Video of my form, any suggestions?

[Kaninmaskwa]

Okay I hope you have a strong stomach this ain't pretty, hopefully my form isn't too bad though lol.
Now I've shot 5 angles of different rounds.
This is basically the way I've modified my form and before I totally groove it in I need to know if I'm on the right track.
I am aware that some times I should hold my bow a fraction longer before lowering after the shot. Some of the shots were done to the target lower then waist high so I'm tilting forward but I think maybe my T profile is a bit forward.
In order to try and get my rear elbow forearm and arrow in alignment I line up combining the rotational draw technique with moving in for sighting, at least that's what I'm trying. I've found that if I don't move it to my anchor my elbow and forearm would be at about 5:00 position but maybe I'm heading down the wrong path with the way I'm doing it.
My attire is for the sole purpose of you being able to clearly see what I'm doing.     :rolleyes:  
Thanks for all your feedback I'm not sure how to shorten the links.
Cheers
Shawnee

Vid 1 front  view

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OO8O5poch48&feature=youtube_gdata_player  

Vid2 profile view


  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0T40nmkUns&feature=youtube_gdata_player  

Vid3 1/4 front view


  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NO12HQdIt4&feature=youtube_gdata_player  

Vid4 rear 1/4 above angle

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkFxZcfW5ZE&feature=youtube_gdata_player  

Vid5 another forward video slightly different angle

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7-oDM-3n9k&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[moebow]

Shawnee,  You are looking very good to my eye in these videos.  You have really good shoulder to bow arm alignment at full draw and good string arm to arrow alignment.  I'll make some suggestions here in a moment but there is no reason to not start grooving this in as you say.

These suggestions are really based on what I posted in my videos "rotational draw technique" and "release tips."  So you may want to review those to see visual confirmation of what I try to say here.  Again, I emphasize that these are suggestions only and that you have to decide if you like them or if they work for you.

If you watch your string wrist in your videos, when you start to draw, you have a tendency to let your hand angle out from a line through your forearm. Try to keep your hand in  line with, or better inside, the line of the forearm. The arrow can point to the left of the target at the start of the draw and will come around as you reach anchor.  Holding the arrow and hand in line with the target causes you to increase tension in the forearm that really isn't needed.

Now watch your drawing elbow's movement as you draw.  You start high and the elbow comes around and slightly down which IS GOOD!  However at the very end of the draw, you use your elbow to raise your string hand to your anchor.  See how it comes sharply up at the end of the draw?  I recommend that you try to not lift the elbow to drag your string hand to anchor but simply lift your hand to your references and leave the elbow alone.  That little lift of the elbow will tend to disconnect you from the back and put you back into the top of the shoulder.

I understand clearly what you are saying about "moving in for sighting." BUT... one theory is that if you can "freeze" your spine and head position in the correct position before you start to draw, you will have a consistent frame of reference to structure the rest of your movement around.  The idea is to bring the structure of your shot TO you rather than going to get it.  I believe that you will find that you can still get the alignment you are concerned about without the head movement.  Set your head position at the start of the draw and try not to let it move until the shot is over and the arrow is in the target.

As I say, you REALLY are looking good!  The above suggestions may or may not help you and are relatively minor concerns.  However if you try them, I believe that they will help.

Let us know how it is going from time to time.

[flat-lander]

You are grabbing the bow when you release the arrow.

[Kaninmaskwa]

Thanks for the feedback.
Moebow I see now what you are saying. I'm going to try and implement some modifications to adress those items you pointed out and see how I go.
Flat-lander
I see what you are saying. I've been trying to virtually not hold the grip at all with my fingers just touching on the back of the grip, as the bow jumps forward on release I let it jump into my relaxed fingers and try only apply enough resistance to stop the bow from jumping clear of my hand. I think I will video my bowhand close and shoot 30 or so arrows and call the shot through paper. Then anytime one tears I will compare my cowhand to see if it's the culprit. I very well maybe grabbing sometimes and influencing the shot. So thanks for that I'll pay attention to that too.

