new guy question

[Drone Dog]

hello everyone. i am not only new to this forum but to bow shooting period. never a long bow or compound. i am thinking about trying it for years. so last week i went and bought a recurve. i have been practicing in the basement all week and decided today to go to a range just to see what it is like. now i bought a take down with only 30# limbs to make it easier to work on form. i felt pretty good today hitting the eye about 2 out of 6 times from 10 yards. of course i could not resist going back to 20 yards and trying a few. now i have not shot enough to really have a consistent release or a good feel for the arrow travel. my question is this: at 20 yards about how much drop can i expect in an arrow with a 30# draw? my bow is 62" if that matters. and second about how much should it change if i went to 40# draw? i have about a 30" draw length.
another question would be about tuning. how long should i be shooting or what should i look for before i really try to tune the bow? right now i am sure my release is to inconsistent to really know what i would need. how did you guys begin to know that you needed to start the tuning?
hope these questions aren't too silly for you guys.    
Thanks
the dog

[PrarrieDog]

DD, It's not so much "how far the arrow drops". Think of it this way, When you throw a rock or baseball, You look at the target and throw to that spot. You do the same thing when you draw and release the arrow. Keep your eye on the spot and soon your eye and mind will adjust acordingly.
When you get all your arrows in 4 to 6 inches at 10 yards then take one step back and do it again. Eventually you'll be back at 20 yards.
(I only wanted to address one issue at a time)    
Prarrie Dog

[Drone Dog]

Undertsood. but at some point you have a pretty big arch to allow for. at 10 yards i feel like i can look right down the arrow and not worry about drop. at 20 yards it feels like i have to allow about 6 or more. again i know i am new to this so it is not a big deal at this point but it has to be easier at distance if that arch is less. otherwise everyone would be shooting 30# bows...right?

another question: when you say all of my arrows, how many do you shoot at one time. is that six or 12? i have never been to a shoot so i wondered if they only shoot so many at one time.

but thanks for the reply. i went down again today and it is really a blast. i can't imagine a compound being this much fun. actually may accuracy was about the same from 15 or 20 yards. i like moving back to 20 for a few arrows and then moving up to 10 yards for 6 or so. it really makes the target look bigger and gives you more confidence. darn, at 50+ in age, it is hard to see at 20 yards inside that range.

Thanks for the info
dog

[jrchambers]

most setups will have the same arc if the arow weight is adjusted acordingly.  if you want to shoot instinctivly dont bother looking at your arow,  try staring at the X and shoot group after group focus on keeping everything the same from shot to shot grip, anchor, release,  but the whole time just look at the X.  your groups will start to tighten they may not be on target but if they start to look like the same shot every time, i mean the flight, and hit. if you just keep doing that the group will migrate twards the X.  as far as flight even if they are kicking left or right as long as they are doing it the same every time you are doing good and now can start tuning.  if they are kicking up or down your nock point needs to be moved.  also your brace height can affect vertical and horizontal movement.  you can work on this by twisting your string one way or the other when your shot is the quietest and you feel the least amount of hand shock you are close. then start adjusting for your arows.  just keep shooting then shoot some more. consistancy is key.

[PrarrieDog]

Drone Dog,
Pick a spot and shoot one arrow at it. If you hit your spot, loose another arrow. I only carry 4 in my pocket quiver. Remember, the only arrow that counts is the one on your string. The last one is history and the next one doesn't even count yet. I find that if you have too many arrows, you want to shoot them all and don't concentrate on the present shot.
Prarrie Dog

[Drone Dog]

thanks for the info. i am shooting about 100 a night, usually 3 at a time. now these are all from about 10'. mostly working on form, anchor and follow thru. i am not sure how much i can tell from 10 but it does give me a feel for a certain rhythm. i can hit the 2" circle about 80% of the time right now but i keep shooting.
so why do people go to a heavier weight? keep in mind i am not thinking any time soon. but i assume in the future i will want to go to 40 or more. this has to do with better accuracy at a longer distance right?
dog

[PrarrieDog]

