tiller question

[rnharris]

is it possible to not be able to get the porpoise
ing out of a arrow shooting 3 under i have started even and worked up to over an inch and still have bad arrow flight then i'll shoot split and get perfect arrow flight.when i get up to an inch above center the bow gets noisey and slow thanks Ralph

bow 60"balistik 55@28" arrows 55-75 gtips 200 grs up front 30.5 " long

[deertraks]

I had the same problem. The only way I could get the noise to leave was to tie on another nock point below the arrow nock.

[Bird Dog]

Try placing the arrow above the nock rather than below and start at about three eights.

[rnharris]

it's noisey 3 under anyway it's get's worse the farther up i go at about an inch above center porpoise almost goes away but gets so noisey i want to move it down the crazy arrow flight is not noticable at 25 yds and under i bought this bow used and wonder if a tillered split bow is possible to not be able to tune 3 under thanks i don't understand putting the arrow over the nock?

[Bird Dog]

Most of my bows are tillered split and i shoot three under now. Never had a problem getting them to shoot. With three under I tend to pinch the nock between my glove and the nock point causing the arrow to behave erratically at times.
Placing the arrow above the nock point solved the problem.

[rnharris]

assuming the nock is tight enough right tp prevent arrow riding up the string thanks.

[Bird Dog]

You can tie on a second nock to stop the arrow from moving up the string. I use dental floss for that.

[Molson]

First, since the bow is used, you may want to call John Fazio and just make sure there isn't an actual problem with the tiller of the bow. That's a simple check and he'll be able to tell you over the phone.

Next, as the guys above mentioned, make sure it's not a nock pinch issue.

If there's no problem with those, it would seem like something you are doing is creating a "nock low" like condition.  I would add an eighth to quarter inch to the nock point that gave me perfect flight with split finger and leave it alone.  Then adjust the brace to see if it makes a difference.  If it doesn't, set it back to where you had perfect arrow flight with split finger and examine your form to determine what might be causing you to put excess pressure on the lower limb.

[rnharris]

thanks for the replies! the brace is 7.5" now i have had it as low as 7" and as high as 8" gonna try the nock pinch cures and repost tomorrow i am much more consistant 3 under at hunting distances 0 to 20 yds after that judging distance gets trickier maybe i am being to picky
but i want the best arrow flight i can get1

[aromakr]

Proper nock placement for either 3 under or split finger is dependent of several factors.
1. The tiller of the bow at brace height.
2. How you grip the bow, i.e. straight wrist as opposed to low wrist.
3.diameter of the arrow shaft if nocking under nock point.
You usually need more positive tiller for 3 under (3/16-1/4") If you heal the bow this will increase your positive tiller need as healing the bow will put more bend in the lower limb than a straight wrist will. Arrow diameter should be self-explanitory.
What you are trying to achieve is uniform bending of the limbs at FULL DRAW. As your fingers move up or down the string you change how the limbs bend causing one to bend more than the other, which causes porpousing. The same is true for hand placement on the grip.
Bob

[rnharris]

i am more high than heel i put most of the pressure in the web of my hand because the grip is narrow i wrap my fingers all the way around grip holding bow with two fingers basically is there a chance that the bow is tillered for split so much that i can not achieve good arrow flight.

[Molson]

Bob,

Maybe I'm reading what you're saying wrong, but don't you need less tiller (closer to even tiller) for three under or low wrist? Wouldn't more tiller increase load on the bottom limb due to the leverage caused by the increased string length?

[Bird Dog]

Most bows are tillered about one eighth inch for split though i've have had a couple that were closer to one quarter. If yours is tillered more than a quater inch you may have difficulty with tuning for three under.

[rnharris]

picture getting clearer i may never know for sure
how its tillered i shoot ok split just more pinpoint and more confident 3 under thanks.

[aromakr]

Molson:
I've seen threads on this and other forums stating what you said however more positive tiller on the upper limb is what is needed for 3 under. Think about it. When you place three fingers under you are moving your hand lower on the string which will cause the lower limb to bend more, to compinsate for that you need more tiller or bend in the upper limb. Again what you are trying to achieve is uniformly bent limbs at FULL DRAW. And a low wrist will also cause more bending of the lower limb not less. This is very easy to check, find someone that has a really light bow have someone that can handle the bow easily and draw it to full draw, while at full draw go from high wrist ot low wrist and look at what happens to the curvature of the limbs, you will see the lower limb bending more and the upper bending less.

rnharris:
Its easy to check the tiller, using a ruler or tape measure, measure the distance from the fadeouts to the string at brace height. A positive tiller bow will have the upper limb distance greater than the lower. Most split finger tillers are 1/8"+, more will be needed for 3 under or your nock point will have to be much higher to achieve good arrow flight, by moving the nock point up you cause the upper limb to bend more than the lower does, which is what more tiller does. Its all about uniformity of limb bend at full draw and nothing else.When the string is released you want uniform thrust from both limbs on the arrow.
Bob

[rnharris]

am i splitting hairs with this tiller thing does it really make that much difference?