"The Accuracy Factory" Question Please

[easyup]

Happy to say this DVD has been fun and very productive for me.  I am interested in what softer plate materials are used in Welch bow tuning.  On a longbow I got spot on by moving to a thin felt plate from calf hair but wondered what would you try next if that did not do it and you needed to go further toward soft?

[Winterhawk1960]

easyup,

Try some female velcro, or a thick piece of felt.

Winterhawk1960

[Winterhawk1960]

Well.......it seems that you went from felt, to begin with. If you can find some sealskin, or another type of animal hair that has thin skin.

Winterhawk1960

[waiting4fall]

Originally posted by easyup:
Happy to say this DVD has been fun and very productive for me.  I am interested in what softer plate materials are used in Welch bow tuning.  On a longbow I got spot on by moving to a thin felt plate from calf hair but wondered what would you try next if that did not do it and you needed to go further toward soft?

I'm very glad to hear you enjoyed & learned from the dvd, it was a blast to make with Rick. You email me when you can.

[email protected]

Winterhawk, hope you're doing well. Great minds think alike!  

[easyup]

I don't mind saying while I have 50 years with a recurve I have only gotten serious in the last two years when I finally realized I just don't like wheels on my bows.  Felt I was stuck with my old habits and accuracy which I was not too happy with for sake of the game(especially elk).  After reading this forum and a couple of books I thought "The Accuracy Factory" might challenge my old ways, shake things up and sure enough it did.  I studied ever video teaching segment, tried everything including 3 under, one arrow at a time, etc., and the result in about 6 weeks is my previous comfortable range shots (20yds and under) have dropped from a consistent cold shot at 9" or less to 6".  Further I am excited to add more range in a controlled manner and with accuracy.  The form work was good and in many ways similar to what I read in other places, but what hit me and I believe made the difference was tuning the bow to where I wanted to shoot as opposed to my learning to shoot where the bow was wanting to shoot.  I was ready to sell an beautiful carbon untralight Morrison longbow which I thought I could not master; now it is shooting as good or better than my long term favorite a Bob Lee Bicentennial Elite recurve and amazingly I can move back and forth without a learning curve.  Brilliant stuff.

[Bruce Martin]

Easyup, you may also need to go to a heavier point or a weaker spine to move a non-center shot longbow to the right. I took Rick's class in April (I'm one of the geezers in the video) and am slowly reworking some of my bows to shoot where I look. One thing I noticed is that it is not always easy to tune the bow to do this without some thoughtful tweaking. If a bow I have wont shoot a 3555 gold tip now where I look (with various point weight/side pad adjustments), then that bow is for sale. BTW, I did purchase a 45 lb carbon core recurve from Rick which I received 3 weeks left in our deer season. I killed 2 mega-does with that bow before the season ended because it shoots where I look and I can hold, hold, hold. You are right it is a wonderful method and it for sure works.

[Ragnarok Forge]

Whats the best place to order the video?  I am always interested in learning new form and technique methods.

[waiting4fall]

Click the link below, it will take you directly to our dvd. Enjoy!

 http://shop.dakotabows.com/product.sc;jsessionid=B2C2B917CBCBF3B023CEFA9C1337D98F.qscstrfrnt02?productId=26&categoryId=2

[turkeyslayer]

Seems to me, you fellows are trying to tune your bows to your arrows,instead of tuning your arrows to your bows.Ive always found that if a bow aint shooting where your looking its mainly because your arrow is not perfectly tuned to your bow.

[easyup]

I absolutely understand what you are saying, however the way it occurs for me (now anyway) is that I had developed a muscle memory for my bows based on good arrow flight and compensating for my bow tuning.  Now given good arrow flight I am tuning the bows (R and LB, RH and LH!) to shoot to where my eyes are comfortable.  I know it sounds weird but by sighting down the arrow with my eye like I was a gap shooter (I guess) and tuning the bow for that sight picture, has for the time being anyway, materially improved my instinctive shooting.

