over thinking my shot

[RobinHood1389]

So I am like 99% sure I am over thinking with every shot. I focus on anchor, fail to focus on target. I focus on target, fail to focus on anchor (or other parts of form).
I shoot with all compound shooters and am looking like all I'm gonna do is injure an animal.
Well anyway, tomorrow (monday), I am getting my issue of Fred Asbell's Instinctive Shooting!
I really hope reading this helps my form so I can really start improve.

So the point of this story....For those of you who have read his books....Whats your inputs?

[McDave]

I have enjoyed and learned a lot from reading Fred's books and attending his class at Black Widow.  Fred, like every other good instructor I've ever met, believes that a good solid foundation is absolutely necessary before you can become accurate.  Maybe even moreso than other instructors, in that he believes that you need to focus 100% of your attention on the mark you want to hit when you shoot instinctively. The only way you can do that is to have rock-solid form, which includes alignment, anchor, drawing, and followthrough, that you have honed to the point that you can forget it and focus on the mark you want to hit.  If you're focusing on your anchor or whatever, it just means you haven't practiced enough that you have reached the point that you can forget it yet.  Don't rush it, hone your form first and then work on accuracy or instinctive shooting.  If you were to attend Fred's class, you would spend several days in front of a blank bale working on each element of your form until he was satisfied that you got it.  He would lecture about instinctive shooting in the class, but aside from fun times in between sessions, there wouldn't be much hands-on practice of instinctive shooting in the class.

It can be discouraging to shoot regularly with compound sight shooters.  We will never be as accurate as the good compound shooters, but that doesn't mean that we can't take game cleanly.  It just means that we have to develop sufficient accuracy to get an arrow into the vitals at 15-20 yards, and then somehow manage to get that close to the animal we want to shoot.

I don't think anyone would disagree with Fred's discussion of the "instinctive" part of instinctive shooting.  On the other hand, his body position is pretty unique, and many people who like to shoot instinctively will still choose to take a more conventional stance.

[JINKSTER]

Originally posted by RobinHood1389:
So I am like 99% sure I am over thinking with every shot. I focus on anchor, fail to focus on target. I focus on target, fail to focus on anchor (or other parts of form).
I shoot with all compound shooters and am looking like all I'm gonna do is injure an animal.
Well anyway, tomorrow (monday), I am getting my issue of Fred Asbell's Instinctive Shooting!
I really hope reading this helps my form so I can really start improve.

So the point of this story....For those of you who have read his books....Whats your inputs?

I dunno squat about mr asbell but i think i can help you as follows..

Instead of letting your focus jump around between form, anchor and aiming?..compile yourself a mental checklist..sit down and write it out step-by-step..mine with a trad bow goes something like this..

1. Check stance and shoulder alignment too target..
2. Make sure arrow is in proper nock position..
3. Check grip position
4. begin draw
5. align arrow out of perihial while completing draw
6. anchor
7. Finalize sight picture
8. Execute clean release.

and practice that until you dont hafta think it through everytime..and muscle memory will do the job for you as your form/draw/release will become natural act..get to that point?..and then your mind will be free to place 110% focus and concentration on the target and consistant accuracy will soon follow.

How much/often you practice will dictate how quickly/slowly your skills will develope...but do the above and they will develope.

Not much of a reader but i've had some great mentors..just passing it on and hope that helps in some small way..L8R, Bill.  

[zetabow]

It's ok to do all that thinking but there is a time and a place for it.

Work out all these things at the Bale and pratice sessions, when you get to serious shooting trust what you learnt drop all that thinking, only focus on the feel of the shot and where you want the arrow to end up.

You have to go back to Bale and practice sessions on a regular basis, keep renforcing your sequence so you can effectively 'let go' and shoot your full potential without overthinking.

I ALWAYS start my shooting off with 10min bale just to groove the shot feeling, if during practice I feel I'm not in total control I'll either go back to the bale for 5min or stop shooting for a little while.

[RobinHood1389]

Thanks for the help guys. Sadly I practice almost daily. What I feel I have done is develop poor muscle memory. Looks like I need press delete and start new again.

[McDave]

Our mind plays tricks on us when we move from learning form in front of a blank bale to shooting at targets further away where we are trying to hit a particular mark.

In addition to Fred's material, you might want to check out Rod Jenkins' section of Masters of the Barebow 3, where he discusses the bridge program.  The "bridge" is a way to maintain what you have learned about form in front of a blank bale when you move away and begin shooting at marks you are trying to hit.

At least, that's how I'm translating your comment about poor muscle memory.

