always shot 64" bows in the past? If not and they were shorter then string angle could have something to do with your shooting style in that you use the string in relation to your face as a draw check. With shorter bows that have more string angle you have to draw farther to get it close to face, whereas the BW with rear mounted limbs produces lower string angles to begin with and then longer lengths make it less acute.

Or for some reason you are tipping/tilting your head forward at full draw, now.

[wtpops]

no change for me. I draw about 30 to 30.5 cut arrows to 31 to 32 depending tunning

[insttech1]

OK thanks all!
Actually, I went down a hair in weight.
And I'm used to 62 or 63" bows.

I think part of it is perception from my viewing angle, since the shelf is radiused so heavily toward the front of the riser...since it drops away so quickly, it looks like more arrow is sticking out the front.

Take Care,
Marc

[Blackhawk]

I too was considering the rear mounted limbs, but I also thought the longer brace height (usually 8.5" or more) may have an affect.   :confused:

[A.S.]

Measure from the throat of your grip...should be the same on just about all bows. Most are 1 3/4" from the throat to the front of the riser. I did notice on Silvertips, that they are about 2" to the front of the riser. This doesn't affect your d.l., just the amount of arrow you have hanging over.

[Shawn Leonard]

I have to disagree on draw length on certain bows. It is measured from the back of the bow and certain designs do change your draw length measured from bow to bow, no it may be the same as far as arm position and hand postion(anchor) but it changes from bow to bow as far as an exact measurment. Try it sometimes, take a Widow TF or Shrew recurev, real forward handle and put a clothespin on your arrow and draw it to your anchor anfd measure, now do it wit a stright hill bow and measure, I bet it is about 3/4" or more different. Shawn

[insttech1]

Yeah Shawn I tried that on the Widow, but with a piece of paper with a hole in it.  I discovered that method doesn't work too well on a Widow with the way the contours of the shelf and the upper portion of the grip meet.

The handle is forward enough that the front of the grip is actually about 5/16" further forward than the end of the usable shelf.

So that accounts for some, and the severe radius accounts for the "perception" of the rest.  All you can see from the shooting position is a large chunk of arra' sticking forward after the "dropoff" of the shelf.

This picture on BW's website shows what I mean:
 http://ns1.bowsite.org/acb/showdetl.cfm?&DID=9&User_ID=1290575&st=4172&st2=75375430&st3=-61448583&CATID=1&Product_ID=1&count=1&Pcount=4&DETAIL=1

Take Care,
Marc

[insttech1]

Blackhawk,
I don't know how much brace contributes, but I certainly discovered with this 64" bow that I have a lot more string against my chest at anchor than I'm used to.

And I found out the hard way that this one does NOT like any brace below 9", which is recommended max.

My string settled a bit, and brace dropped to 8 3/4 without me noticing, and suddenly arra' flight was all crappy...

After trying to figure out what had happened, I looked at the brace, twisted it back up, and suddenly was back to shooting darts again...

My buddy thought I was being weird, until I had him shoot it in both conditions, and now he's thoroughly convinced (and we both draw a bit over 30", depending on the bow...)

Take Care,
Marc

[draco]

With that long of draw,how tall are you/

[insttech1]

I am 5' 8", but I shoot standing upright, with my head steady, like an Olympic style shooter.

I do cant the bow, but not severly.  I don't bend at the waist at all, and I do not tilt my head forward at all, either.

I do "overdraw" up to an extra half or 3/4" until I deep-seat my finger into the corner of my mouth, and settle my thumb against my cheek (hence needing an extra 1" of arrow so I don't tick the broadhead against the riser).

Take Care,
Marc