The accuracy comes from your form, not the bow weight. The energy to hit and penetrate an animal will come from bow weight and arrow weight. Most states have a minimum weight for hunting. IE: 440-45 for deer and 55/60 for elk. Or an energy/cast formula. You sound like you are dialing in at 10 yards, now step back and see if you maintain your accuracy. Good luck
Prarrie Dog

[Drone Dog]

really thanks for the help. it isn't that i want to argue, i am just trying to understand. simple physics would make you believe that a higher poudage would give you less arc and maybe that would make it better. but i see your point. so from what i have been reading i should also make sure i have the right weight arrows.
actually i am not really feeling good at 10 yds yet so i'll continue there for a while. i meant 10 feet is pretty good so i'll move back from there as soon as i can get something set up in the warehouse. 10' is all i can do in the basement.

hey thanks again for the info, i may come back later and ask info about my arrows. i would think that one would want to get as much right as possible while learning so that when you hit the proper form, you get the right result. otherwise you will compensate.
prarriedog, are you near Laramie?
dog

[PrarrieDog]

The arc stays almost the same because as you move up in bow weight you use heavier arrows.
140 miles north of Laramie in Casper. Pert'ner the center of the state.
Prarrie Dog

[Drone Dog]

i used to buy a lot of moulding from some guys in Laramie before the mill closed down last year. darn shame, they did a great job.
thanks for the lesson here. hey how should i store the bow every day? i was thinking i had to take the string off to remove the tension but i was reading to just hang it on two hooks by the string. is that right? and also i read about a guy who hung his for 7 days to let the string settle out or something like that.

[Doug Deese]

Being a beginner, you have done a good thing by using the 30# recurve to work on you form.  This is very important especially in the beginning because sometimes a bad habit can last a lifetime.  

Stick with the advice of the previous post and shoot very close, pay attention to everything you are doing right and wrong.  Move back and forth during practice.  Only shoot about four arrows per round and wait a minute or so (timed) between arrows to let your body relax from the last shot and to allow you time to evaluate the shot.  Shoot until you are at your best and then stop while you are ahead.  Don,t shoot until you are tired and start shooting poorly.  Shoot often but in short spells.  This will help with your mental/muscle memory training.  

Search out the Traditional "Trad" guys in your area.  People may tell you that theirs not a lot but thats not true!  The traditional archery crowd(me included) are a tight knit group of folks that stick together in smaller groups and do their on thing and dont really make a fuss.  I promise you just check around the archery shops, 3-d shoots and you will find out that they are there and in force.  You need to hook up with these people and shoot/learn from them.  It will be a blast !!

Bows and arrows are very different and inter-changable, so thats why you are not getting a solid answer on some of your questions.  Your 30# bow with light arrows could shoot the same as a 60# bow with 700 grain arrows.  My black widow will shoot 2413 aluminum at well over 200 fps.  I also have 800 grain griz stick carbons that are well under 200 fps.  Also some bows that are made with built up tips and modern limb material can stay strung forever like you were saying but a lot of bows especially the older ones will loose strength if you keep them strung over a couple days and will explode if you put a modern fast flight string on them.   There are a lot of variables in this wonderful sport and it sounds like you are now slap dab in the middle of it brother and there's no turning back. WELCOME!  

Find your local TRADS and learn everything that everyone of them know and this time next year you will have shot your first animal with a bow and arrows that you made yourself. AKbearb8

[Drone Dog]

Thanks for the advice. as i read more everyday i do understand just a bit more as well. for something so simple, it seems a bit complicated at times. and of course with nothing to compare to, i wonder if i have everything right. for instance now i wonder if i have the right weight arrows and tips. if they are too stiff or too soft. but shooting from mostly 10-18 feet, those things are probably not that critical. my bad shots are more from a bad pull by me. so i'll keep plugging away and reading. and of course just like in golf, i experiment a little each time i get the chance. as with most things experience is the key.

[gilf]

I wouldn't get too hung up on arrow weigth and spine just yet, I assume you were advised on the arrows when you purchased them so they will be there or there abouts for the sort of thing you are doing.

PrarrieDog covered what I was going to say, the arc is dependent not only on your bow weight but also on the weight of your arrows. At the sort of distance you are shooting it's not going to be an issue anyway.