Considering 3 under

[RecurveHunter01]

Sorry for bringing up something that has been discussed quite a bit but I searched through old posts and still have a couple questions.  First off I shoot split and it's what I am used to but haven't flung near as many arrows as most people on this site and consider myself new to this sport. But I've been trying harder to get proficient this year and with all the extra practice I have developed a callus on my index finger from pinching the nock and it's starting to bother me after practice sessions.  So I start reading about people shooting three under and how it has improved both accuracy and release.  Which makes sense to me because if I'm pinching enough to get a callus it must be affecting my arrow flight to some degree, and I tried three under a couple times today and I am a fan of the site picture.  Here's what I'm wondering about, it appears that 3 under would be a less efficient draw because the nock is further from center and the most drawn point of the string.  Does shooting 3 under shorten draw length and cause you to lose energy/speed of the arrow all things else being equal? I don't see how it couldn't and that fact bothers me, I feel I should be trying to get the most out of my draw but I guess realistically that small difference in draw length and angle wouldn't matter as much as improved accuracy.  

More info on my set up.  I shoot a 55# @ 28" 70' kodiak hunter 60" and draw just shy of 29"  I anchor middle finger corner of the mouth and thumb knuckle back of jaw.  I tried same anchor for both styles with moving nock pt up a 4th in for 3 under and I think I lost about a 4th maybe 3rd in in draw length going to 3 under.

For some reason I want to shoot split and as silly as it sounds I think it's because of the appearance of 3 under, and the arrow not being in the center of the drawn string bothers me?  Are my thoughts justified?

[Montanawidower]

I shoot three under because I have more consistency with it.  As far as the details of draw length and such, I would say don't over think it, or worry about its looks.  Shoot both and see which "feels" better to you.  Above all its about accuracy in the end.  I will say some bows need to be tillered for it.  I have shot some bows that seem fine with both, and others (a short Bear recurve) that did not like three under.  My two cents.

[S.C. Hunter]

I guess I am odd when it comes to 3 under. I have tried it and did shoot well this way but I have shot so long split finger it just feels natural. I may give it a shot again no pun intended. I have no issue when I am with someone who shoots 3 under. Most that I have seen shoot very well using this method. That's all that matters if you like it and you shoot well.

[Jerry Jeffer]

I have shot recurve for many years and used the "split finger" draw. For the past couple years I have been shooting my long bow exclusively and I shoot 3 under with them. The couple years in between my transition to longbow from recurve, I was shooting both ways respective to each bow as I described above. I did this with out much though and never noticed any change in draw length or any accuracy issues. I just found what worked for me with the respective bows. If any thing, 3 under will move the nock closer to your eye. The sight picture between each type of bow is different for me, but I have shot enough that my brain adjusts to it with out thinking about it.

[OkKeith]

I shot split finger for more than 30 years. It's how Dad taught me and that was that.

Last year I went through a bad shooting spell just after season. Like a pitcher during the post season who seems to be just out of the strike zone on every pitch, I started tinkering with my form. Elbow higher, elbow lower, more cant, less cant, open up the stance, more square to the target.

All I succeeded in doing was TOTALLY screwing myself up. In an effort to try and get back to zero, so to speak, I went back to my original form. Just before this "reclamation" I had injured my middle finger on my draw hand. Not serious, but drawing split finger really did hurt (booboo against the nock point I guess). Just so I could keep shooting and working on my bent out of shape form, I started drawing three under.

I am not claiming it was a miraculous change, but when I finally got my mojo back I was shooting tighter groups at farther distances. I switched back to split when my banged up finger healed and the groups opened up. Three under, tighter groups, back to split; more open groups.

Now I just stick with the three under. None of my bows seem to mind. With the three fingers under draw I have fewer tendencies to bounce focus from the arrow tip to the target and back. Since I don't gap shoot, this always distracted me.

It works for some and as they say on the diet commercials "this result may not be typical, success will vary".

