Bare shaft questions

[Curvebo]

I have read a few different publications and threads on bareshafting that seem to contradict themselves. One says that as long as the bare shaft is grouping well with fletched shafts it does not matter if the bare shaft is hitting nock up/down/left/right. But another says that you should be able to paper tune a bare shaft to a perfect bullet hole and that the bare shaft should fly perfectly like a fletched shaft.

Which is correct? Both?

I can't get a bareshaft to fly perfectly, but it hits along with my fletch shafts. I shoot GT traditional 5575 arrows with 225 grains up front on a 31.5" arrow out of a 53# @29.5" bow. I am fairly new to recurve shooting, so is it possible my release is to blame? I feel like I get good flight out of fletched arrows, but I am only accurate out to 15 yards right now.

Any help is appreciated.

[McDave]

If I were you, I wouldn't worry about paper tuning at this stage of the game.  Paper tuning is used to further refine arrow flight after bare shaft tuning.

On the other hand, I would continue to work on bare shaft tuning until I could get my shafts to fly straight, maybe a little nock high, but no significant nock right or left.

One of the problems you can get in bare shaft tuning is a false reading because the shaft is recoiling off the shelf or strike plate.

It will recoil off the shelf and give you a false nock high if your nocking point is too low.  So it is recommended that you start with a higher nocking point than you expect to need (maybe 5/8 for split fingers and 7/8 for 3 under) and work your way down.

It will recoil off the strike plate and give you a false nock left if the arrow is too stiff, which you can sometimes hear when you shoot the bow and the arrow shaft smacks the riser.

Your release can affect your bare shaft results, but generally you know when you have a bad release, and you can just ignore that shot.

What kind of a bare shaft reading are you getting?

[Curvebo]

Thanks McDave.
I am a leftie and I have been getting a nock high with my bare shaft arrows. I have moved the nock around from 7/8 down to even and still get a nock high. That's why I feel like it might be my release? I shoot split by the way and I haven't tried shooting thru paper at all since I'm new to the game.

[Wapiti Bowman]

I have to agree with McD. Don't be too concerned about your nock high if your bare shafts are grouping right with your fletched shafts. Mine do the same. However, I do keep 6 bare shafts made up at all times so that I can periodically check for any changes.

As for paper tuning, I've seen wheelie bow shooters using a release who couldn't get a 'bullet' hole; but, another shooter using the same bow, arrows, and release aid was able to repeatedly get a bullet hole.

So, getting a bullet hole with bare shafts, off the shelf and a finger release, requires a very, very smooth release, IMHO. Something to strive for, by all means, but not something to cause a great deal of concern.  

[McDave]

As a leftie, you would get a false nock right rather than a false nock left if your bare shaft were way too stiff, but otherwise my post would hold.

Having your string elbow too high can cause you to press down on the nock at full draw with your index finger, when you're shooting split fingers.  This causes a bend in the shaft, that rebounds up when the arrow is shot, which can give you a false nock high.  You should try to keep your string forearm in line with the arrow, or just slightly elevated, no more than 5 degrees or so.

If this doesn't solve your problem, then just set your nock at 1/2" and enjoy shooting your bow.  It can't be that far off at that nock height.

And think of some excuse to get away and join us at Rod Jenkins shooting school in Idaho on June 21.  He'll straighten you out.

[Curvebo]

Thanks McDave and Wapiti. I'm not shooting thru paper at all (nowhere near that advanced). I don't think my elbow is too high but if I knew how to post a picture I would add one of me at anchor. Anyone know how to do that?

I'd love to head out to Idaho for some shooting school. The problem is convincing the wife.  

[Carbon Jack]

This is an oldish thread but I wanted to make one comment about bare shaft tuning.

Don't bother doing it.

We don't shoot bare arrows for score or for game. To tune a bow to a bare shaft is to waste time when you should be tuning a feathered shaft (like you will be shooting) setup with your best point weight and overall length.

Fletching on an arrow has an effect the instant you loose the arrow and while it's still on the string. This is not the case on a bare shaft. Of course you are going to have contradictory results when trying to evaluate bare shaft results with feathered shaft results.

So dispense with the bare shaft nonsense and simply watch your own feathered shafts as they leave the bow. Having a pal stand behind you to watch helps too.

Nock point can be set at .500 about the shelf and you can tweak it up or down a tad to fix arrow kick or porpoising. Side to side waggle can only be evaluated using a feathered shaft if you are a finger shooter.

Compound release shooters might gain some insight by paper tuning with bare shafts, but traditional finger shooters are better served observing their feathered finger releases and correcting from there.

I have more of a technical target archery background and shoot indoor competition year round along with 3D. I also hunt deer. I see no difference between target shooting and deer shooting when traditional shooting technique is used.

I shoot the 300, and 450 indoor rounds just like I shoot 3D or fat deer - that is with a canted bow and a split finger hold. The only thing I change is my target point for a broadhead of the same weight. I use the same arrow and feather combo. Same arrow length and insert. All I change is the point.

This simplifies everything and I do not have to relearn a different projectile or trajectory.

Jack

[hvyhitter]

Curvebo....try this:  http://www.bowmaker.net/tuning.htm