[Winterhawk1960]

turkeyslayer,

When you have an arrow that isn't tail wagging, or porpoising.......this is the method that Rick Welch teaches to "correct" small variances. The "fine tuning" to some degree can be accomplished by changing out the sideplate, and in my case, the strikeplate also. The arrows can be moved minimal distances, both left and right, up and down, by doing this. You would also be surprised how much you can vary your nock point (up and down) without making the arrow porpoise.

I'm not that experienced with shooting traditional bows, but I do know that this worked for me. It's a lot cheaper, in the longrun to have arrows that you are able to tune the bow to, rather than purchasing new ones.

Winterhawk1960

[Bruce Martin]

That's right, the arrows are tuned and I get them flying bare shaft to hit sraight and slightly, slightly weak with the point weight I want for a relatively heavy hunting arrow (10 gpp at least) and 25% or so FOC. That is with bare shaft. Then fletched arrows are fine tuned to shoot where I'm looking as noted above. Sounds weird but you can do this. If you step up and just start shooting groups eventually you will compensate for where the arrow is hitting, which is not as natural as having it hit where you naturally look with your consistent draw length/anchor.

[turkeyslayer]

If you tune a bare shaft to fly the way you want it to,and then start moving your side plate in or out,then you are totally changing the way that bare shaft will fly.The problem with most folks is,we tend to shoot arrows that are to stiff,we get stuck in the bare shaft tuning rut and only watch the straightness of the shaft in flight or how its sticking into the target,that is a problem causer,believe me i have fought it for years,ESPECIALLY(spelling??) on bows that are not cut past center.If you are shooting the perfect arrow ,it will wrap around the bow just right to shoot to where you naturally look,like I said,ive been fighting this problem for years,(just always had to have that perfect bare shaft).Now when i tune,i like my bareshaft  to hit 5-6" to the low right (because of bow cant)of the small dot I'm shooting at,at 20 yds,then my fletch arrows are dead on.

[Winterhawk1960]

turkeyslayer,

I understand what you are saying, and also the difference in arrow flight on bows that are and aren't cut to center. I guess it is just a different way of getting to the same place. Whether the arrow is tuned to shoot from the bow, or the bow is tuned to shoot the arrow, matters not.......as long as the broadheads shoot where you are looking.

If a person had the money and time, to really spend on finding the exact shaft, at the exact length, with the exact tip weight, for each bow that he has then I am sure that what you are saying is true. I don't have the money, but would be willing to spend the time necessary to do so.

These 35/55 Gold Tips left full length, with 50 grain brass inserts in them and 125 grain tips, shoot well from everything that I have put them through......spine wise. I might have to correct the cut to center, or not cut to center by changing out the sideplate or strikeplate. The ultimate goal for me, and which it sounds like is for you also..........is to have an arrow that will fly to where I am looking. This has worked very well for me, but I am sure that sometime in the future........I will find a situation where having to change spine will occur.

Winterhawk1960

[DTD]

Waiting4fall,
Will Rick be coming back to WV anytime in the near future for a shooting class?
DTD

[waiting4fall]

Originally posted by DTD:
Waiting4fall,
Will Rick be coming back to WV anytime in the near future for a shooting class?
DTD

That was a one time deal. I have no plans to organize another school, as I'm very busy working on my RN degree. The very best thing you could ever do for your shooting is take a flight to Rick's in Arkansas for the 2 day shooting school. Here is some info on it.Take care- Dave Mullins.

 http://www.youtube.com/user/DAKOTAENTERPRISES#p/u/11/aVeKKtdqHM8

[easyup]

OK, I am down to my last recurve tune, a Bob Lee  LH 48# @ 28, 33/55 carbon with 185 grain up front.  Here to fore this was an excellent shooter and is a Bicentennial Elite just like the photo in the Bob Lee ad at the top of this page.  Even with soft felt and the thin cork I tried I am getting a very consistent right, ~6" at 20 yds.  Do I have a spline problem? Any other changes?  Any thoughts are appreciated.

[Winterhawk1960]

Double sided carpet tape. Peel your existing plate off, and stick it to the carpet tape, trim out around the sideplate. I'd probably do at least 3 layers of the tape and see where your at. It might take more than three, but you will be moving left.

Try it.......it will work just fine.

Winterhawk1960