Bicep involvement?

[longbow fanatic 1]

I'm looking for some advice on form. I've noticed that as I'm shooting, I noticed my string hand bicep is more involved than it should be. My string hand forearm feels relaxed and I can feel myself transfer the weight of the bow to good bone on bone alignment with good strong rhomboid involvement when I pull the bow to full draw. The problem seems to be that as I'm pulling through the shot or one I get the bow fully back, my bicep is too involved. Can anyone explain this or has anyone experience this?

I know my alignment is good because I'm not experiencing left or right arrows.

Thanks,

Dennis

[moebow]

Dennis,

Being aware of it is most of the battle.  There are a couple things to try to eliminate the biceps.

First, as I show in the "release tips" video, keep that string wrist OUT, NOT in!!  This simple thing will help to take the biceps out of the shot.

Second, think of your string elbow as a LOOSE HINGE.  As soon as you apply biceps, the string elbow will move outside the arrow line -- every time!

If you can learn to draw by levering only the upper string arm (humerus) around your spine, the elbow being relaxed will allow the relaxed forearm to maintain arrow alignment.  It is not something you do, it is something that happens.

When I do this, as I get to full draw, it FEELS as though I am leaning against a wall with the string side of my back.  Now, as you go through expansion/release, you just lean on the wall harder as you relax the finger hook.

That release is done with the string shoulder moving back (scapula/shoulder) NOT the biceps.

MOVE THE BONES, not the muscles.

Sure wish we were closer easier to show and do than to "tell."

Arne

[longbow fanatic 1]

Thanks, Arne. I'm going to see if we can put together a group of archers to get you here. I'll send you a PM.

[mgf]

The problem I've had is that when I let my string side elbow be a "lose hinge" my string hand comes away from my anchor...enter the bicep.

It's not the bicep causing my elbow to go forward but my forward elbow necessitating the bicep to get my string hand to anchor.

Either way, it's an alignment issue.

Speaking of my own experience, two things come to mind here and they're closely related. One posture...not being upright and expanded in the shoulders and chest.

The other is the choice of anchor itself. For example, I can not use a corner of the mouth anchor and get my bow arm, shoulders and string arm aligned. I have to hunch forward or go to  more open posture leaving me out of alignment.

I should add that I wear glasses so if I don't turn my head toward the target enough, I can't see the target with my right eye through the lens. Once I turn my face more toward the target the corner of my mouth is just out of bounds...bicep involvement and forward string elbow. It's the only way to get there.

At one point I actually found that I was shooting with my left eye (right handed and right eye dominant) because all my right eye could see was my nose and the frame of my glasses.

I've gone through about a million different gyrations of this because I can actually shoot sort of ok with the forward elbow because that corner of the mouth anchor is so solid and repeatable for aiming.

In the end I just settle on an anchor a little further back on my face...cheek bone and jaw bone with the string against my forehead.

As long as I keep my head up (in the center of my body) it allows for a nice full comfortable draw.

[tracker12]

After getting 2' plus of snow over the weekend yesterday turned into a beautiful day with temps at 50 degrees.  I got some quality time on my 3D target.  I can instantly tell when I use the back and keep the arm out of the shot.  Arrow flight is so much better along with impacts closer to where I am aiming.  I find that it is easier to keep the forearm relaxed with a deeper hook.

[longbow fanatic 1]

Hi Mike,

Thanks for your thoughts on this. I stand upright (exactly like most compound shooters) when I shoot my longbow, so that's not my issue. Maybe I'll try anchoring a bit more back.

[McDave]

I find that if I play around with my anchor, I can find a sweet spot where it seems that I could hold the arrow at full draw with my back muscles all day if I wanted to.  Look for that spot.

[Sirius Black]

I too, have this issue going on now. I believe in what Arne teaches about letting your anchor be the result of your draw, and not the destination of it. So I'm drawing/anchoring slightly further back, and it seems to be helping. My pulled bicep came from shooting a heavier bow and getting tired. I was then short drawing the bow and pulled the muscle. You've all given good info that I too will follow. I'm wearing a Copper Fit elbow sleeve that's helping me get back to where I was. Arne, when is 'Bow Arm part 2 coming out?

[Terry Green]

Yes...the anchor is not a destination....

Its an evolution to execution.

Look again at the closed door diagram in the Clock thread....and remember, straight or canted bow or body should have NO bearing as form is from the waist up, you can lean forward or back or rotate your body or lay on your back and take the 'Magic T' with you....and, none of that will shorten your draw length.

I cover a lot of this in The Bowhunters of TradGang DVD

[longbow fanatic 1]

Thanks everyone. I appreciate your insights greatly!

[moebow]

Eric,

Been thinking about part 2 since part 1.  Probably in late March or early April.  Right now the club is too busy to get clear videoing time, plus, I can be pretty lazy these days :>))

Arne

[mgf]

Just to clarify The "hunch" I mentioned was meant to describe misalignment/lack of expansion of the shoulders and string arm.

Bottom line, I can't seem to use a corner of the mouth anchor and get that "Magic-T" alignment.

I think McDave mentions an important point. Good alignment minimizes the muscle work required to hold.

[longbow fanatic 1]

I think I figured out my problem with the bicep. It's a high string hand elbow. This causes an increase in forearm and bicep tension. Now I need to figure out how to anchor with a level string hand elbow to get better alignment.

[Terry Green]

Yes...the Magic T IS proper alignment....and that also means proper back tension and bone on bone alignment....all of which is proper form and an eliminator of MULTIPLE problems with inaccuracy.

[longbow fanatic 1]

Thx, Terry.

[Terry Green]

You are welcome!

Nice buck...love the spread on that one!

[longbow fanatic 1]

Thanks, brotha! It's a great story probably better reserved for a PM because we are in the shooters forum.