String making questions

[KevinK]

I think I'm starting to get the hang of string building. Now I am working on getting consistent lengths but I have a few more questions.
How many strands per pound of bow weight do you guys typically use? I am making 2 bundle strings and made a 14 strand, B55 for my 45# grizzly, is that adequate? 12 strand B55 for my wife's 40# Kmag (35# at her draw). Is there a guideline somewhere? I see differences everywhere I look.

For B55 or B50 what string length do you target knowing that it will stretch? Is 1/2" shorter than  your target with 25-30 twists a good target length?

How do you check to see if you have a bundle that might be sagging? I check after my loops are done before twisting but I've had a few that just don't look right after twisting. The ends look great but towards the center of the string the twists do not settle into each other and are cord-like looking , like a braid almost. Would this be a sign of bundle sag I didn't catch or does it just need to stretch more?

How do you guys stretch your strings? Just brace them on your bow overnight then serve them the next day?

What if you make one for a friend and you do not own a bow the same length as his? Or draw weight? How do you stretch this string and estimate where to put the serving on?

How do you check to see if you have a bundle that might be sagging? I check after my loops are done before twisting but I've had a few that just don't look right after twisting. The ends look great but towards the center of the string the twists do not settle into each other and are cord-like looking , like a braid almost. Would this be a sign of bundle sag I didn't catch or does it just need to stretch more?

Not a 100% sure here, but it sounds like you are not back-twisting your bundles before you twist the second end loop.

Don't know how to explain it, as it is the one element of string making that I just can't "get"! That is why I have a friend build my strings.

Bisch

[LBR]

"How many strands per pound of bow weight do you guys typically use? I am making 2 bundle strings and made a 14 strand, B55 for my 45# grizzly, is that adequate? 12 strand B55 for my wife's 40# Kmag (35# at her draw). Is there a guideline somewhere? I see differences everywhere I look."

Mostly personal preference.  Fewer strands will stretch a little more.  I like 12 strands for up to 50# or so.

"For B55 or B50 what string length do you target knowing that it will stretch? Is 1/2" shorter than your target with 25-30 twists a good target length?"

It's going to vary depending on how you make your string.  That one will have to come with practice.  At least 1/2", but  it will also vary some depending on the string length, draw weight, and strand count.


"How do you check to see if you have a bundle that might be sagging? I check after my loops are done before twisting but I've had a few that just don't look right after twisting. The ends look great but towards the center of the string the twists do not settle into each other and are cord-like looking , like a braid almost. Would this be a sign of bundle sag I didn't catch or does it just need to stretch more?"

Are you putting in back twist?  If not, that is the problem.  I check every few twists after starting the second loop.

"How do you guys stretch your strings?"

I built a stretcher, but there are lots of different ways to get it done.

"What if you make one for a friend and you do not own a bow the same length as his? Or draw weight? How do you stretch this string and estimate where to put the serving on?"

I use my stretching jig.  Measure to the center of the string, back up 3" towards the bottom loop, serve up 8" total.

There's a link to the FAQ section on my site that may help.  I also have a string making video if you are interested.  If you are ever in Northeast MS (not far from Tupelo), you are welcome to come by my shop.  We'll sit down and make some strings.

Chad

[SteveB]

Chad beat me to it but here is my reply anyway.

Sounds like maybe you are not getting any or enough back twists in after the 1st loop preparing for the 2nd.
After the 1st loop, you have twists in the body. You need to remove them and add several counter twists in before doing 2nd end. These will be removed as you twist in the 2nd loop so on completion your string bundles should be straight. Then when you twist it and burnish, the end result is one round bundle.

Chad has a great CD available showing the process.

[Jasper2]

Do yourself a favor and get Chad's video. It will save you a bunch of time and frustration.

[Westkyhunter]

I've been making my own b55 strings for a while now and have had no problems with them. On 35# and 38# bows I make them two bundle 8 strand. Around 45# bows I make them two bundle 10 strand and 50# I go with two bundle 12 strand. Then use what ever serving material I need to give me the nock fit I want, 62xs usually or brownells nylon i believe its called. Seems the arrows I shoot have nock throat sizes all over the chart so generally I use the same serving material and adjust my nocks with the boiling water method or squeezing them together a tad. I've also served in another section between my nock points to tighten up nock fit. I've gotten equal and satisfactory results either way. I twist my strings pretty tight myself anyway but always try to end up with at least 1/2"-1" shorter than what my actual string length calls for. After I make the first loop I take my time and make sure to easily undo any built up twist in the lower strands and make sure there's no "loose" strands in the string. When everything is laying right and straight I'll then back twist the two bundles 25 times making sure all stays nice and even pressure wise and no kinks. Then I continue to make the second loop.

[KevinK]

Thanks everyone makes sense.

[KevinK]

I looked into this re-reading the tutorials I used. I didn't put any back twists into it so it is where I have read elsewhere "cabling". Only one of the tutorials mentioned it but didn't go into detail. I might have to get your DVD Chad, I've heard good things about it. I normally don't like videos for my own personal reasons. I'm old-school and learn better by reading, trying it, messing it up, getting better, still messing it up until I get it right but I don't want to ruin a bow with a messed up string either.

[Gator1]

Do you pad the loops?

With Dacron.

[katman]

Originally posted by Jasper2:
Do yourself a favor and get Chad's video. It will save you a bunch of time and frustration.

x2, made the learning curve short.

[Gordon Jabben]

Chad, I had some of the same questions as Kevin, and you answered them.  Thanks

[macbow]

Maybe Chad knows the history on making these strings.
I learned about 35 years ago and was taught to straighten the string after the first loop. Never any mention of back twists. I still don't.
So is this something added more recently to make better strings?
I might add when I learned our jig was a broom stick.

[KevinK]

I straightened out the bundles after the first loop and did 26 back twists to each bundle. Made the bottom loop and it looked good except some of the individual strands of one color got stuck in the other bundle on 3 of the twists. This didn't happen on the 8 I did before this. I put the twisty ties back on, took out the twists, smoothed the bundles, re-twisted and looks good now. Is this just me not having enough tension before twisting the first time and common or does it sound like I goofed something else up?

[LBR]

Do you pad the loops?

With Dacron.  

I do.

 

I learned about 35 years ago and was taught to straighten the string after the first loop. Never any mention of back twists. I still don't.
So is this something added more recently to make better strings?

I learned about back-twist some 20 or so years ago.  No idea who came up with it.  What it boils down to is this:  When you make your first loop, as you mentioned you go back and take those twists out of the bundles.  When you make the second loop, you can't do that--so before you make the second loop, you put the twists in the bundles but in the opposite direction.  That way you remove them as you make the second loop, and ideally when you finish your bundles are hanging straight, making a nicer string.

[Greg Owen]

Here is a question from someone who has never made a string but plan to start soon.  I have watched some videos.  I understand the reason for the back-twists. Can a person count the number of twists needed to straighten the string out after the first loop and use that number of back-twists?  My gut feeling is no, but I had to ask.  I think the number of back-twists is just a trial and error thing.

[Roy from Pa]

Yes Greg, that's how I do it. I count the back twists it takes to make the bundle lay straight, then do that # more back twists .

[LBR]

Can a person count the number of twists needed to straighten the string out after the first loop and use that number of back-twists?

That's what I suggest doing.  It may not be perfect, but it should get you close.

[monterey]

Back twisting!!    

It never occurred to me to do that.  A simple and obvious solution to a problem.