[NBK]

You'd be well served to listen to the above advice by McDave and Zetabow.  I will add a couple of minor suggestions that I've tripped over in my own journey.  Be careful with Asbell's swingdraw because once you hit anchor,the arrow is gone, (not inherently bad), but for me it led to short-drawing the bow and not really feeling my anchor.  Some do this extremely well, but they always anchor. Also, not to take away quality time with friends, but you shooting with the wheel guys has to put some pressure on you.  After your shot is grooved in on the bale, some stumpshooting with one arrow will show you that you're not nearly as off as you think.

[RobinHood1389]

Well I read Asbell's book. Corrected alot of my form from it. And altered his "guidelines" (I don't like the idea of rules....everybody is different). What I have found is that the swing arm method does work best for me. Altered...I swing, anchor, pause to verify anchor (allowing my bow arm to compensate on target), then release. I am grouping well again! Still off target a tad, but at least its consistent once again!
But what I am still thinking about is a "clicker." I have read a few threads on clickers and think it could really benefit me.
NBK...you are 100% right about pressure with shooting with the wheel bow guys. There pinpoint accuracy does leave a little jealousy. But they will never know the fun joys of stump shooting with those things. Besides....I am determined to prove to my friends that s stick and string can keep up.

p.s. I know there shouldn't be anything to prove....but oh well.

[njloco]

Don't get me wrong here, but I was thinking about buying a recurve at one of the shoot here in NJ, so I took the bow to the nearest target and started shooting a little, there were also two wheelie guys there and everyone couldn't believe it when I out shot them at 30 yds., It was pretty funny as they kept looking at their bows and at the one I was trying out. i didn't buy the bow because I didn't like the grip.

Just keep practicing and and definitely do bale work as that will keep you from developing bad habits in the first place. Don't expect too much too soon and don't try and compete against your wheelie friends, at least not yet !

P.S. I saw one of my friends out shoot a whole bunch of wheelie's at a shoot, they were shooting at targets from 40 yds out to 70 yds. He was shooting a 37# Wing recurve, it was beautiful.

[zetabow]

Originally posted by njloco:


P.S. I saw one of my friends out shoot a whole bunch of wheelie's at a shoot, they were shooting at targets from 40 yds out to 70 yds. He was shooting a 37# Wing recurve, it was beautiful.

Just doesn't happen here, last big tourney I did 100 x 2 arrow shot 3D (60y max all same stakes for everybody)I won my unsighted Rec Div by 350 points, 100 points up of Barebow and Freestyle, yet I still didn't get within 100 points of top Wheelies

[njloco]

Zeta, the informal shoot was at the warm up line and the guy that out shot them was a Nat'l and world champion distance shooter, I have done it myself many, many years ago at an informal shoot, and they were besides themselves. I won a dinner out for my wife and I at a very nice restaurant.

[zetabow]

Originally posted by njloco:
 the guy that out shot them was a Nat'l and world champion distance shooter

So am I (2 X World & 1 X European Field & 3D) but dont get anwhere near the top Wheelie guys maybe bottom 5-6 guys I outshoot but that's it.

[njloco]

It is MY opinion that if a guy or gal can out shoot a half way decent wheelie shooter using trad gear, they have got it together !

[RobinHood1389]

Update of my progress (focus on the target not the form.....form is coming naturally again).

Went to the range with the wheelie friends. Did well. Decided it was time for some food.

I stabbed a pen vertically in the target and said who ever gets the closest gets a beer, on me. I was second to last to shoot. I NICKED THE PEN!! Just barely missed it! CLIPPED IT!!

Excited as can be....Friend Willy draws his Bear compound and the pen exploded!

I was proud to clip that pen at 20 yrds with a wood bow and a wood arrow.

[Greg Dearth]

I would suggest that you give Rod Jenkins a call and talk with him about your shooting issues. Rod conducts a shooting clinic and I know he will help you. Yes, the bail trainning will help in addressing your shooting problems and Rod can explain that in great detail. Give him a call and good luck in your shooting.

[Terry Green]

I haven't read any of the posts....but here's my 2cents....

You need to get 'grooved in'....you need to do some bale work and NOT focus on the target.  Focus on the draw to anchor-connecting to anchor-proper alignment-pulling through anchor-letting go of the string.

This takes time to do.  Weeks to get honed in and concentrate only on the proper ACT of shooting, aiming can come later. Once you 'learn the shot'...you can then 'learn to shoot'.  You can then focus on aiming with your conscious mind, and your subconscious will run the shot.

Stay after it!!!

[chuckbow]

i agree 100 %