Try it; if it works then stick with it. DON"T change during hunting season. There was an adjustment phase. I shot low for a little while until my mental computer recalculated.

Now, when my Dad watches me shoot, he simply says, “That’s not how Fred Bear did it.” I know Dad, but I ain’t Fred Bear. No cool hat.

Good luck. Let us know how it comes out.

OkKeith

[monkeyball]

I do believe that when a person decides to go to 3 under,the main reson they do not like it is due to the fact that they did not give it a chance.

 There are + and - to each. But one style will become your favorite and that is what you should stick with.

 I shot split forever and maybe 3 or 4 years ago decided I was going to try 3 under (again)and give it a fair chance this time. And here is a little secret,buy or make a tab (if you shoot a tab) strictly for 3 under.It will keep you shooting 3 under a little longer in the trial phase.

  3 under has become so natural for me now that it is the only way I shoot. My consistency has made a huge change and my confidence has followed.

 You owe it to yourself to give it a try.

                          Good Shooting,
                                    Craig

[charlie phillips]

I shot split for years bowfishing.This year i'm bow hunting switched to 3 under and it worked for me.I've tried it bowfishing and it worked.


   TXCP

[Wapiti Bowman]

As has been said above, the main advantage to "three under" is getting the nock higher on your face and closer under your aiming eye. It should not change your draw length at all, as you can continue to anchor in the same position as shooting split finger. You're just moving the nock up by the width of your index finger.

I won't get into the "instinctive vs gap shooting" debate, but I will use "gap shooting" to explain what reducing the distance between your eye and the nock does for you.

While gravity begins to work on the arrow as soon as it is released, for some distance, the affect is negligible, and we say that the bow is shooting "flat" for that distance That's somewhere in the neighborhood of 15-18 yds, on the average. Consequently, in that yardage, the gap shooter will be holding the point of his arrow below the desired impact point the same distance that the nock is below his eye, whether it be 1.5", 2", or whatever.

As the shooting distance increases, that gap has do decrease, i.e., the arrow point has to be raised because gravity is having more affect over the longer distance to the target. At some distance, the point of the arrow is held right on the spot, and we call that the "point on" distance. This is frequently in the 30-40 yd range for a "3 under" shooter, and something like 60-70 yards for the split finger shooter, again, depending upon distance between the nock and the shooter's eye at anchor.

Since most ethical hunters are not taking shots longer than 20-30 yds max, the "3 under" gap shooter has much less room for error as his gap is so much smaller than that of the split finger shooter, given the same anchor point for both. The "instinctive" shooter also has the advantage of having to visualize a smaller range of arrow arcs than would the split finger shooter.

Don't hesitate to PM me, if you have any Qs about anything I've said.

Have Fun!

[reddogge]

I've shot split all my life and at my anchor my point on distance is 35-40 yards.  At 60-70 yards I'd need to aim a few feet over the target.  I tried 3 under and am getting arrows low left from every bow I own and my point on is only 20 yards.

I see no reason to switch as apparently I'm getting the same trajectory as most 3 under shooters.

[Wapiti Bowman]

rd said:

 

I've shot split all my life and at my anchor my point on distance is 35-40 yards.

Yes. If you can get your anchor point very high on your face, like all the pix you see of the late Fred Bear, your point on distance will be in the range you've described. For those who, for whatever reason, cannot get their anchor high up on their face, and anchor at the corner of their mouth, going to three under will help to move that nock higher on their face and decrease their point on range to something similar to yours.

Your point is well taken, though, and is just another example of what a high anchor can do for you, whether shooting split finger or three under.

It's all Fun Though!

[LongStick64]

3 Under for me works very well. I feel more solid at anchor and I'm not putting any pressure on the nock with my top finger so I'm getting better flight.

[mambashooter]

It is about feel,feel, feel. How does it feel? Do what feels the best with the best results is my answer.Simple as that..so simple.