Form Help

[Eagle48]

Looking for some assistance here.  From what I can see, I'm short drawing a little and not getting aligned perfectly.  The problem is that I'm not real sure what I can do to fix it if I continue to anchor the way I am in the video (cock vane to nose tip, middle finger to corner of mouth and space between thumb and index finger on the point of my jaw).

Shooting wise, I've only been doing this for a couple weeks.  I've had the bow for several years, but never gotten serious with my shooting until now.  Accuracy wise, things are getting better now that I've gotten a consistent anchor, but I'd like to get aligned correctly and hear what you all think.

 

Bow is 64" 50@28.  I thought I had a 29" DL, but from the video it looks closer to a 27.5-28" (arrows are 29" to BOP), part of the reason I feel I'm short drawing to some extent.

[skilonbw]

I think you are short drawing due to you not using your rhomboids but more your arm for drawing. We all have a different anchor that works. I was once having a discussion with a shooter at a local shop as to where he anchored since I was using the corner of the mouth but no consistent accuracy. The other shooter pointed out that a soft tissue anchor can change each time we go to anchor so he used his knuckle of his thumb at the hinge of the jaw which was more consistent. I tried it for myself and found that gave me consistent accuracy.

[moebow]

Eagle,

Overall considering that you have only been shooting a short while; pretty darn good!  We will need a "face on" view too if you can do one.

Your observation about the string arm alignment is correct but not for the reason you suggest.  If you watch your string hand when you release, you can see it pop out from your face.  That tells me that you are not getting fully transferred into your back.  Which in turn keeps your elbow outside the arrow line.  When you reach full draw and before you release, think about pressing the string shoulder and elbow back behind you.  Press back, press back, then release.  This "press" is in the direction of another archer standing on the shooting line behind you  and NOT back in the direction of the arrow.  Another way to think about it is, "stick my chest out a little."

One of the reasons "us coaches" don't care for the term anchor is that many folks hear or read about "feather on the nose", "finger here", "knuckle there" and so on.  This is fine ONCE you have your draw correct but they become REFERENCES only.  Too many try to use those references to conform their bodies around.  Rather than drawing to correct alignment and THEN setting the facial references.  Said another way, the references are a result of the draw, NOT a target for the draw.

Again, would like to have a video from the front, there are other things that can affect overall alignment that can be seen better that way.

Good start!!

Arne

[Eagle48]

Arne, in reference to the anchors, that makes complete sense.

I've given the pulling the shoulder blades together (which is what I think you are referring to) a try, but it seems to put the string into my face and is overall awkward.  If that's what it takes, then I'll learn to love it and it won't feel awkward after a while, but at the moment, it feels odd.

Here's a side view from a few days prior to the first one.

 

[moebow]

Really not bad at all, overall, you are doing well.

NO!  We DO NOT "pull the shoulder blades together."  That is not good technique.  I'm suggesting just pulling your string shoulder/elbow back; your bow side shoulder does not move.  There is a big difference!  Kind of a final "press" at full draw before release.

I posted some videos on You Tube -- if you are interested that might help.  Search for "TheMoebow1."

Arne

[Eagle48]

I've watched all of your videos, and that was certainly a major help in getting started.  I'll give the elbow "press" a try this afternoon and have the wife video for me.

[NBK]

Only a few weeks?   Hey man, looking pretty darn good for only shooting a short while.  Keep it up.

[Eagle48]

Arne, I gave the press back a try yesterday afternoon and felt like I had too much tension in my back/shoulder to make much happen; actually started cramping up. One thing that seemed to work was going to an even or slightly closed stance instead of the open stance I originally was using. Doing that made me put my chest out more and my shooting improved immediately. Any thoughts?

[Eagle48]

Here's a link to this morning.  Accuracy was better again, and it appears as though draw length has improved with the opening of my chest.  Anchor has changed slightly but still essentially the same.