I did a bad thing. Before I got the feedback I went shooting.
First time to shoot targets since I got this bow ( I've only had it for less then a week and have only been shooting blind bale).
Well I should have just been concentrating on my form but no I decided to start aiming at the target because everything was feeling good. Some good shots but then I started making adjustments because my arrows were left right low high etc.
Well back to blank/blind bale to corect my form groove it with 800 or so repeated shots then work on my aim.
I'm dying to get back out in the bush and put this new bow to use.
I just won't attempt to take an animals life unless I'm sure I can hit my mark.
I'll let you know how I go.
Cheers

[moebow]

I went back and watched my videos again to see what you were seeing regarding the elbow lift.  I believe that you were seeing the apparent lift of the elbow I show, but also watch the relative angle of the forearm as it lifts to the anchor position.  That angle remains relatively the same.  Now watch your video and see the change in the relative angle of your forearm as you lift the elbow from the shoulder.  The lift is done by rotating the humerus around its longitudinal axis, not by using it as a lever that is about a foot long.  Does that make sense?  If not, let me know and I'll try a different explanation.  This is another of those things that is pretty easy to explain and implement in person and very difficult with the written word.

Everybody wants to "hit something!"  It is in our nature to do that.  And it seems that everyone needs to discover for themselves that trying to hit something too soon is often a frustrating event and usually sets you back at least a little.
Don't know if you are familiar with the old US TV series Kung Fu but; " Patience grasshopper, when you can walk on the rice paper without  leaving a trace..."  Or something to that effect.  

[Kaninmaskwa]

Thane again Moebow,
I hadn't questioned your elbow raising in your video but I'm glad you brought it up because I did notice in MB 3 Rod Jenkins lifts his. Now I see though what you are saying regards how it is lifted vs how I was.

Question?
When I'm testing through paper at 6' away. Is the arrow stable enough to not only be putting a bullet hole through but also to use for aiming when the time is right?
In other words. Once I'm consistently shooting bullet holes  everytime and the form is grooved into my muscle memory can I then focus on a spot on the paper tuner and try to hit that making sure flight is still perfect? Would that help with aiming or is 6' too close and cause me to engraine bad techniques? I should say I'm just trying to ensure I'm not left right at any yardage with form so I can let my mind calculate for distance while I just focus on the spot.
Cheers
Shawnee

[moebow]

When you are shooting fairly consistent groups is when you are ready to shoot at a target.  Do not confuse paper TUNING with shooting groups.  Tuning is really just for making sure your arrows are matched to your bow and have little to nothing to do with targets.  When you are shooting relatively good groups on a blank target is the time to start with "hitting the target."  Put a blue masking tape vertical line on your blank bale and slowly move out in distance.  As you "groove in" by keeping the arrows + or - 1/2 inch you are ready to start shooting at a target at that range.  6 feet is not too close and work out gradually.

[njloco]

In the 1/4 above angle, maybe you were getting tired, but to me, it doesn't look like you are getting your shoulder and elbow back all the way, in other words it looks like you are short drawing, this may be due to you bringing your head  and face to the string instead of bringing the string to your anchor point and maintaining good stature.

I do this also, on occasion and have found that if I take a fairly deep breath upon drawing this helps to prevent me from doing it.

Your form looks very good and I think you are almost there, I would still maintain the blank bale shooting so it totally gets ingrained and you don't have to think about it at all.

Good luck.

[Friend]

Someone please shoot me if I am wrong here.

At anchor the drawing upper arm, rhomboids, right scapula position become one unit. The string hand and drawing forearm should be as relaxed as possible. While increasing tension the unit should fluidly flow together thru release and follow through.

Appeared to me that there was some extra tension in string hand and forearm.

Appeared to me that the rearward arm movement was nice, however the right scapula didn't flow rotationally with it.