 

[moebow]

Of course I have thoughts!!   :D    :D    :D    :D

The "press" I'm talking about is more of a thought of the direction you want the elbow and shoulder to go.  There is no way you should be getting a cramp feeling.  Try this,  when you get to full draw and are ready to shoot, just think about the direction you want the elbow/shoulder to go and release.

Part of this thought is that you want your string hand to move straight back on your face along your cheek/jaw and not pop down like yours is right now.

Again I will say, you are VERY close.  Here is a caution though.  You (any of us) CANNOT judge how well something works from one or two practices.  Do not try something once and then change right away because you don't think it works.  It takes 21 practice sessions to change a habit or to get something really learned.  This is not MY estimate but proven over time by those that study this stuff.

Accuracy is NOT your prime concern now.  Just  groups.  If you can get the arrows grouping without aiming at a bull's eye,  hitting something becomes easy.  If you insist on testing yourself by shooting at a target, your progress will be slow at best.  I tell my students that IF they will just shoot at something that catches their arrows and really learn the shot that they will be hitting targets in 6 to 8 months.  BUT IF they need to put a target up and only judge their progress by how good a score they get, they MIGHT be hitting consistently in 2 years (but probably not.)

One last thing.  A closed stance is when you have your target side foot placed ahead of your back foot.  A square stance is then a line across your toes points directly at the target.  An open stance has your target side foot behind your rear foot.  In archery, a closed stance is not recommended simply because it makes you twist in the wrong direction and you loose core strength.  If an open stance isn't working (this stance is recommended)  try not to go farther than a square stance.  Your shoulders should be at least pointing a the target and ideally a line from your string shoulder to your bow shoulder to your bow wrist will cross the arrow line and point to the right of the target.

This stuff is pretty easy in person and so hard by typed words.  Don't get discouraged BUT DO give each change a fair trial (21 practices).  That is the only way to give the  technique AND YOU a fighting chance to "get it."

Arne

[moebow]

Eagle,

RangerB (Jimmy Blackmon) has just posted a back tension video that may help.  Check it out "Tip of the day - Finding your back,"

Arne

[Eagle48]

Arne, thanks again.  I'm shooting instinctively and have been shooting at a blank "target" just concentrating on a spot and grouping arrows.  I should probably just be blank bailing until I get consistent.  In one practice session at 15 yards I'll shoot a 2" group, and then the next I'll shoot a 10" group, consistency is not my strong suit at the moment.  Thanks for all the help, I'll keep working on everything and try to get some more videos up in a month or so.

[Eagle48]

Just an update here.  Turns out I live about 30 minutes from Rod Jenkins.  I'm headed to him for some instruction on Feb. 2nd.  I was wanting someone close to me that was a great coach, and it turns out I have one of the best if not the best in the country very close.  Couldn't be much better.

[moebow]

Yep!! Rod is the best!!  Please update us after you've seen Rod.  Would like to know what you find out.

Arne

[Eagle48]

Had my first session with Rod on Saturday.  Learned a great deal and have a lot of work to do.  I use my back a little, but really had no idea how to fire the rhomboids and I'm still just getting to where I can make them fire on command, so a long way to go there.  Also had a major issue with getting shoulders alighned, to the point that I had a 28-28.5" draw when I got there, and left with a 30.25-30.5" draw.  Now I don't have any arrows long enough, but that's part of it.  I go back for my second lesson on March 9th, so right now I'm blank baling for the next month and a week to get the proper sequence ingrained.  I think I'm going to be sick of that stuff my then, LOL.

[Eagle48]

Updated Form Video after a week of blind bailing, one month of blind/blank bailing to go.

 

[moebow]

Nice improvements!  Just try to get that string hand moving straight back with contact on your cheek/jaw.  Your "recoil" of the hand should be a straight line back and not an arc out and around to your shoulder.

Arne

[Eagle48]

Understood, I feel that's the one area I'm struggling with the most. I'll be adding in additional bale work to work that, at the moment I can't pinpoint exactly what's causing it.